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adifferentname
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31 Aug 2016, 10:13 am

AspE wrote:
At the risk of being called a silly acronym, denying white privilege is racism.


If you don't want to be called a silly acronym, don't repeat their dogma. Criticising ideological concepts on the basis of their obvious flaws is not racism.



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31 Aug 2016, 10:17 am

That does mean they have a special privilage, it means they have at least racist tendencies or are full blown racists.


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31 Aug 2016, 10:20 am

AspE wrote:
At the risk of being called a silly acronym, denying white privilege is racism. Experiments have been done submitting job applications with white names and black names, with equal qualifications. The applications with black names are far less likely to get a call.
Also check this s**t out:


These people don't think they are racist either, but the very different reaction to a white guy stealing a bike vs. a black one says it all.

So even if I don't believe blacks are inferior, I also have to accept that I get special privileges because I'm white, even when this is not my experience, or I'm still a racist? No, that is not how racism works.

You know what I like about the video? There is a black woman who admits that she also assumed he wasn't stealing the bike, and that it was based on his race. "Young white men don't usually carry burglary tools." This is f*****g gold. She was the only one in the video who admitted to judging the guy based on his race, yet still it's the white people who are labeled racist, even when they said his color had nothing to do with it. Amazing. I wonder if that means that the experimenters were biased in favor of black people?

To be honest, I agree with the black woman. Young black males are insanely more likely to commit crimes than young white males, and I assume she knows this from firsthand experience. Also, they say they were dressed the same, but the black guy had on baggy pants and a lopsided hat, whereas the white guy simply had a backwards baseball cap on, and a regular t-shirt and jeans. Those details do matter.

Even if all that was wrong and all the people were racist, it still does not demonstrate white privilege. Try looking up the definition of a privilege before you start saying I have white privilege, all based on some cherry-picked and clearly biased social experiment, where only a few people were tested.

If you love black people so much and feel so bad for them, why don't you leave us privileged whities alone, go find some people of color, and tell them all about your white power - oh, that's right, "privilege". I'm sure they will love you telling them about how whites are superior in America.


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31 Aug 2016, 11:00 am

Hey y'all, I just had some time to think about this in the shower, and I've decided to accept my white privilege. I mean, I've tried really hard to believe that black people are every bit as capable as white people, but I realize now that this is not the case. I mean, yeah, there are a ton of black guys at my work, even a few Africans (how they learned to speak English and get a job in such a racist country, I will never know), but now I see that the only reason they have the job is because a white person hired them and shared some of their privilege.

The new president of the factory is black too, and before I didn't really think much of it, but now I realize just how shocking that is. A black person running a business in America? How did he do that without white privilege? He must have the work ethic of a slave at the mercy of his master's whip to overcome such a trial as being around white people. Or maybe the president is secretly a white guy, and the black guy is just for show. Either way, it's pretty crazy.

I'll admit, I used to point at Obama and say, "We have a black president, voted for by a majority of Americans, most of whom are white. Doesn't that mean something?" But then I got to thinking, wait, he's actually half-white. They must have voted for the white half, those sneaky racists.

I wish blacks were equal to whites, especially with all the anti-discrimination laws in place, but it seems even that isn't enough to help the poor souls. They are too dumb to even realize when someone is treating them unfairly, let alone be able to take legal action. It's just too difficult to accomplish things when your skin is dark. White people will always have an advantage over them, just by nature of being white. But that is a sad truth we have to live with if we are to acknowledge our privilege as white-skinned folks, and I am willing to use my power as a white person to help those pitiful brown people in their sorry state. Surely they will never fully achieve whiteness in America, but maybe if we try to help them, some of our whiteness will rub off on them, and they will be a shade or two lighter at the end of the day. Every little bit counts.



On second thought, I think white privilege seems a bit racist, to be completely honest. I'm gonna go back to saying black people are as capable as white people now; that makes a little more sense to me.


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31 Aug 2016, 11:21 am

adifferentname wrote:
And treated better on what grounds?

On the grounds that it is believed that they are superior. Not because they are actually superior.

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Are you starting to see the racist Kafkatrap of white privilege yet or do you need more prodding?

I don't see how it's a Kafkatrap. From what I've read about Kafkatrapping, it is using someone's denial of guilt to prove they they are guilty. No one is trying to say that you are racist or should feel guilty, they are just saying that whites are privileged in society.

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That's not separating people from their experiences, that's distancing yourself from their experiences - rather like the way white privilege is applied. Except with the notion of white privilege, you completely ignore the reality of the individual's experiences and ascribe them a value based purely on the colour of their skin.

Of course, whites can have all sorts of different experiences. But we do not usually face discrimination for our skin colour alone. It's called intersectionality--the idea that you can be discriminated against for a number of different factors, and you can be privileged in one area and marginalized in another.
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That isn't what you did. You said "That's like saying that it's classist to say that rich people have it easier than poor people.". You're making an a priori judgement based on a single subjective factor, wealth. You haven't provided a context for "easier", so you're relying on there being an existing discrimination in order to find concordance with others.

I would have thought it is pretty clear that rich people have fewer struggles in life.
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You're also implying that class is based entirely on economic status, which is not a universal categorisation.
Yes, you are right.

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Then you should already know the answer.

I do, but I'm not sure you do. Do you think it's racist to say that white people had it easier than black people in the time of slavery?

And L_Holmes, white privilege isn't saying that blacks are less capable than whites. It's simply saying that blacks face more discrimination than whites do.


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31 Aug 2016, 11:35 am

L_Holmes wrote:
To be honest, I agree with the black woman. Young black males are insanely more likely to commit crimes than young white males, and I assume she knows this from firsthand experience. Also, they say they were dressed the same, but the black guy had on baggy pants and a lopsided hat, whereas the white guy simply had a backwards baseball cap on, and a regular t-shirt and jeans. Those details do matter.


Well that is actually false that black males are more likely to commit crimes than white males...but even if it was a statistical truth it would still be racist to automatcially judge a black person as more criminal/violent than a white person based on race alone based on it.


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adifferentname
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31 Aug 2016, 12:06 pm

TheAP wrote:
On the grounds that it is believed that they are superior. Not because they are actually superior.


And we've come full circle! There's a hole in your bucket.

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I don't see how it's a Kafkatrap. From what I've read about Kafkatrapping, it is using someone's denial of guilt to prove they they are guilty. No one is trying to say that you are racist or should feel guilty, they are just saying that whites are privileged in society.


The concept of "white privilege" manifests in the real world as follows:

"You have privilege that I don't have. You have to accept that you're the beneficiary of racism because of your skin colour. You must preference me as a result of this." to which you would add "I'm not trying to make you feel guilty in order to promote my own agenda".

So yes, it is an attempt at assigning blanket guilt to people based purely on the colour of skin. I am not responsible for the behaviour of other human beings who are beyond my capability to control - nor would I wish to have such control.

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Of course, whites can have all sorts of different experiences. But we do not usually face discrimination for our skin colour alone. It's called intersectionality--the idea that you can be discriminated against for a number of different factors, and you can be privileged in one area and marginalized in another.


I'll simply quote Christina Hoff Sommers on this one.

"Intersectionality is fascism with a liberal arts degree."

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I would have thought it is pretty clear that rich people have fewer struggles in life.


I would suggest that different people have different struggles independent of their presumed social class.

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I do, but I'm not sure you do. Do you think it's racist to say that white people had it easier than black people in the time of slavery?


I'd consider it to be ignorant, racist or both, depending on the knowledge of the individual making the statement, especially in the absence of further qualifiers.



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31 Aug 2016, 1:02 pm

Sweetleaf wrote:
L_Holmes wrote:
To be honest, I agree with the black woman. Young black males are insanely more likely to commit crimes than young white males, and I assume she knows this from firsthand experience. Also, they say they were dressed the same, but the black guy had on baggy pants and a lopsided hat, whereas the white guy simply had a backwards baseball cap on, and a regular t-shirt and jeans. Those details do matter.

Well that is actually false that black males are more likely to commit crimes than white males...but even if it was a statistical truth it would still be racist to automatcially judge a black person as more criminal/violent than a white person based on race alone based on it.

Just move near a ghetto city, and everyday you will see constant news of blacks killing blacks.

In my 98.8% white city, rarely do we see news of whites killing whites.

Occasionally, very rarely, it happens where a white from a poorer city does a carjack or kill.



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31 Aug 2016, 1:07 pm

Sweetleaf wrote:
L_Holmes wrote:
To be honest, I agree with the black woman. Young black males are insanely more likely to commit crimes than young white males, and I assume she knows this from firsthand experience. Also, they say they were dressed the same, but the black guy had on baggy pants and a lopsided hat, whereas the white guy simply had a backwards baseball cap on, and a regular t-shirt and jeans. Those details do matter.


Well that is actually false that black males are more likely to commit crimes than white males...but even if it was a statistical truth it would still be racist to automatcially judge a black person as more criminal/violent than a white person based on race alone based on it.

No, statistically black people are way more likely to commit crime, specifically black males, specifically violent crimes. I agree that this doesn't mean you should just assume an individual is a criminal solely based on skin color, but under certain circumstances I could see why people might be wary. It's unfortunate, but it seems to me that criminals should be getting the blame for the stereotype. Black people judge black males as more likely to be criminal as well, probably because of firsthand experience in many cases. Am I to believe that is racism as well?

Also, judging someone by their race based on statistics is exactly what people are doing when they say I have white privilege. It's like I said, nobody is allowed to go around saying all black people have "black criminality" based on statistics, so why can someone say I have "white privilege" based on nothing other than statistics? Nobody on here knows me or knows what kind of life I have, yet they feel perfectly comfortable saying I surely have all the advantages. They don't bother asking me about my experience, and they don't even try to have an honest, open discussion. They are openly judging me based on my skin color. Do you not find it offensive when people do this to you?


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31 Aug 2016, 1:12 pm

White privilege is the other side of the coin to racism. If you think racism exists, if you think that it's at all better to be white than black, then you also accept the concept of white privilege.

What should we do about white privilege? No sense in feeling guilty, just keep an eye out for discriminatory practices and challenge them.



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31 Aug 2016, 1:15 pm

LoveNotHate wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
L_Holmes wrote:
To be honest, I agree with the black woman. Young black males are insanely more likely to commit crimes than young white males, and I assume she knows this from firsthand experience. Also, they say they were dressed the same, but the black guy had on baggy pants and a lopsided hat, whereas the white guy simply had a backwards baseball cap on, and a regular t-shirt and jeans. Those details do matter.

Well that is actually false that black males are more likely to commit crimes than white males...but even if it was a statistical truth it would still be racist to automatcially judge a black person as more criminal/violent than a white person based on race alone based on it.

Just move near a ghetto city, and everyday you will see constant news of blacks killing blacks.

In my 98.8% white city, rarely do we see news of whites killing whites.

Occasionally, very rarely, it happens where a white from a poorer city does a carjack or kill.


hmm a ghetto city....perhaps its not so much the ethnicity then that is contributing to a cesspool of negativity, desperation and thing like that which increase the likelihood of crime. Also if this constant killing is occurring only among black people where is the news reporting on it? I'd think it is pretty important if there's constant murders going on in a U.S city like national news important.

That aside what sort of city do you live in...I live in a city with all kinds of ethnic diversity, and sure violent crime and killing occurs from time to time but its certainly not a constant occurrence really some of the worst ones however have been committed by white people...such as columbine school shooting and that aurora theater shooting.


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31 Aug 2016, 1:22 pm

TheAP wrote:
And L_Holmes, white privilege isn't saying that blacks are less capable than whites. It's simply saying that blacks face more discrimination than whites do.

And therefore, you think they are less capable of success. Anything bad that happens to black people is automatically assumed to be no fault of their own, and instead is blamed on racism, even if there could be other explanations that make more sense.

But rather than treating black people with respect, people assume that they can do no wrong; criminal behavior is not the decision of a criminal to commit crime, it is somehow the after-effects of slavery, and therefore white people's fault. If a black guy gets shot by white police, and it looks a bit questionable, it is immediately assume that racism is the culprit, even if facts are not sufficient to prove this (and in many cases, even if facts sufficiently disprove it).

It is a tendency to immediately defend black people no matter what, because of the condescending view that we shouldn't hold them responsible for what they do. And why not? Because of white guilt. White people are guilty about a few white people who had slaves in one particular part of the world and for some reason feel responsible, and to make up for it they are overly protective of black people. It is condescending, as it implies they need extra protection, as if they are weak and defenseless.

You are wrong. I am right.


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31 Aug 2016, 1:34 pm

L_Holmes wrote:
AspE wrote:
At the risk of being called a silly acronym, denying white privilege is racism. Experiments have been done submitting job applications with white names and black names, with equal qualifications. The applications with black names are far less likely to get a call.
Also check this s**t out:


These people don't think they are racist either, but the very different reaction to a white guy stealing a bike vs. a black one says it all.

So even if I don't believe blacks are inferior, I also have to accept that I get special privileges because I'm white, even when this is not my experience, or I'm still a racist? No, that is not how racism works.

You know what I like about the video? There is a black woman who admits that she also assumed he wasn't stealing the bike, and that it was based on his race. "Young white men don't usually carry burglary tools." This is f*****g gold. She was the only one in the video who admitted to judging the guy based on his race, yet still it's the white people who are labeled racist, even when they said his color had nothing to do with it. Amazing. I wonder if that means that the experimenters were biased in favor of black people?

To be honest, I agree with the black woman. Young black males are insanely more likely to commit crimes than young white males, and I assume she knows this from firsthand experience. Also, they say they were dressed the same, but the black guy had on baggy pants and a lopsided hat, whereas the white guy simply had a backwards baseball cap on, and a regular t-shirt and jeans. Those details do matter.

Even if all that was wrong and all the people were racist, it still does not demonstrate white privilege. Try looking up the definition of a privilege before you start saying I have white privilege, all based on some cherry-picked and clearly biased social experiment, where only a few people were tested.

If you love black people so much and feel so bad for them, why don't you leave us privileged whities alone, go find some people of color, and tell them all about your white power - oh, that's right, "privilege". I'm sure they will love you telling them about how whites are superior in America.

Black cops and black people are also subject to the same forces as all the nice white people in the video, who aren't explicitly racist. No one is saying they are secret KKK members, just that they all have internalized a culture of white privilege that has a double standard. Why don't you admit you don't give a crap about understanding the issue, you just want to feel offended that someone suggested you personally are a racist. That's not what this is about. Why don't you put a hold on your ego for one second and pay attention to what's happening in this country? White privilege is science, and you are a science denier.

Are Emily and Greg More Employable than Lakisha and Jamal?
http://www2.econ.iastate.edu/classes/ec ... _emily.pdf

(Overall, whites had 50% more callbacks than blacks, based only on their names)



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31 Aug 2016, 1:48 pm

The_Walrus wrote:
White privilege is the other side of the coin to racism. If you think racism exists, if you think that it's at all better to be white than black, then you also accept the concept of white privilege.

What should we do about white privilege? No sense in feeling guilty, just keep an eye out for discriminatory practices and challenge them.

And there it is; this is what I meant by "white privilege is the new white power" in my OP. Accepting white privilege is also accepting that white people are better than black people, and therefore being racist. One side of the racist coin says "White power! f**k black people!", and the other side says, "White privilege! Poor black people!" The fact that you can say this aloud and still think white privilege makes sense disturbs me.

Just because a racist decides to help instead of hinder those he believes to be inferior does not make him a better person, because he still holds racist beliefs. Personally, I would actually prefer blatant racism over condescending racism, because at least the first one will actually openly admit to his racism. The condescending racists try to redefine racism to write themselves out, as has been already shown in some responses to this thread.


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31 Aug 2016, 1:53 pm

I don't understand why it's racism to know that black people are indeed treated different than white people and face more discrimination than white people. Isn't that denying that racism still exists?

My uncle was pulled over on one of our family trips in 1995 and my mom thought it was weird how we got pulled over. We had working lights, we were not speeding, but my dad's brother said it was because his partner is black. My mom was shocked. This wasn't the first time my uncle was pulled over while driving when he was doing nothing wrong and there were no broken headlights and it's not like they were pulling anyone over to check for IDs like they sometimes do to catch unlicensed drivers.

I have also read stories about how a black person would go in the store to shop and the store cashier automatically finds them suspicious so they follow them around the store but yet they don't follow any white customers around the store and it was about racial profiling. Why is it racist to call this racism?


When I see any person, white, black, Hispanic, etc. I do not think anything of them. I only based my opinion based on how they treat me and treat others but nothing to do with their skin color. I am sure some people do play the race card so they say this happened to them just because they are black when really it had nothing to do with their race. People call it racism when you say this wasn't a racial issue but yet if you call it a race issue, it's still racism. :? You can't win. This reminds me of the Ferguson shooting when people were throwing the word racist around at people who didn't agree this was a race thing the officer did and people saying anyone who was calling it racism is indeed a racist.

I see this is a sensitive topic here.


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