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DarthMetaKnight
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12 Sep 2017, 2:01 pm



HMMMMMMMM It seems that capitalism isn't working too well. :wink:
GAME OVER


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DarthMetaKnight
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12 Sep 2017, 6:18 pm

This is much better than the American response to hurricanes eh?


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SH90
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12 Sep 2017, 6:48 pm

You can, I don't know... Move to Cuba and let us know how wonderful it is? I bet you will be making the swim within a month like many do.

We are doing just fine on our recovery...



leejosepho
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12 Sep 2017, 7:24 pm

Cuban citizens overall seem to me to be better-prepared for disaster than the typical American, but maybe likely because there is no other way for them to survive at all within their particular setting and economy. I do wonder whether all the relief-and-recovery equipment and staff might have already been in place for Irma victims beforehand if the Federal funding had not already been set, but the bottom line is that the funds have not been denied no matter how badly Alex Jones might dislike one or more politicians.


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ASPartOfMe
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13 Sep 2017, 5:03 am

You are confusing political ideology with culture. The Dutch do quite well with thier dikes and they are not communist.

As mentioned in the piece the Cubans have a lot of experience in dealing with storms even more so then Florida especially in the last few decades.

The information on how to prepare for a hurricane was broadcast by the government, by the mainstream media, social media. Cuba said we are going to make you do the right thing whether you like it or not, America said if you are stupid enough not to prepare tough luck. That is a cultural thing as is the American mentality not to think about the past(unless it is a confederate statue).

One reason you do not see similar images of ruin and f**k ups is out of Cuba that the goverment controls what is broadcast. For the American capitalist media ruin and f**k ups bring ratings, so that is what gets broadcast.


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leejosepho
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13 Sep 2017, 6:44 am

ASPartOfMe wrote:
... Cuba said we are going to make you do the right thing whether you like it or not, America said if you are stupid enough not to prepare tough luck. That is a cultural thing...

As driven by or in accompaniment with capitalism? Not meaning to argue about anything, just pondering the fact that "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness (ownership of property)" includes the right to be wrong or even foolish.


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kitesandtrainsandcats
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13 Sep 2017, 8:30 am

Let's have a look at the following and see what the primary takeaways are;

Quote:
"Cuba is known for its hurricane preparations, an experience it has honed weathering dozens of tropical storms and hurricanes. The impoverished country doesn’t have the resources to build new hurricane-proof structures, so instead the government focuses on evacuation and focusing on proper preparation for the storm so the recovery won’t be as tough. The the Civil Defense division (EMNDC) sprung into action starting last Tuesday, launching full-force Irma preparations. First, it made sure citizens in the affected regions were aware of the storm and were monitoring the national weather information.

Cubans are taught to prepare for hurricanes from early on. Even little kids have storm evacuation drills in primary school, and as they get older, they learn how to monitor neighborhoods to identify possible threats, like trees that may topple or windows that could blow out during strong winds.

Community leaders, like teachers, firefighters and doctors are responsible for and trained to help their local population during evacuations. Each household possesses a copy of an evacuation plan and evacuation drills are a regular occurrence in many coastal Cuban provinces.

48 hours before Irma hit, residents were told to evacuate, but no one was forced, except pregnant mothers or ones with small children, who can be fined if they don’t evacuate. Missing work or looting aren’t concerns, mainly because most Cubans work for the government anyway and don’t have a lot of material possessions people can steal.


Looks like the primary takeaways are,
"The impoverished country doesn’t have the resources to build new hurricane-proof structures, ..."
and
..."most Cubans work for the government anyway and don’t have a lot of material possessions people can steal."
From:
https://thepointsguy.com/2017/09/hurricane-irma-travel-in-cuba/

While we're talking impoverished Cuba, here as an added bonus at no extra charge, is
Quote:
In 1991, Cuba's economy began to implode. "The Special Period in the Time of Peace" was the government's euphemism for what was a culmination of 30 years worth of isolation. It began in the 60s, with engineers leaving Cuba for America. Ernesto Oroza, a designer and artist, studied the innovations created during this period. He found that the general population had created homespun, Frankenstein-like machines for their survival, made from everyday objects. Oroza began to collect these machines, and would later contextualize it as "art" in a movement he dubbed "Technological Disobedience." Originally aired on Motherboard in 2011.


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MaxE
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13 Sep 2017, 10:35 am

This has always aggravated me. We often see stories about how Cuba has achieved 100% cooperation when evacuating before a hurricane, but that is just because the population has been taught obedience to government authorities from birth. I don't see how this can be construed as an endorsement of the Cuban form of government.


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leejosepho
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13 Sep 2017, 1:13 pm

Quote:
...what could these people accomplish if they didn’t have the government gorilla sitting on their faces, asphyxiating everything? ...
The most surprising thing about Cuba, after all those years of hearing about it inside the cradle of the Miami Cuban exile, was the real, lived-in-the-moment nature of totalitarianism and what it does to people. In Orwell’s fiction, political dictatorship remains an abstraction, some moral fable cloaked in binary judgments and populated by villains and heroes. But the reality in Cuba is much more mundane. There really is a banality of tyranny; it’s not all just Arendtian hyperbole. People realize they’re being ruled by autocrats, and they do whatever necessary to get by. They reframe “freedom” to mean the little square of movement and dissent the government grants them, and consider themselves free as a result.
...
If the world has learned anything from the past two decades of Cuban economic liberalization, it’s that what happens inside Cuba is a function of the regime’s decisions and is almost completely unaffected by anything the international community does. My impression from the many interviews I conducted over two weeks in Havana is that change will come at a glacial pace, if at all. The centuries-old colonial facades will crumble while the people stagnate in a political repression more suffocating than any tropical heat.

from Inside Cuba's D.I.Y. Internet Revolution

That kind of price for hurricane survival is definitely quite high, but I wonder how many Harvey and/or Irma victims are presently suffering because they know virtually nothing about survival outside of luxury.


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Misslizard
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13 Sep 2017, 3:11 pm

Cuba is awesome.I want to visit.There was going to be a ferry between Florida and Cuba but I think the orange devil nixed that.
Audioslave played there.There are Sea Turtles and vintage old cars,good tobacco and rum.Hell yeahs.


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13 Sep 2017, 3:23 pm

leejosepho wrote:
Quote:
...what could these people accomplish if they didn’t have the government gorilla sitting on their faces, asphyxiating everything? ...
The most surprising thing about Cuba, after all those years of hearing about it inside the cradle of the Miami Cuban exile, was the real, lived-in-the-moment nature of totalitarianism and what it does to people. In Orwell’s fiction, political dictatorship remains an abstraction, some moral fable cloaked in binary judgments and populated by villains and heroes. But the reality in Cuba is much more mundane. There really is a banality of tyranny; it’s not all just Arendtian hyperbole. People realize they’re being ruled by autocrats, and they do whatever necessary to get by. They reframe “freedom” to mean the little square of movement and dissent the government grants them, and consider themselves free as a result.
...
If the world has learned anything from the past two decades of Cuban economic liberalization, it’s that what happens inside Cuba is a function of the regime’s decisions and is almost completely unaffected by anything the international community does. My impression from the many interviews I conducted over two weeks in Havana is that change will come at a glacial pace, if at all. The centuries-old colonial facades will crumble while the people stagnate in a political repression more suffocating than any tropical heat.

from Inside Cuba's D.I.Y. Internet Revolution

That kind of price for hurricane survival is definitely quite high, but I wonder how many Harvey and/or Irma victims are presently suffering because they know virtually nothing about survival outside of luxury.

Yes,that is so true.I keep enough food,batteries,toilet paper to last months.We had a major ice storm that took out all the power grid here.No electricity for two weeks,for some longer.I never suffered for water or food.We expect that sort of thing to happen.LED headlamps are a must.Your hands are free,and if you attach them to a full gallon jug of water,light bulb turned in,you can light a whole room.There are small solar panels for charging phones,as long as you have a tower.lol Ours were down plus the landline phone.Same during the spring tornado,no phones,no power.No big deal.Have a solar powered or crank radio.I can charge mine numerous ways.
Surprisingly we will get a new post office.The old one was crumpled and tossed in a feild.The post master told me it was suppose to withstand 125 mph winds.BS,I could have kicked my way out of that POS.


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LegoMaster2149
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14 Sep 2017, 3:43 pm

This reminds me of the 1900 Galveston Hurricane. Cuban meteorologists had a much more better understanding of the route that the hurricane was taking, which was west, when the Americans thought it would east. But the Americans blocked Cuban weather reports from getting to the U.S. Weather Bureau, so that basically sealed the fate of the disaster.

-LegoMaster2149 (Written on September 14, 2017)


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ASPartOfMe
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14 Sep 2017, 5:56 pm

LegoMaster2149 wrote:
This reminds me of the 1900 Galveston Hurricane. Cuban meteorologists had a much more better understanding of the route that the hurricane was taking, which was west, when the Americans thought it would east. But the Americans blocked Cuban weather reports from getting to the U.S. Weather Bureau, so that basically sealed the fate of the disaster.

-LegoMaster2149 (Written on September 14, 2017)


Something similar happened with the 1938 Great New England/Long Island Express hurricane that killed over 600.
1938 New England Hurricane - Wikipedia
Quote:
In 1938, United States forecasting lagged behind forecasting in Europe, where new techniques were being used to analyze air masses, taking into account the influence of fronts. A confidential report was released by the United States Forest Service, the parent agency of the United States Weather Bureau. It described the weather bureau's forecasting as "a sorry state of affairs" where forecasters had poor training and systematic planning was not used, and where forecasters had to "scrape by" to get information wherever they could. The Jacksonville, Florida, office of the weather bureau issued a warning on September 19 that a hurricane might hit Florida. Residents and authorities made extensive preparations, as they had endured the Labor Day Hurricane three years earlier. When the storm turned north, the office issued warnings for the Carolina coast and transferred authority to the bureau's headquarters in Washington.

At 9:00 am on September 21, the Washington office issued northeast storm warnings north of Atlantic City and south of Block Island, Rhode Island, and southeast storm warnings from Block Island to Eastport, Maine.The advisory, however, underestimated the storm's intensity and said that it was farther south than it actually was. The office had yet to forward any information about the hurricane to the New York City office. At 10:00 am, the bureau downgraded the hurricane to a tropical storm. The 11:30 am advisory mentioned gale-force winds but nothing about a tropical storm or hurricane.

That day, 28 year-old rookie Charles Pierce was standing in for two veteran meteorologists. He concluded that the storm would be squeezed between a high-pressure area located to the west and a high-pressure area to the east, and that it would be forced to ride up a trough of low pressure into New England. A noon meeting was called and Pierce presented his conclusion, but he was overruled by "celebrated" chief forecaster Charles Mitchell and his senior staff. In Boston, meteorologist E.B. Rideout told his WEEI radio listeners (to the skepticism of his peers) that the hurricane would hit New England. At 2:00 pm, hurricane-force gusts were occurring on Long Island's South Shore and near hurricane-force gusts on the coast of Connecticut. The Washington office issued an advisory saying that the storm was 75 miles east-southeast of Atlantic City and would pass over Long Island and Connecticut. Re-analysis of the storm suggests that the hurricane was farther north (just 50 miles from Fire Island), and that it was stronger and larger than the advisory said.


The veteran meteorologist was going on experience, the vast majority of Hurricanes go out to sea before getting to the Northeast.


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LegoMaster2149
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14 Sep 2017, 8:18 pm

Oh yeah, I forgot about that one!


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LegoMaster2149
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15 Sep 2017, 10:33 am

In fact, I just watched a documentary on that yesterday evening! :D


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