Page 6 of 6 [ 87 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6

Biscuitman
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 11 Mar 2013
Age: 40
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,996
Location: Dunking jammy dodgers

07 Feb 2018, 5:07 am

RainbowUnion wrote:
Biscuitman wrote:
RainbowUnion wrote:
Well thanks for enlightening an ignorant Yank. Now can someone explain to me the rules of Cricket? Also I'm wondering why Canadians don't play the game when all the other parts of the world with heavy Brit influence (Australia, India, Pakistan, etc) do.


I love cricket! The amount of stats involved and how much you follow it as a long strategy game is just fantastic. Keep in mind as well that cricket can be enjoyed while not actually watching any action, it goes on for days and you just keep a track of how the scoring is going. I have a score counter in the corner of my work screen when matches are on so I know what is happening.

When you get it, it is a great game to follow.

I am more than happy to explain how it works if you are serious. It's really not actually very complicated, it can be as simple as you want it to be to your own level of enthusiasm and enjoyment.

And Canada do play cricket! They are just not very good at it.


Hello sir. I am serious. First off, I am wondering how you decide when the game is over because there is apparently no time limit. Also how do you score and what happens in a typical play.


happy to move this onto the sport section if you want and chat about it there. the basics of Test Cricket are

2 teams of 11.
The wickets are 22 yards apart.
One team bats and they have 2 batsmen in play, one on each wicket.
when one team is batting the other team is fielding and they have all 11 players out in the field

The fielding team has nominated bowlers (4 is typical in test cricket) who take it in turns to bowl at one wicket to try and get the batsman out. The ways of getting them out are either hitting the wicket so that the stumps fall off, or catching the ball once they hit it.
The batsman needs to hit the ball to score runs. a run is the batsman running from one wicket to the other. While doing this the other batsman who is not being bowled at has to also run as they are essentially swapping places. If the fielding team collect the hit ball and throw it back towards the wickets then they can hit the wickets with it if the batsman has not managed to complete his run fully.

If a batsman hits the ball outside the pitch and the ball bounces first then he scores 4 runs. if he hits it outside the pitch without it bouncing he scores 6

Mostly the bowlers are typically trying to bowl a ball that tempts the batsman into hitting it but ideally the ball will have enough 'spin' or 'swing' on it that either the batsman only gets an ever so slight touch (called an 'edge') so that someone stood behind him can atch it on it or he hits it but it doesn't go where he intended it to and someone catches it.

The bowling team bowls until they get all of the batting team out, or if they are not doing well then the batting team can 'declare' which means they score so many runs that they feel they can happily give up batting as they think they will win.

The teams then swap over and do it all again so that each have batted and fielded to see who is winning.

The game is based on both teams batting and fielding twice so it is essentially a combined total score of 2 games. It is not uncommon though for the game to be finished after the 3rd innings so one team doesn't get to have their final bat or field just because one team is so dominant that they have already won the game.

Example:

England bat and are all out for 200
Australia have their turn batting and score 500 with only 5 players out. they declare as they are 300 ahead already.
England go in to bat for the 2nd time and score 280 all out.

Australia win after just 3 innings as they have already scored more while getting the opponent out.

You also have to remember that it is not just scoring more than the other team, you need to score more then also get them out. This then creates a situation where a team is clearly on course to lose so stops trying to score runs and instead just blocks every ball being bowled at them. The bowling team then have a problem, so they start crowding around the batsman and diving towards the ball after he blocks it hoping to catch it before it hits the floor. the bowler would typically be spinning the ball so it go upwards after hitting the bat to help the fielders catch it.

Typically you have spin bowlers and pace bowlers. Spin bowlers throw it slowly but with loads of spin on it so it bounces in front of the batsman and goes off at a different angle. Pace bowlers throw it really fast (upwards of 90mph) and put swing on the ball making it swerve in the air and fool the batsman.

A cricket ball is very hard and heavy and has thick stitching on it to held the bowlers swing and spin. The bowlers also 'shine' one side of the ball throughout the game to keep one side clean helping to add further swing.



Biscuitman
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 11 Mar 2013
Age: 40
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,996
Location: Dunking jammy dodgers

07 Feb 2018, 5:14 am

The effects of weather and climate make a big difference to the game and so home advantage is huge. An example is that if you go play in India then it is hot, dry, the ground cracks easily around the batsman's feet and so you take spin bowlers with you as they get a good grip on the dry ground.

In England the overcast skies and mild weather are good for swing bowling. the more cloud in the sky, the more moisture in the air the more the ball will move around in the air.



Biscuitman
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 11 Mar 2013
Age: 40
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,996
Location: Dunking jammy dodgers

07 Feb 2018, 5:18 am

There is more you can learn if you want to know more but cricket for me is as simple or complex as you want it to be.



Biscuitman
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 11 Mar 2013
Age: 40
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,996
Location: Dunking jammy dodgers

07 Feb 2018, 5:24 am

I don't know what time zone you are on but South Africa Vs India is shortly starting. They are playing a One Day International which is a shorter version of cricket where each team gets to bat and field just once and the fielding team has 50 overs (300 bowls of the ball) only.

It might be a good introduction for you to how it works as the basics are all the same as Test Cricket

Here is a link to follow the game in text mode. You then just pull that tab down and do your normal work but the tab at the bottom counts the score up for you.
http://www.espncricinfo.com/series/18065/game/1122281/south-africa-vs-india-3rd-odi-ind-in-sa-2017-18/

Clicking on scorecard during any game gives you the overview of how a team has done. It will show you the list of batsman gone and waiting to have a go and how they did



The_Walrus
Forum Moderator
Forum Moderator

User avatar

Joined: 27 Jan 2010
Age: 24
Gender: Male
Posts: 6,647
Location: Reading, England

07 Feb 2018, 9:54 am

kraftiekortie wrote:
I'm not sure if I'm absolutely correct in this----but if you get a "leg before wicket" or whatever, that's an automatic "out." If you miss the ball totally, that's an out. So, in essence, you only get one "strike."

This isn't quite correct - in fact, one of the things that distinguishes an excellent batsman from a good one is that they hit the ball much less. The ball has to hit the wicket (a set of three "stumps" lodged into the ground) and dislodge a bail (two small bits of wood balanced between the stumps) for you to get out.

There are nine or ten ways you can get out, some of which are very technical. As Biscuitman, Mikah, and others have said, the main ones are:

1) Caught - as in baseball, if you hit the ball and someone catches it before it hits the ground, you are out.
2) Bowled - if the bowler manages to hit your wicket and dislodge at least one of the bails, you are out.
3) LBW - a very technical rule. If the bowler bowls a ball which is going to hit the wicket, you don't hit it with your bat, and it is blocked by part of your body, you are out. There are many exceptions to this which I won't go into.
4) Run out - if, when attempting a "run" between the wickets (the method of scoring), someone uses the ball to dislodge a bail from the wicket, you are out.
5) Stumped - the least common of the conventional methods of getting out. If the batsman moves too far down the field, and misses the ball, then the wicket-keeper (backstop) can use the ball to dislodge the bails in a similar fashion to a run-out.

Then we have:

6) Hit wicket - somewhat common in junior cricket, rare in the professional game. If you dislodge your own bails, you are out. Difficult and unlikely, but does occur.

There are three technical methods which are extremely rare: in all of Test cricket (i.e. international cricket between the best teams played over several days) they have only resulted in one wicket, when Len Hutton obstructed the field in 1951:

7) Double hit - if you hit the ball twice, except in defence of your wicket, you are out.
8) Obstructing the field - if you stop the fielders from collecting the ball (preventing a catch or run-out), you are out.
9) Timed out - if you take too long to get onto the pitch after someone else gets out, you are out.

Then there is one method which became obsolete in 2017:

10) Handling the ball - if you pick up the ball without the permission of the fielding side, you are out. This has now been merged with obstructing the field. Only seven Test players have ever been given out this way.

In all cases, a player is only given out if the fielding team appeal.



Biscuitman
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 11 Mar 2013
Age: 40
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,996
Location: Dunking jammy dodgers

07 Feb 2018, 10:09 am

Biscuitman wrote:
I don't know what time zone you are on but South Africa Vs India is shortly starting. They are playing a One Day International which is a shorter version of cricket where each team gets to bat and field just once and the fielding team has 50 overs (300 bowls of the ball) only.

It might be a good introduction for you to how it works as the basics are all the same as Test Cricket

Here is a link to follow the game in text mode. You then just pull that tab down and do your normal work but the tab at the bottom counts the score up for you.
http://www.espncricinfo.com/series/18065/game/1122281/south-africa-vs-india-3rd-odi-ind-in-sa-2017-18/

Clicking on scorecard during any game gives you the overview of how a team has done. It will show you the list of batsman gone and waiting to have a go and how they did


India scored 303/6 (303 runs and 6 of their batsmen were out) and we are now waiting for South Africa to get themselves ready to start batting.

I read that they are playing on what is traditionally a low scoring pitch so 303 sounds decent. One Indian batsman scored 160 on his own and did it from 159 balls bowled at him, a very good scoring rate. He was the 3rd batsman in and he remained until the end when all 50 overs were bowled.



RainbowUnion
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 19 Jan 2018
Gender: Male
Posts: 899

07 Feb 2018, 3:07 pm

Biscuitman wrote:
There is more you can learn if you want to know more but cricket for me is as simple or complex as you want it to be.


I thank you for the info, and I did read all you posted carefully. It makes me want to get on youtube and take a look at an actual match.

The home field advantage part of the game really interested me, since Cricket is played all over the world. For example, would an Indian team who is king of their own conditions be simply lost if they had to play say in Ireland?


_________________
"It must be understood, that neither by word nor deed had I given Fortunato cause to doubt my good-will. I continued as was my wont, to smile in his face, and he did not perceive that my smile was at the thought of his immolation."

Edgar Allan Poe, The Cask of Amontillado


RainbowUnion
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 19 Jan 2018
Gender: Male
Posts: 899

07 Feb 2018, 3:13 pm

And Walrus, thank you too for the info. This seems an interesting game, and is better than discussing what a "chav" is anyway. I hope to continue after I've seen it played.


_________________
"It must be understood, that neither by word nor deed had I given Fortunato cause to doubt my good-will. I continued as was my wont, to smile in his face, and he did not perceive that my smile was at the thought of his immolation."

Edgar Allan Poe, The Cask of Amontillado


Biscuitman
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 11 Mar 2013
Age: 40
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,996
Location: Dunking jammy dodgers

08 Feb 2018, 8:07 am

RainbowUnion wrote:
Biscuitman wrote:
There is more you can learn if you want to know more but cricket for me is as simple or complex as you want it to be.


I thank you for the info, and I did read all you posted carefully. It makes me want to get on youtube and take a look at an actual match.

The home field advantage part of the game really interested me, since Cricket is played all over the world. For example, would an Indian team who is king of their own conditions be simply lost if they had to play say in Ireland?


That is one part of cricket I love too. While in so many sports we hear about how there has to be a level playing field etc in cricket we know there won't be as it is played internationally, and so the mentally is that you have to try and come to our back yard and take the crown from us.

Any visiting teams to India, Sri Lanka and even Bangladesh have a tough game ahead of them.

This data is a few years out of date but the stats are still there
http://www.espncricinfo.com/magazine/content/story/552712.html

halfway down the page you have the headings 'subcontinent teams overseas' and 'overseas teams in Asia' and it shows you the numbers of test matches played with a win/loss/drawn number next to it

If those numbers are correct then Sri Lanka, India & Bangladesh when playing away in England, Australia & South Africa only won 9 out of a possible 49 test matches, but England, South Africa & Australia could only win 5 of a possible 34 test matches when playing away at those Asia countries.



RainbowUnion
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 19 Jan 2018
Gender: Male
Posts: 899

08 Feb 2018, 2:08 pm

Biscuitman wrote:
RainbowUnion wrote:
Biscuitman wrote:
There is more you can learn if you want to know more but cricket for me is as simple or complex as you want it to be.


I thank you for the info, and I did read all you posted carefully. It makes me want to get on youtube and take a look at an actual match.

The home field advantage part of the game really interested me, since Cricket is played all over the world. For example, would an Indian team who is king of their own conditions be simply lost if they had to play say in Ireland?


That is one part of cricket I love too. While in so many sports we hear about how there has to be a level playing field etc in cricket we know there won't be as it is played internationally, and so the mentally is that you have to try and come to our back yard and take the crown from us.

Any visiting teams to India, Sri Lanka and even Bangladesh have a tough game ahead of them.

This data is a few years out of date but the stats are still there
http://www.espncricinfo.com/magazine/content/story/552712.html

halfway down the page you have the headings 'subcontinent teams overseas' and 'overseas teams in Asia' and it shows you the numbers of test matches played with a win/loss/drawn number next to it

If those numbers are correct then Sri Lanka, India & Bangladesh when playing away in England, Australia & South Africa only won 9 out of a possible 49 test matches, but England, South Africa & Australia could only win 5 of a possible 34 test matches when playing away at those Asia countries.


What about the effects of geographical elevation, ie thinner air and etc?


_________________
"It must be understood, that neither by word nor deed had I given Fortunato cause to doubt my good-will. I continued as was my wont, to smile in his face, and he did not perceive that my smile was at the thought of his immolation."

Edgar Allan Poe, The Cask of Amontillado


Biscuitman
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 11 Mar 2013
Age: 40
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,996
Location: Dunking jammy dodgers

08 Feb 2018, 3:39 pm

RainbowUnion wrote:
Biscuitman wrote:
RainbowUnion wrote:
Biscuitman wrote:
There is more you can learn if you want to know more but cricket for me is as simple or complex as you want it to be.


I thank you for the info, and I did read all you posted carefully. It makes me want to get on youtube and take a look at an actual match.

The home field advantage part of the game really interested me, since Cricket is played all over the world. For example, would an Indian team who is king of their own conditions be simply lost if they had to play say in Ireland?


That is one part of cricket I love too. While in so many sports we hear about how there has to be a level playing field etc in cricket we know there won't be as it is played internationally, and so the mentally is that you have to try and come to our back yard and take the crown from us.

Any visiting teams to India, Sri Lanka and even Bangladesh have a tough game ahead of them.

This data is a few years out of date but the stats are still there
http://www.espncricinfo.com/magazine/content/story/552712.html

halfway down the page you have the headings 'subcontinent teams overseas' and 'overseas teams in Asia' and it shows you the numbers of test matches played with a win/loss/drawn number next to it

If those numbers are correct then Sri Lanka, India & Bangladesh when playing away in England, Australia & South Africa only won 9 out of a possible 49 test matches, but England, South Africa & Australia could only win 5 of a possible 34 test matches when playing away at those Asia countries.


What about the effects of geographical elevation, ie thinner air and etc?


Only ever heard that mentioned for playing in South Africa. Johannesburg is a much higher altitude I believe, they say the ball moves quicker through the air.



The_Walrus
Forum Moderator
Forum Moderator

User avatar

Joined: 27 Jan 2010
Age: 24
Gender: Male
Posts: 6,647
Location: Reading, England

08 Feb 2018, 4:07 pm

RainbowUnion wrote:
Biscuitman wrote:
There is more you can learn if you want to know more but cricket for me is as simple or complex as you want it to be.


I thank you for the info, and I did read all you posted carefully. It makes me want to get on youtube and take a look at an actual match.

The home field advantage part of the game really interested me, since Cricket is played all over the world. For example, would an Indian team who is king of their own conditions be simply lost if they had to play say in Ireland?

India would almost certainly beat Ireland in Ireland, there's just too big a gulf.

As Biscuitman says though, subcontinental pitches strongly encourage spin bowling, and a complementary style of batting, and India haven't really produced the same quality of fast bowlers as Australia or England or South Africa (or historically the West Indies). Pakistan are a bit of an exception - very flat pitches that encourage spin, and so touring sides will usually take two spinners (they'd only use one at home), but they still have a culture of producing great fast bowlers like Imran Khan, Waqar Younis, Wasim Akram, Shohaib Aktar, Mohammad Amir, etc. That's why Pakistan have a better bowling record away from the subcontinent (or the UAE) than India or Sri Lanka.

While thin air at altitude would undoubtedly effect things, there isn't much discussion of it. I've heard it said that high altitude of some South African grounds makes the ball quicker, and it probably effects reverse swing, but I think mostly this is of more interest to scientists than pundits right now.

(inb4'd by Biscuitman - there are Indian and Pakistani pitches which are at considerable altitude, and Kenyan ones come to that, but surface conditions seem to be more significant)