Page 1 of 2 [ 20 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

firemonkey
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 23 Mar 2015
Gender: Male
Posts: 4,572
Location: Calne,England

04 Feb 2018, 11:26 am

For those of us who have had therapy to describe our experience.


The two trained psychologists/therapists I saw pushed the "If you want to be a good person..." line as though I was a moral degenerate rather than someone who needed help to cope better. I stopped seeing them rather quickly.

Finally I had 'therapy' from an untrained member of staff at the day centre I was attending. She didn't push the "If you want to be a good person..." line but was hypercritical of me and didn't give much encouragement.
Eventually she revealed she was part of a small religious sect and dumped me soon after for inadvertently upsetting her religious sensibilities.

After that trio of fiascos I was soon told I was unsuitable for therapy.


_________________
Support mental health research
Please support mental health research
http://www.mentalhealthresearchuk.org.uk/
http://mcpin.org/
https://www.mqmentalhealth.org/


Your neurodiverse (Aspie) score: 133 of 200
Your neurotypical (non-autistic) score: 47 of 200
You are very likely neurodiverse (Aspie)


eeVenye
Raven
Raven

User avatar

Joined: 25 Oct 2017
Gender: Male
Posts: 118

04 Feb 2018, 12:39 pm

firemonkey wrote:
After that trio of fiascos I was soon told I was unsuitable for therapy.


I've been in therapy in a variety of situations (school/employer mandated). Largely I've found it worse than useless, as therapists have their own lens that they are focused on and spending an hour talking about emotions takes a day-and-a-half's energy. Hoping to find an ASD specialist after diagnosis for the last year of school (and thus mandated counseling), to work on more occupational/behavioral approach.


_________________
Ceterum autem censeo, Modernismum delendum esse!


Trogluddite
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 2 Feb 2016
Age: 50
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,050
Location: Yorkshire, UK

04 Feb 2018, 4:41 pm

My experience is that therapy with a counsellor who has a good understanding of autism can be very beneficial. On the other hand, therapy with a counsellor who doesn't understand autism can be worse than useless. I have had both kinds at different times, and I found the contrast between the two very stark.

I wrote much more about my experiences of this in another thread - That's the kind of CBT for me! <link>. (Note, it is a rather long essay kind of post, so may take a little time to read!)


_________________
When you are fighting an invisible monster, first throw a bucket of paint over it.


bumbleme
Blue Jay
Blue Jay

Joined: 23 May 2017
Gender: Female
Posts: 99
Location: Australia

06 Feb 2018, 10:46 am

I had a really good psychologist I was seeing for a couple of years, years ago, before I knew about having ASD.
She was very respectful, mature (She was close to retirement), non-judgmental, and careful not to be pushy. She very much helped me to start seeing myself as a person again, among other things.

Have been to a quite a few since, none quite as helpful as the first one yet.
One was helpful when I was having a crisis at work, but other times pretty moralising (lots of "shoulds": "should be able to...", "shouldn't have...").

There were a couple who refused to listen to what I was saying as they were too busy trying to interpret body language.
And couple were just super unprofessional and / or nutty
I was also in a confusing group program for social anxiety. Near the end of the program I was told I didn't actually have proper social anxiety but they didn't know what was wrong with me. I know now :mrgreen:



After I was diagnosed last year, I went to try a couple of ASD counsellors.
One of them I was very uncomfortable with, even though she knew about ASD. There were some strange vibes. There was a hint of a smug "I know all about ASD" and a little bit of "I can impart my NT wisdom".

There were a couple who I saw who were very respectful but just didn't feel like the right fit.

Recently I've been thinking that the psychologist knowing about ASD might not enough to get real, lasting help. At least for me, I think having a compatible personality might be more important. Because communication can be so difficult, I want to find a counsellor who speaks the same basic language as I do. (Well having both understanding of ASD and compatible personality would obviously be the best.)

I think the first psychologist I saw (the one who actually helped) had a similar personality type to me. (I think she was an ENTP, and I am an INTP [same preferred cognitive functions, different order]). She was happy to talk through things in depth. She wasn't trying to find quick solutions (they don't usually work for me unfortunately)



shortfatbalduglyman
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 4 Mar 2017
Age: 37
Gender: Male
Posts: 7,916

08 Feb 2018, 9:57 pm

fire monkey


firemonkey wrote:
For those of us who have had therapy to describe our experience.


The two trained psychologists/therapists I saw pushed the "If you want to be a good person..." line as though I was a moral degenerate rather than someone who needed help to cope better. I stopped seeing them rather quickly.

where did those two psychologists work?

can't you get counseling through your insurance?



Finally I had 'therapy' from an untrained member of staff at the day centre I was attending. She didn't push the "If you want to be a good person..." line but was hypercritical of me and didn't give much encouragement.
Eventually she revealed she was part of a small religious sect and dumped me soon after for inadvertently upsetting her religious sensibilities.

different counselors have different personalities.

the counselors that interacted with you thus far, are not necessarily a representative sample of all counselors.

in some situations (when i was in college), clients could specify choosing a counselor from a certain religion or whatever.

having said that, if you do not have any other choice of counselors, it is better to not have the wrong counselor, than have the right one.

no counselor has ever dumped me. and i have had over 35 counselors.



After that trio of fiascos I was soon told I was unsuitable for therapy.



who "told" you that you were "unsuitable for therapy"? a counselor?

my current counselor told me "counseling is never wasted". "never": way too vague/broad/global/dramatic.

why did the speaker tell you you were unsuitable for therapy?

actually, now that you bring it up, in psychiatry there is a thing called "treatment refractory depression". clinical depression that does not improve with SSRI or MAOI sufficiently. quite frankly, i am paranoid that i got "counseling refractory depression".

the current counselor is by far, the best counselor i have had, thus far. she is not obsessed with the mandated reporter law. she stays on topic. she appears sophisticated at my diagnoses. (fine). she does not look judgmental (or she skillfully represses her judgments better than i can detect them.) she takes a balance between a professional distance and not too social. she appears grounded. etcetera.

but lately, i have noticed some serious flaws. she tends to overuse the words "unfortunate thing that happened", "sorry", "people", "help", "hurt", "what?", "distress", "care". she seems so dramatic. like the slightest thing is an "unfortunate thing that happened. but maybe that is not her fault, but my fault. it could be that a side effect of counseling involves Narcissistic Personality Disorder. likewise, the drama/theater. maybe that is what she learned in grad school. maybe that is what her other clients demand. maybe that's what everyone in the world wants. except short fat bald ugly man.

in other words, i wonder if i am unsuitable for counseling. the counselor's responses seem so predictable. so why go to counseling, if i could just predict it? the insurance pays for counseling until november 2018. after that it costs 75 bucks an hour. cash. no way can/will i waste that amount of $$.



firemonkey
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 23 Mar 2015
Gender: Male
Posts: 4,572
Location: Calne,England

09 Feb 2018, 8:51 am

My care coordinator at the time told me I'm unsuitable. I'm guessing if I'd bought into the "You're a terrible person" propaganda , and succumbed to being repeatedly verbally flagellated , I would have been 'suitable'.


_________________
Support mental health research
Please support mental health research
http://www.mentalhealthresearchuk.org.uk/
http://mcpin.org/
https://www.mqmentalhealth.org/


Your neurodiverse (Aspie) score: 133 of 200
Your neurotypical (non-autistic) score: 47 of 200
You are very likely neurodiverse (Aspie)


shortfatbalduglyman
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 4 Mar 2017
Age: 37
Gender: Male
Posts: 7,916

09 Feb 2018, 2:39 pm

Fire monkey

Maybe it has to do with location.

In England, things are different from US

The care coordinator maybe earns salary and works for someone

The current counselor works private practice. If she refuses a client, that is the same as refusing $$

The other counselors that I have had worked for someone. They earned salaries

One psychologist at Kaiser had the nerve to make comments about my appearance.

He did not care if I was his client. Doesn't affect his income



Tibergrace
Raven
Raven

User avatar

Joined: 14 Jan 2018
Age: 31
Gender: Female
Posts: 118

09 Feb 2018, 3:25 pm

My therapist is a really nice old lady.

I'm in therapy for dealing with my PTSD. Until recently we've been doing EMDR therapy, but the traumatic memories started to attach themselves to my "happy place" memories, so we stopped for the time being. Last session I basically just talked about stuff, which did feel helpful. I need to desensitize myself to the trauma more before I'm able to do EMDR and reprocess it. For the time being it's too distressing to really work with.

I like my therapist, but while we were doing EMDR I dreaded going to sessions, because the EMDR would intensify my symptoms and stir things up in my head, bring more to the surface. My palms would get sweaty and my heart rate would go way up prior to sessions. Sweaty palms is my sign for "panic mode incoming" lol. I would still go, regardless, because I know it's not supposed to be easy and I knew it would probably stir things up.



shortfatbalduglyman
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 4 Mar 2017
Age: 37
Gender: Male
Posts: 7,916

09 Feb 2018, 8:56 pm

thus far, all 35 plus counselors that i have had, tended to "oversell" counseling. they acted like counseling is for everyone. the community college counselor told me that "counseling can help". she was so vague/broad.

"can", "should", and "will" are all different things.

counseling is just talking. talking serves a function, but only goes so far.

talking versus doing.

actions, statements, thoughts, emotions.

some counselors acted like they were so innocent. like they "helped". so much.

some counselors have huge egoes.

"unfortunate thing that happened"
"i'm sorry"
"what?" "huh"
"help"
"hurt"
"people"
"care"
"important"

every. single. thing. is so dramatic.

actually i might be better off without a counselor.

maybe having a counselor since november 2016 made me codependent. and then after i have no counselor, i will still want or need someone to say that every slightest thing is an unfortunate thing that happened.

b/c i want to know how to reduce the intensity of emotions. feelings. not amplify them. not every waking moment/second needs to be an Oscar winning performance.



blazingstar
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 19 Nov 2017
Age: 67
Gender: Female
Posts: 4,631

11 Feb 2018, 7:55 am

This is a touchy topic for me. 8O

My opinion, that the vast majority of therapists don't know what they are doing and that therapy is frequently worse than useless, is one that I keep to myself because so many people I have met have described it as life saving and wonderful and whatever.

After reading these posts, it occurs to me that once again, my weird experiences in life may have had to do with the aspie ND connections and not me just being weird.

I would not deny therapy to anyone who found it helpful. I also stand by my experiences. Therapists I have seen are either unhelpful (ie, know less that I do about human behavior) or at worst, abusive (including verbal and sexual abuse.)


_________________
paralysis by over-analysis


shortfatbalduglyman
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 4 Mar 2017
Age: 37
Gender: Male
Posts: 7,916

11 Feb 2018, 9:11 am

Blazing star

"Sexual abuse?"

Did you report that counselor?

Or maybe nobody believed you or cared

Counselors can get away with a lot of bad things.

But some counselors sometimes are helpful for some clients



blazingstar
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 19 Nov 2017
Age: 67
Gender: Female
Posts: 4,631

11 Feb 2018, 6:35 pm

shortfatbalduglyman wrote:

But some counselors sometimes are helpful for some clients


I agree completely that some counsellors are good for some people. I also think it is presumptuous for a therapist to think they can tell others how to live their lives. And each one thinks their method is the one and only. Sort of like religion in that regard.

As for sexual abuse, it occurs way more often in the therapy office than one would think. But thanks for showing concern.


_________________
paralysis by over-analysis


shortfatbalduglyman
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 4 Mar 2017
Age: 37
Gender: Male
Posts: 7,916

12 Feb 2018, 8:50 am

Fire monkey

It sounded a bit condescending for a counselor to tell you what your post specified.

About "if you want to be a good person". It is vague and subjective what constitutes a "good person".

The counselor is just another human being in the solar system.

However, sometimes I wonder:. Counseling has its limits. Counseling is just talking

Anyone can talk and it is not illegal

Not every can legally practice medicine and assorted other job skills

"Loose lips sink ships"

"Actions speak louder than words"


Not every client could benefit equally from every counselor

The impact the counselor has on the client is not necessarily immediate, physical, obvious, direct, or static

Maybe some counselors have no impact, or a negative impact, on some clients. Even when both parties are doing their best



Britte
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 23 Nov 2014
Gender: Female
Posts: 8,136
Location: @

12 Feb 2018, 4:35 pm

It can take multiple experiences, before finding a therapist who is a good match, well suited to you and your needs. If you are determined to work with a therapist, I would continue to search, unless, of course, you must go with therapists whom are appointed to you. That could present some difficulty, I would presume. If you have the advantage of choosing a therapist, look at it like an interview process, then, once you've decided on one, decide on a probation period, and, if by the end of that period, they haven't been of benefit to you, or your progress, move onto the next. Just an idea. I know this might not work for everyone.



shortfatbalduglyman
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 4 Mar 2017
Age: 37
Gender: Male
Posts: 7,916

13 Feb 2018, 9:56 am

Maybe for some clients with particular goals (make friends, gorge less (eat),) counseling serves a function

However the counselor is just another human being. Besides fill out insurance forms, send clients to 5150, it appears that they do not do much besides talk.

Some of them talk so much, they act like the more they talk, the better of a job they are doing

The current counselor seems pretty sophisticated about my diagnoses. (Plural)

And that "helped" me feel better

But nothing makes me directly function better

Aside from homophobia, autism, depression, she just reframes everything i say with euphemisms. She makes it sound like I am a comic book superhero.

At first it felt good, but now it sounds like her standards for me are so low, that all she does is give lavish praise and empathy and euphemism

The counselor has little or no authority to "do" anything. Just :roll: blah blah blah blah :roll:


"Why" , "cool", "good" "what", "unfortunate thing that happened" "sorry" , "people", "help", "hurt", "want", "need", "how are you doing" , "huh", "felt bad" , "got mad".

At this point, (counseling started November 2016 and is scheduled to take until November 2018), maybe it appears that I could predict the response. With those above keywords. Vocabulary. In statements. In a standard fashion.

Someone more emotionally and socially normal than me, without a high school diploma. Much less a Master's in psychology. Could pretty much substitute the counselor

But then there is also the process of telling someone something

Maybe I am :cry: counseling refractory depression :roll:

But whatever

It's like counselors talking could do ten units of good and one hundred units of "hurt".

If the counselor had the authority to take action, then that could do twenty units of good and ten thousand units of harm

Maximum potential

But only if they took action

Instead of just condescendingly flapping their lil traps

Like the previous licensed clinical social worker

:roll:



:mrgreen:



Britte
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 23 Nov 2014
Gender: Female
Posts: 8,136
Location: @

13 Feb 2018, 12:22 pm

I understand, sfbg. I've had those very same experiences with some therapists. I was determined to find a therapist who I, actually, could talk to/express myself to, who was more, like an acquaintance I happened to meet and click with, who I could simply have an occassional/as needed, back and forth with, and acquire some helpful guidance and support from, targeted at specific situations I experience from time to time, and I finally, did.

After some of the negative experiences I've had with therapy, and reading of the struggles people have with the process of finding a therapist, I know how fortunate I am. I have been seeing a therapist, for several years, now, and she has helped me get through some of the most challenging aspects and moments of my life, as well as supported me with some excellent advice with life in general. I suppose I should add that my therapist works, specifically, with autistic adults and children, and this is extremely important and valuable to me, as I would think would be for most, if not all who need support with some of the challenges we can face.