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MissConstrue
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21 Feb 2018, 8:38 am

Ok I try not to let words like lady offend me but it’s hard not to grind my teeth and want say something of an equal nature. I had a particularly grueling incident in which a couple of guys kept shouting “Hey lady!" when they wanted refills or needed help with something on the menu. I realize context is everything and you can’t be offended about everything but why "lady"? I mean it would sound ridiculous if I were to say "Hey man!" unless it was maybe a friend or in an unprofessional setting. Again I try not to let it offend me but I just find it irritating.

That said, I’ve ironically been corrected for using the word "ma’am" in place of Miss when one doesn’t know the other’s last name. I was brought up to believe "Ma’am" was a formal way to address someone you didn’t know the but I guess it now has become synonymous with older woman. It’s been a habit of mine and I tend find myself in the same position as guys who use the word "lady".


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kraftiekortie
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21 Feb 2018, 10:49 am

Very condescending. And denigrating. I would have came up with a comeback.

Just tell them that this is not the Victorian Era, and that you want to be treated with respect.

I would have said something like "Pardon me?" with my eyebrows raised. This is not the way to talk to somebody.



MissConstrue
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21 Feb 2018, 3:31 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
Very condescending. And denigrating. I would have came up with a comeback.

Just tell them that this is not the Victorian Era, and that you want to be treated with respect.

I would have said something like "Pardon me?" with my eyebrows raised. This is not the way to talk to somebody.


Thanks. I thought maybe I was being too sensitive. I would’ve loved to come up with a comeback but I didn’t want to lose my job. I just get tired of it. I’m not sure if it’s because of where I live or I let a few bad apples ruin the majority.


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The_Face_of_Boo
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21 Feb 2018, 3:58 pm

(The only reason I posted here is because i noticed your name on the main listing on main page).

In my English understanding the word "Lady" is equivalent to 'gentleman' , not to 'man'.

So you have to comeback with a "Hey gentleman!".

It would sound better if you wear a court dress and them wearing the silly white wigs. :>



kraftiekortie
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21 Feb 2018, 7:48 pm

In this context, the word "lady" is used in the same way as the word "boy" was used with black men in the pre Civil Rights Era South (and the North, too).

It implies a servile relationship, with the "lady" as the "servant."

I happen to like the word "lady." I believe calling a woman a "lady," most of the time, means that the person respects the woman.

In the above instance, that's far from the truth.



kraftiekortie
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21 Feb 2018, 8:12 pm

Like anywhere, you have idiots in Missouri, and you have nice people in Missouri.

There are even rednecks in New York City.



MissConstrue
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22 Feb 2018, 9:31 am

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
(The only reason I posted here is because i noticed your name on the main listing on main page).

In my English understanding the word "Lady" is equivalent to 'gentleman' , not to 'man'.

So you have to comeback with a "Hey gentleman!".

It would sound better if you wear a court dress and them wearing the silly white wigs. :>


I almost thought of that but given the context, I think boys would have been a more appropriate term or maybe stingbums since they never tipped me and left a huge mess to clean up. I could only imagine the foppish wigs dangling in pints of ales.


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Chronos
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23 Feb 2018, 12:23 am

MissConstrue wrote:
Ok I try not to let words like lady offend me but it’s hard not to grind my teeth and want say something of an equal nature. I had a particularly grueling incident in which a couple of guys kept shouting “Hey lady!" when they wanted refills or needed help with something on the menu. I realize context is everything and you can’t be offended about everything but why "lady"? I mean it would sound ridiculous if I were to say "Hey man!" unless it was maybe a friend or in an unprofessional setting. Again I try not to let it offend me but I just find it irritating.

That said, I’ve ironically been corrected for using the word "ma’am" in place of Miss when one doesn’t know the other’s last name. I was brought up to believe "Ma’am" was a formal way to address someone you didn’t know the but I guess it now has become synonymous with older woman. It’s been a habit of mine and I tend find myself in the same position as guys who use the word "lady".


Why are you offended when being addressed with the word "lady"?

My grandparents used to summon waitresses by saying "Excuse me, Miss!" I seem to recall my mother thinking this was sexist but I've never questioned her as to why. I don't think it unreasonable that someone address me as "ma'am", "miss", or "lady" when attempting to get my attention and they don't know my name. I'm not particularly "lady like" but the terms still apply in these situations.



kraftiekortie
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23 Feb 2018, 7:34 pm

A waitress, or a person who serves a customer, is seen, by some people, to be in a servile position vis-à-vis the person benefitting from the service.

"Lady," within this specific context, can be interpreted, correctly, to be offensive. It implies that the server is in a servile position, and must bow down to the person being served.

Sort of like a black person in the South (circa 1950) being asked to get a white person water from a water fountain which "colored" people cannot drink from.

I'm not a person who gets offended easily--let me emphasize that. I don't believe in much of the "political correctness" of the present day.



Chronos
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23 Feb 2018, 10:12 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
A waitress, or a person who serves a customer, is seen, by some people, to be in a servile position vis-à-vis the person benefitting from the service.

"Lady," within this specific context, can be interpreted, correctly, to be offensive. It implies that the server is in a servile position, and must bow down to the person being served.

Sort of like a black person in the South (circa 1950) being asked to get a white person water from a water fountain which "colored" people cannot drink from.

I'm not a person who gets offended easily--let me emphasize that. I don't believe in much of the "political correctness" of the present day.


I understand, however I think the offensiveness of such a term being used as the OP experienced it might vary from place to place. I do believe I've heard it in the context the OP was in, however this tends to men who's first language is not English. I believe I've heard older Persian men use it before to get the attention of a woman who's name they don't know but I don't believe they intended it in any disrespectful or impolite manner. I've always found the Persians in my area to be extremely polite.



kraftiekortie
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23 Feb 2018, 10:17 pm

You have a point.....



MissConstrue
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23 Feb 2018, 11:53 pm

Chronos wrote:
MissConstrue wrote:
Ok I try not to let words like lady offend me but it’s hard not to grind my teeth and want say something of an equal nature. I had a particularly grueling incident in which a couple of guys kept shouting “Hey lady!" when they wanted refills or needed help with something on the menu. I realize context is everything and you can’t be offended about everything but why "lady"? I mean it would sound ridiculous if I were to say "Hey man!" unless it was maybe a friend or in an unprofessional setting. Again I try not to let it offend me but I just find it irritating.

That said, I’ve ironically been corrected for using the word "ma’am" in place of Miss when one doesn’t know the other’s last name. I was brought up to believe "Ma’am" was a formal way to address someone you didn’t know the but I guess it now has become synonymous with older woman. It’s been a habit of mine and I tend find myself in the same position as guys who use the word "lady".


Why are you offended when being addressed with the word "lady"?

My grandparents used to summon waitresses by saying "Excuse me, Miss!" I seem to recall my mother thinking this was sexist but I've never questioned her as to why. I don't think it unreasonable that someone address me as "ma'am", "miss", or "lady" when attempting to get my attention and they don't know my name. I'm not particularly "lady like" but the terms still apply in these situations.


I didn’t find highly offensive just irritating. Maybe they weren’t intentionally being offensive but it was like a thing with them. It was constantly..."Hey Lady!"..."Hey Lady!"...."I think that’s all for now...oh wait...HEY LADY!!"


I even gave them my name twice. :?


As for maa’m, I also did not know it mean "older woman"... In fact it was something I was taught to say as a sign of respect if you didn’t know the person’s name. Not all women get offended by it but some apparently do. I was even startled by one girl who asked to be called Miss or Ms the next time she came in. I had no intention of relating the title to age. This was when I working at a beauty counter inside a mall of mostly women as opposed to a quaint old bumpkin place where even "darling" is the norm.


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blackicmenace
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24 Feb 2018, 12:52 am

I can't comprehend how this is offensive to anyone. Lady is a polite and formal way to address a female. It's not as if they can address you by your given name if you're a stranger.


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The_Face_of_Boo
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24 Feb 2018, 2:27 am

In my country we still commonly use the french titles: Madame for married, Mademoiselle for the unmarried.

The confusing part is some really get offended if you use the wrong title with them - single women get offended when you call them by mistake Madame because it makes them feel older while married women feel being inapporprely addressed if you call them Mademoiselle by mistake , no man comprehends why, so you have to glare at the women’s hand as attempt to know their marital status before addressing them with the correct title.



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24 Feb 2018, 4:02 am

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
In my country we still commonly use the french titles: Madame for married, Mademoiselle for the unmarried.

The confusing part is some really get offended if you use the wrong title with them - single women get offended when you call them by mistake Madame because it makes them feel older while married women feel being inapporprely addressed if you call them Mademoiselle by mistake , no man comprehends why, so you have to glare at the women’s hand as attempt to know their marital status before addressing them with the correct title.


Is there perhaps a stigma being older unmarried female in Lebanon?



The_Face_of_Boo
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24 Feb 2018, 4:23 am

Chronos wrote:
The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
In my country we still commonly use the french titles: Madame for married, Mademoiselle for the unmarried.

The confusing part is some really get offended if you use the wrong title with them - single women get offended when you call them by mistake Madame because it makes them feel older while married women feel being inapporprely addressed if you call them Mademoiselle by mistake , no man comprehends why, so you have to glare at the women’s hand as attempt to know their marital status before addressing them with the correct title.


Is there perhaps a stigma being older unmarried female in Lebanon?


Such stigma exists everywhere - don’t you have the “lady with 20 cats” stigma?