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Do You Agree With the Definition of Religion in the First Post??
Absolutely YES! 6%  6%  [ 1 ]
Mostly Yes. 38%  38%  [ 6 ]
Maybe / Maybe Not. 19%  19%  [ 3 ]
Mostly No. 31%  31%  [ 5 ]
Absolutely NO! 6%  6%  [ 1 ]
Total votes : 16

AspE
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17 Aug 2018, 11:22 am

Karma is the supernatural aspect of Jainism that makes it a religion.



redrobin62
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17 Aug 2018, 11:57 am

^ To Jains, karma is a physical substance that exists everywhere in the universe. From the Jainpedia:

The foundation of Jainism starts with the first noble truth, which asserts the existence of karmic particles or 'karmons', as they are called here. These are unusual elementary particles in the sense that they interact with the soul as if they were spiritual photons. That is, Jainism explains life through the interaction of such small invisible atomic particles and the soul.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karma_in_Jainism

http://www.bbc.co.uk/religion/religions ... arma.shtml

http://www.jainpedia.org/themes/princip ... karma.html



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17 Aug 2018, 12:21 pm

redrobin62 wrote:
When you type "religion" in Bing, this is its first response: the belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power, especially a personal God or gods.

By that definition alone, Jainism is not a religion since we don't recognize or believe in any superhuman controlling power.

But in its second response, a particular system of faith and worship, Jainism can be ascribed to that. We do have rituals, beliefs and tenets we recognize, however, Jainism is so "scientifically" grounded around karmas that it may as well be a philosophy based on guidelines that requires faith.


Are the teachings of Jainism not meant to achieve Nirvana? Belief in the supernatural is a part of the religion although they don’t refer to the supernatural as god.


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AspE
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17 Aug 2018, 12:34 pm

redrobin62 wrote:
^ To Jains, karma is a physical substance that exists everywhere in the universe. From the Jainpedia:

The foundation of Jainism starts with the first noble truth, which asserts the existence of karmic particles or 'karmons', as they are called here. These are unusual elementary particles in the sense that they interact with the soul as if they were spiritual photons. That is, Jainism explains life through the interaction of such small invisible atomic particles and the soul.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karma_in_Jainism

http://www.bbc.co.uk/religion/religions ... arma.shtml

http://www.jainpedia.org/themes/princip ... karma.html

They may very well call it a physical fact, but these particles as well as the concept of soul cannot even theoretically be verified, so its a faith position. Trying to apply the terminology of science to a subject doesn't make it science.



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17 Aug 2018, 1:54 pm

Unfortunately, the option Yes doesn't
exist or other option as the Term Religion
is technically inclusive of the Provided Definition
but not Absolutely inclusive as Religion is much more
Complicated than what is provided above as some Study
Suggests that the Term is Wholly a Western Construct with
others Study suggesting that at core Religion is whatever Common
Bonds Bind Humans Working Together To Survive and Thrive as in this
Way at Core of this Definition of Religion, all Social Animals that and who
are 'Normal' and 'Healthy' Do Share Common Bonds that Bind in Life even if
only Innate Instinctual with Intuition for a Pack of Wild Wolves who Bind and Bond
Working Together in how they are Naturally Evolved to do to Survive and Even Thrive.
Humans and other Social Animals don't tend to Survive Well and certainly Don't Tend to Thrive
Well Without the Bonds of Binds that Keep the Social Group Working together to Make Subsistence
and Shelter and Mates to Reproduce With Successfully a Reality of Life Across the Lifespan all 'Naturally' as Such.

A Major Problem with some Humans at least is they come to a True Nature Deficit Disorder away from the Fact
that they ARE Social Animals at least when Healthy as Evolved who Do need these Binds and Bonds of at Least their
Innate Instinctual and Intuitive Nature to Survive and Thrive well as 'Naturally' Evolved. In Fact, some Humans through
their Abstract Constructs Shared as Collective So-Called Intelligence come to the 'real Illusion' that they are not even
Animals at all with Built-in Innate Instinctual and Intuitive Needs for Social Cooperation From Birth like any other
Social Animal who Lives with a Religion that is the Bonds of Binds that Make Life even Possible at all for that
Fulfillment of Food, Shelter and Success With Reproductive Mates. True, Humans with their Abstract
Constructs through Language and all other aspects of Culture Make Religion so complicated
now that some folks cannot even come to a common understanding of What Religion even
means and that too is the Beast of the Nature of the Culture We Co-Create; it's up to us to
Determine what is illusion and or reality for us as yes with Imagination and Co-Creativity Humans
Do have the 'Definite' Ability now to Create a Religion of Both Hell and Heaven on Earth and Within the
'tween of that too; and even insist they Hate Now as Hell and Look Forward to a Heaven after they Die.
Meanwhile, some folks don't even really Try to Make Heaven now; other Animals are incredibly Smarter
than Humans this way in the Dark Human Parts of Religion that do Create a Self-Fulfilling Prophecy of Hell now
for all
practical
intents and
Purposes of either
Joy Loves Company
or Misery Loves Company
now in General of Course and the 'tween of that too.

Define Faith; that's at Least a Novel and a Bible more
for sadly some folks only Believe That Means Believing a Lie in what they see is Hell now;
Put a Very Social Animal; A Dolphin, in an Aquarium Tank with no other Dolphins to Interact with
in Common Bonds that Bind even if that is only a Sonar Response of Communication as such and some study
at least Suggests they will Commit Suicide over both Loneliness and reduced Stimulation of an 'Artificial Environment'.
Meanwhile, Humans Sit Still in Front of Screens all day while we wonder why the Rates of Addiction and Mental illness
are still rapidly increasing along with Nature Deficit Disorder too as My 'More Beyond Pantheist Eyes' see as nothing
more
as less
as God Deficit Disorder
Same too. Oh yeah that's
the other thing; some folks
Believe in a God they Can't see.

That the Strangest thing of all to me still now
for I saw/see God in all of Existence Forevernow
before i could/can Speak at age 4; in other words
it's more than words God that is all that is
to
me
at Least.

At Core all of Human
Language is Metaphor as
well as Culture at Core of
what Language is; in other
Words all Words are Poetry
for those who see Deeper
Than Sidewalks and
Concrete Life
all
Black and
White that is just
another Definition
of Hell to me at least
as without the Colors of Life more
and the Grass off the Sidewalks now to
Dance and Sing on always Changing Stimulating
More now i might Need a Beer or a Cup of Coffee or a Cigarette or even a 'gun' now.

Anyway, i go to Church for the Flesh and Blood Connection to Hold Hands with other Humans and Sing
and we go to Church Functions like Casino Trips even though I don't Gamble to continue my Humanity
in Retirement as the Wife and I don't have any Children now. I get off this Computer Screen and Dance
166 Miles a Month and am even identified by the Metro Area Public Audience as a Dance Legend now not
much of an achievement really considering i'm the only 6 Foot and 240 LBS Muscular 58 Year old Dude
who has done it over 9700 Miles now in about 5 years now. I write Poetry all around the Globe in terms
of 6 Million Words in the Same 5 years now and I do get Lovely Social Reciprocal Communication from
Jainist Indian Female to Muslim Widowed Female to Southern Baptist Pastor's Wife too. We Humans
need that the back and forth of Flesh and Blood Love too. Yeah; last night for the 224th Week
of Dance at the Biggest Dance Hall in my Metro Area, a Young 21 or so Year old Blonde Woman
Cheered me all night long in Dance and Spanked my Fully Clothed Butt and Chest on the Dance
Floor too. It's True in that place at Least i am the 'Cheers' 'Norm' of Dance heHe; selfie Autographs
coming in each week that i comply with at Ease with a Dance and Song of Smiles now more too more.

I could have stayed just on this Internet Site the Rest of my Retirement if i just did
what everyone else does here. Do more if you can and will is what I do now sure as
Hell in Hell Beats Shut-in in my Bedroom For 66 Months; yes this is MY Religion
and this
is
MY Heaven
now inclusive
of all the other Religions
and the rest of all that is (GoD).

I Don't need Faith; I do Faith; I am Faith;
And for all practical intents and purposes
where Folks see all of me i am Love too and that's Great too..;)


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redrobin62
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17 Aug 2018, 9:03 pm

The Jain concept of karma and karmic matter is a complex one, way too complicated for this space. I have, however, linked to one source. In summary, karmic matter binds to souls as they travel through the universe. Since souls are the same, the matter that binds to it explains why we turn out so different, have inequalities in mental and physical attainments, why we have different species, and so on.

http://www.jainbelief.com/intro_jainism.htm

As per nirvana: Nirvāna means final release from the karmic bondage. When an enlightened human, such as an Arihant or a Tirthankara, extinguishes his remaining aghatiya karmas and thus ends his worldly existence, it is called nirvāna. Technically, the death of an Arhat is called their nirvāṇa, as he has ended his worldly existence and attained liberation. Moksha (liberation) follows nirvāṇa. However, the terms moksa and nirvana are often used interchangeably in the Jain texts.[9][10] An Arhat becomes a siddha, the liberated one, after attaining nirvana.

As per science: The Jain concept of science is based on the rational pursuit of knowledge, uncluttered by dogma and seeking to peel away layers of misconception. Words like physics, metaphysics and cosmology get thrown around often. Alternatively, Jain cosmology is a fascinating, albeit complex one and, therefore, there is no space here to discuss it.

http://www.jainpedia.org/themes/princip ... ought.html

http://jainworld.com/philosophy/science-and-jainism/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jain_cosmology