what happens if Kavanagh gets into supreme court?

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B19
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08 Oct 2018, 3:08 am

It's not at all unusual for those who run and win elections as rank populists to sell out their supporters once the populist achieves the level of autocratic power that was the hidden goal all along. Then these populists change their feathers, they quickly discard the naive who put them in power, and replace them with new backers whose interests are far more aligned with the real and hidden agenda.

There are some signs of this already. Trump increasingly chooses to align himself with congressional republicans who suit his own agenda, and will probably increase that alignment from now on, though he will be crafty enough to offer up the populist rah rah at the MAGA rallies to keep up the illusion of being "in it for the little people". The rhetoric is just that, though they can't see it yet.

His basic strategy for maintaining and increasing power is dividing the populace and formenting hatred. The MAGAs are foot soldiers in that hideous scheme. But Trump has to align himself with the congressional republicans because only they can protect him from the consequences of his mendacity, illegality and deceit. Their bargain with Trump is that in return they want even greater oligarchical power and privilege and wealth for themselves from him, and he is delivering on that bargain, as this week's example has so clearly demonstrated.

I believe some MAGAs will wake up, and it will be interesting to see what they do once that awakening takes place, when they see the sideshows were that and only that all along.



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08 Oct 2018, 4:05 am

...



Last edited by sly279 on 08 Oct 2018, 4:20 am, edited 1 time in total.

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08 Oct 2018, 4:19 am

I can’t stand Trump in the least. I am terrified that he or Pence will enact a repressive theocracy. I guarantee none of the countries in Europe have elected or tried to elect people like George Wallace, Jesse Helms, Strom Thurmond, or Roy Moore.

In Sweden, people like them would be in jail because nearly everything that came out of their mouths was hate speech. (Sweden has very strict anti-hate speech laws)

A while back, North Dakota signed into law the granddaddy of all abortion restrictions. Abortion is banned after 6 weeks (the point that the law’s supporters claim that a “heartbeat” can be “detected”), at a time when women don’t even know they’re pregnant—with no exceptions for rape or incest. Iowa passed a similar law last year.

The GOP strongly supports the War on Drugs, which the Nixon administration even admitted was a scheme to entrap African-Americans to throw them in jail and deprive them of their voting rights. This legacy continues 50 years later, with the endless massacre of blacks by law enforcement.

Some quotes attributed to recent GOP politicians:

“Evolution is a lie from the pit of hell”—Paul Broun

“If it’s a legitimate rape, the body can shut itself down”—Todd Akin

“Pregnancy from rape is a gift from God”—Richard Mourdock

“Those (racial slur) just want a holiday so we can pay them to be lazy”—Evan Meacham

(Arizona, where Meacham was governor, was the last state to make Martin Luther King Day a paid state holiday)

“Segregation today, segregation tomorrow , segregation forever”—George Wallace

“I say to the feminists, secular humanists, and gays: you helped this happen”—Jerry Falwell, referring to 9/11


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sly279
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08 Oct 2018, 4:38 am

You all remind me of Alex Jones, yiu should host your own liberal conspiracy radio show.



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08 Oct 2018, 4:58 am

B19 wrote:
It's not at all unusual for those who run and win elections as rank populists to sell out their supporters once the populist achieves the level of autocratic power that was the hidden goal all along. Then these populists change their feathers, they quickly discard the naive who put them in power, and replace them with new backers whose interests are far more aligned with the real and hidden agenda.

There are some signs of this already. Trump increasingly chooses to align himself with congressional republicans who suit his own agenda, and will probably increase that alignment from now on, though he will be crafty enough to offer up the populist rah rah at the MAGA rallies to keep up the illusion of being "in it for the little people". The rhetoric is just that, though they can't see it yet.

His basic strategy for maintaining and increasing power is dividing the populace and formenting hatred. The MAGAs are foot soldiers in that hideous scheme. But Trump has to align himself with the congressional republicans because only they can protect him from the consequences of his mendacity, illegality and deceit. Their bargain with Trump is that in return they want even greater oligarchical power and privilege and wealth for themselves from him, and he is delivering on that bargain, as this week's example has so clearly demonstrated.

I believe some MAGAs will wake up, and it will be interesting to see what they do once that awakening takes place, when they see the sideshows were that and only that all along.

Your analysis is mostly correct, but I don't believe that the MAGAs will wake up.



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08 Oct 2018, 8:44 am

There are two opposing views but rather than look for common ground and logically deal with the division, it seems from my perspective that you have just primarily learned how to throw stones, and all at the behest of cheerleaders standing on the sidelines.


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08 Oct 2018, 10:59 am

jimmy m wrote:
Since Kavanagh was subjected to significant character assassination, it will leave a mark. I suspect that the experience will affect him in the following way:

Within our legal system there is presumption of innocence. I suspect he will become a staunch advocate for the guarantees provided by the law. The Universal Declaration of Human Rights, article 11, states: "Everyone charged with a penal offence has the right to be presumed innocent until proved guilty according to law in a public trial at which he has had all the guarantees necessary for his defence.".

Kavanaugh was not charged with a penal offense. If and when he is ever charged with a crime, he will have the right to be presumed innocent until proved guilty.

There is no presumption of innocence for a civil matter. Getting nominated and confirmed to the US Supreme Court is a civil matter.

Kavanaugh wasn't subjected to "character assassination". By accepting nomination to the Supreme Court, Kavanaugh voluntarily put his entire life on review. Kavanaugh didn't like what the review turned up about him. The "Renate Alumnius" (sic) in his yearbook established by a preponderance of the evidence that Kavanaugh is a perp and that he is wholly unsuited for the post of Supreme Court justice.

A congressional investigation of Kavanaugh is in order and we may see one starting in January.



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08 Oct 2018, 1:49 pm

What claims made by Dr. Christine Blasey Ford have been collaborated. It appears the FBI did not uncover any.

Read the executive summary of the FBI’s supplemental investigation into Kavanaugh allegations

FBI’s Kavanaugh investigation was by the book — just like Democrats demanded

But I suspect there will be a round 2 that may focus on terminology written into a high school yearbook such as "Devil's Triangle" and "Boof" or in his college yearbook "Renate Alumnus".

Why the FBI’s Kavanaugh Investigation Is So Troubling

So I did a search of "Renate Alumnus" subtracting out the term "Kavanaugh" on Google and looked through the 7 pages of listings. I couldn't find a single historical one that was unrelated to the current dust-up. This is a very weak argument based on a historical perspective.

What about the references to Devil's Triangle? Two men who went to college with one of Kavanaugh’s high-school classmates (and knew Kavanaugh socially as well in the ’80s and ’90s) say this classmate taught them a drinking game with that name. That classmate and three others write separately that they made up the game during their time at Georgetown Prep:

“Devil’s Triangle” was a drinking game we came up with in high school. It was a variation on the game “Quarters.” When we played “Devil’s Triangle,” four people sat at a table. On the table, three small glasses of beer were arranged next to one another to form a triangle. Each of the four participants took turns being the “shooter.” The shooter attempted to bounce a quarter into one of the glasses.

So, six people have now said publicly that they played a drinking game called Devil’s Triangle that originated at Kavanaugh’s high school.
[Source: Devil’s Triangle: The Drinking Game

What about the word "Boof"? The term has several meanings:
- the most common usages is: a technique in white water kayaking (also rafting and canoeing) in which the paddler puts in a powerful paddle stroke at the top of a drop in order to pull the nose up and land the craft horizontally to maintain speed.
- using cannabis infused suppositories.
- the term was used to describe putting something up your rectum such as narcotics for smuggling.
Another student at the time refers to the meaning as "Farting". Boof Sleuthing
Obviously this is some form of slang used by a young high school student, a type of inside joke. Trying to honestly prove the usage of this slang from time long pasts may be very difficult, and thwart with logic fallacies.


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08 Oct 2018, 1:53 pm

There are going to be many more revelations and investigations with varying degrees of merit.

If the blue wave happens the Democrats will try to remove him via impeachment in the House and conviction in the Senate. They will fail because it is difficult to get 2/3rds of the Senate to vote to convict.


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08 Oct 2018, 5:01 pm

Could a communist or a Hugo Chavez/ Nicolas Maduro-type get elected governor of a state like North Dakota?


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09 Oct 2018, 6:18 am

People must not comprehend the fact that --- the Judge nominated by Obama , the Judge the democrats claim the Republicans denied -- voted in agreement on issues 93% of the time with Judge Kavanaugh while they sat on the same court of appeals.

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2018/sep/5/kavanaugh-garland-voted-together-93-pct-time/



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09 Oct 2018, 6:43 am

Shrapnel wrote:
People must not comprehend the fact that --- the Judge nominated by Obama , the Judge the democrats claim the Republicans denied -- voted in agreement on issues 93% of the time with Judge Kavanaugh while they sat on the same court of appeals.

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2018/sep/5/kavanaugh-garland-voted-together-93-pct-time/


This is true. However I'll play the devil's advocate and say the left would probably counter that it's the other 7% of the time that may be of critical importance to them. Abortion, for example, is a sacrament to the left (sacrament: a thing of mysterious and sacred significance). 93% concurrence would be immaterial if abortion fell into the 7% area of disagreement.


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09 Oct 2018, 12:27 pm

Shrapnel wrote:
People must not comprehend the fact that --- the Judge nominated by Obama , the Judge the democrats claim the Republicans denied -- voted in agreement on issues 93% of the time with Judge Kavanaugh while they sat on the same court of appeals.

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2018/sep/5/kavanaugh-garland-voted-together-93-pct-time/

Your point? He nominated a moderate conservative. The senile McTurtle blocked it anyways. If Obama was as partisan as Trump and the Repukes, he'd have nominate someone guaranteed to overturn the Citizens United decision.



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09 Oct 2018, 3:20 pm

Shrapnel wrote:
People must not comprehend the fact that --- the Judge nominated by Obama , the Judge the democrats claim the Republicans denied -- voted in agreement on issues 93% of the time with Judge Kavanaugh while they sat on the same court of appeals.

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2018/sep/5/kavanaugh-garland-voted-together-93-pct-time/

Maybe that remaining 7% is important.



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09 Oct 2018, 8:54 pm

I feel terrible about the remarks I made earlier in the thread.

I am very saddened, angry, and frustrated by the GOP’s hard right turn. Besides things like abortion, SSM, etc, I am worried that their policies are going to affect me personally. I am worried that they will try to enact an “abstinence and missionary only” sex policy. (Nearly every woman I’ve rejected romantically, I rejected because they said they were saving themselves for marriage). I am worried they will take my two favorite TV shows (The Simpsons and South Park) off the air and go back to days where you couldn’t even say the word “pregnant” on TV. To me, losing either of those shows would be like the death of a close family member. I am worried that art museums will be shut down in the name of “common decency”. I go to the Museum of Fine Arts almost *entirely* because of the naked statues.


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09 Oct 2018, 10:09 pm

ASPartOfMe wrote:
There are going to be many more revelations and investigations with varying degrees of merit.

If the blue wave happens the Democrats will try to remove him via impeachment in the House and conviction in the Senate. They will fail because it is difficult to get 2/3rds of the Senate to vote to convict.


There most definitely needs to be an actual investigation.

Quote:
Thee FBI investigation was extremely limited in scope and time; did not include interviews of Kavanaugh, Christine Blasey Ford, or approximately 40 others who say they tried to talk to the FBI but couldn’t get through; and did not look into the likelihood that Kavanaugh lied in his Senate testimony. Ford, whose report that Kavanaugh sexually assaulted her in high school is central to determining Kavanaugh’s fitness for the Supreme Court, offered to speak with the FBI, but was rebuffed.

https://www.mediamatters.org/blog/2018/ ... ugh/221574


The public knowing about the shoddy investigation is going to taint the supreme court which would hinder the public's trust in the court system.

If he's innocent, he's innocent.

If he's found guilty, well it's up the GOP to decide what to do from there if they maintain the senate. However, if he is found guilty - while I demonize many on the right, I doubt that they'd be that far gone that they stand by a man who has been found guilty. Maybe they would. But, I'm optimistic enough to believe they at least have the common decency not to.