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VegetableMan
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05 Oct 2018, 1:04 pm

A few weeks back, I responded to a meme on Facebook posted by an acquaintance defending political correctness. In a nutshell, I took the position that PC has gone to absurd levels and that the line defining what is and what is not acceptable speech keeps moving inward, and the context of what is being expressed no longer even matters. I made my argument very respectably. What did I get in return? Defriended and blocked! Seeing that the person in question wasn't really a friend, it didn't bother too much. In fact, it kind of made my day!


I used this quote from George Carlin to drive home my argument:


“Political correctness is America's newest form of intolerance, and it is especially pernicious because it comes disguised as tolerance. It presents itself as fairness, yet attempts to restrict and control people's language with strict codes and rigid rules. I'm not sure that's the way to fight discrimination. I'm not sure silencing people or forcing them to alter their speech is the best method for solving problems that go much deeper than speech." -- George Carlin


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05 Oct 2018, 1:07 pm

You committed the Unpardonable Sin.

You demolished their little fantasy world by Telling the Truth.


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VegetableMan
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05 Oct 2018, 1:16 pm

Fnord wrote:
You committed the Unpardonable Sin.

You demolished their little fantasy world by Telling the Truth.



Yeah. He was a rather nice chap, to be honest, and fairly intelligent. It's sad that people feel obligated to pick a political position and defend it no matter what. In this case, however, he had no argument or defense. If he had, he wouldn't have removed my content and blocked me.


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05 Oct 2018, 1:32 pm

I really don't like phony overly complex political correctness either (some people are way too easily offended) but at the same time I really hate bigotry and prejudice and we still get plenty of that.

I also feel that the latest form of racism is people denying that racism even exists. How many times have I heard somebody say "Race isn't an issue anymore!" while complaining for hours about how they think all black people are criminals? :roll:



Spooky_Mulder
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05 Oct 2018, 1:45 pm

TW1ZTY wrote:
I really don't like phony overly complex political correctness either (some people are way too easily offended) but at the same time I really hate bigotry and prejudice and we still get plenty of that.

I also feel that the latest form of racism is people denying that racism even exists. How many times have I heard somebody say "Race isn't an issue anymore!" while complaining for hours about how they think all black people are criminals? :roll:


/\ This. 110% this. To add to the second, the hypocrisy is becoming satirical now among the right: "None of us are Nazis!" "Right-Wingers elect former Neo Nazi to run as Senator." :|

Also the number of right-wingers who flat out deny Trump's bigotry despite it staring them in the face and the majority of minorities saying that yes - he is a bigot; hell many of his supporters even see it and that's why they love him so much.

Hate not to be politically correct but only blacks know best what is racist against blacks and only whites know best what is racist against whites; only lgbtq know best what is homophobic against lgbtq and only straights know best what is heterophobic against them; only people who are targeted actually know best what is bigoted against them and those like them since they are the ones getting targeted - controversial, I know, but I couldn't care less.

AT PERSON: "I'm offended you said I'm slow for being autistic, that's ableist."
NT PERSON: "Saying autistic people are slow isn't offensive, get real!"

There's a very noticeable divide between the two. Those targeted know best. It blatantly stands out that in regards to Trump it's very telling that it's white people telling a vast majority of black people he isn't racist against black people; or in other words these whites believing they know best what is racist against black people than black people do.



Last edited by Spooky_Mulder on 05 Oct 2018, 1:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.

VegetableMan
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05 Oct 2018, 1:48 pm

TW1ZTY wrote:
I really don't like phony overly complex political correctness either (some people are way too easily offended) but at the same time I really hate bigotry and prejudice and we still get plenty of that.

I also feel that the latest form of racism is people denying that racism even exists. How many times have I heard somebody say "Race isn't an issue anymore!" while complaining for hours about how they think all black people are criminals? :roll:



One of the problems I have with the left is they play the race card, or the homophobe card, etc., far too much. But just saying that can get you labeled a racist or a bigot.


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05 Oct 2018, 1:51 pm

Even talking about racism in the abstract can get you labelled as a racist.


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Spooky_Mulder
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05 Oct 2018, 1:51 pm

VegetableMan wrote:
TW1ZTY wrote:
I really don't like phony overly complex political correctness either (some people are way too easily offended) but at the same time I really hate bigotry and prejudice and we still get plenty of that.

I also feel that the latest form of racism is people denying that racism even exists. How many times have I heard somebody say "Race isn't an issue anymore!" while complaining for hours about how they think all black people are criminals? :roll:



One of the problems I have with the left is they play the race card, or the homophobe card, etc., far too much. But just saying that can get you labeled a racist or a bigot.


So a straight (I'm assuming) white believing he knows best what is both homophobic and racist than lgbtq and non-whites do, gotcha. :wink:

Personally, I'd never act like I know what is racist or not against white people nor what is heterophobic or not. But, that's just me. I don't tell other groups what should and shouldn't be offensive towards them, I let those groups inform me since I see them as being on the same level that I am. The weird thing is that this is somehow a radical notion.

Let me ask this question, does a Neurotypical know more than an Atypical what is bigoted against Atypical people? If so, why? If not, why not?



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05 Oct 2018, 1:58 pm

VegetableMan wrote:
TW1ZTY wrote:
I really don't like phony overly complex political correctness either (some people are way too easily offended) but at the same time I really hate bigotry and prejudice and we still get plenty of that.

I also feel that the latest form of racism is people denying that racism even exists. How many times have I heard somebody say "Race isn't an issue anymore!" while complaining for hours about how they think all black people are criminals? :roll:



One of the problems I have with the left is they play the race card, or the homophobe card, etc., far too much. But just saying that can get you labeled a racist or a bigot.

Sooo sorry you were even slightly inconvenienced in the persuit of racial equality. Should we sit in the back of the bus now?



VegetableMan
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05 Oct 2018, 1:59 pm

Spooky_Mulder wrote:
VegetableMan wrote:
TW1ZTY wrote:
I really don't like phony overly complex political correctness either (some people are way too easily offended) but at the same time I really hate bigotry and prejudice and we still get plenty of that.

I also feel that the latest form of racism is people denying that racism even exists. How many times have I heard somebody say "Race isn't an issue anymore!" while complaining for hours about how they think all black people are criminals? :roll:



One of the problems I have with the left is they play the race card, or the homophobe card, etc., far too much. But just saying that can get you labeled a racist or a bigot.


So a straight (I'm assuming) white believing he knows best what is both homophobic and racist than lgbtq and non-white people do, gotcha. :wink:



That's not what I said. I simply stated that the race card and the homophobe card is played far too much. And guess what? Not even the LGBT community is in total agreement on what constitutes homophobia.


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VegetableMan
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05 Oct 2018, 2:04 pm

AspE wrote:
VegetableMan wrote:
TW1ZTY wrote:
I really don't like phony overly complex political correctness either (some people are way too easily offended) but at the same time I really hate bigotry and prejudice and we still get plenty of that.

I also feel that the latest form of racism is people denying that racism even exists. How many times have I heard somebody say "Race isn't an issue anymore!" while complaining for hours about how they think all black people are criminals? :roll:



One of the problems I have with the left is they play the race card, or the homophobe card, etc., far too much. But just saying that can get you labeled a racist or a bigot.

Sooo sorry you were even slightly inconvenienced in the persuit of racial equality. Should we sit in the back of the bus now?



You're kind of proving my point.


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Spooky_Mulder
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05 Oct 2018, 2:04 pm

VegetableMan wrote:
That's not what I said. I simply stated that the race card and the homophobe card is played far too much. And guess what? Not even the LGBT community is in total agreement on what constitutes homophobia.


(1) If you don't - how can you determine and say whether it gets tossed around too much or not? I'm not presumptuous enough to say white people are whining too much about racism against them. But, that's just me though.

(2) This is true. However, those are more internal debates with people of like experience of which you don't have. As said, I know that some white people blatantly deny there's any racism against white people; I'd never be presumptuous as a non-white to say that whites are claiming there's racism against them too much. That's just me though.

Since to me anyone who assumes to know best, or acts like it, than the people being targeted - to me - comes off as arrogant. Thus, to me the only people who can truly make that judgment call and not come off pompous are those impacted by it.



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05 Oct 2018, 2:18 pm

I'll give you an example of the race card being played too much. During the Obama administration, I listened to many call those who simply disagreed with a particular Obama policy "racist." Would you agree that is a good example? Am I not allowed to have an opinion on that?


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Spooky_Mulder
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05 Oct 2018, 2:24 pm

VegetableMan wrote:
I'll give you an example of the race card being played too much. During the Obama administration, I listened to many call those who simply disagreed with a particular Obama policy "racist." Would you agree that is a good example? Am I not allowed to have an opinion on that?


Depending on the context that is a good example. As you are aware of though, many who didn't like Obama also continuously refuted where he was born, depicted him as a savage or a monkey, had lynching effigies, and multiple other things as well - all while saying that it isn't racism yet is in good fun. These are also typically the people who complained about the term "racist" getting thrown around too much; this is why minorities are always skeptical regarding one with those views.

Minorities are used to non-minorities discarding blatant bigotry and acting like the accusations are worse than the acts.



Last edited by Spooky_Mulder on 05 Oct 2018, 2:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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05 Oct 2018, 2:28 pm

As a gay man I'd consider being denied the right to same sex marriage in a supposedly free country a form of homophobia. I also consider it homophobic when gay men and gay women are gathered in a community and stoned to death or burned alive at the stake (something that actually happens in some parts of the world).

Edit: Also being denied the right to donate plasma if I have ever had sex with another man regardless if I actually have HIV or not.

As a Caucasian/Polynesian mix I find it racist when people refer to my real father as an "island n*****" or me a "white island n*****".

And as someone with Aspergers I find it offensive whenever somebody asks me if I want an a**burger. :roll:



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05 Oct 2018, 2:36 pm

Spooky_Mulder wrote:
VegetableMan wrote:
I'll give you an example of the race card being played too much. During the Obama administration, I listened to many call those who simply disagreed with a particular Obama policy "racist." Would you agree that is a good example? Am I not allowed to have an opinion on that?


Depending on the context that is a good example. As you are aware of though, many who didn't like Obama also continuously refuted where he was born, depicted him as a savage or a monkey, had lynching effigies, and multiple other things as well - all while saying that it isn't racism yet is in good fun. These are also typically the people who complained about the term "racist" getting thrown around too much; this is why minorities are always skeptical regarding one with those views.



Yeah, calling a person of color a "savage" or a "monkey" are perfect examples of blatant racism. I wouldn't go as far as to say all "birthers" were racists, though, even though I believe they were f'ing crazy. Some just merely hated liberals. I get your point. But just because racists are complaining about the overuse of the race card doesn't mean that it's not the case.


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