The censorious political left and free speech
18 Oct 2018, 4:28 pm
Tross wrote:
The extremes of both sides advocate for censorship, neither believe in free speech, and both annoy me to no end. I wish this horrid political climate would die a horrible death, but alas, stupid and annoying people will keep it alive rather than tearing it limb for limb and dumping it in the bottom of the ocean.
Oh, and here's my unpopular opinion: SJWs aren't true Liberals, and the Democrat party are Conservatives who just want the misinformed public to believe they're Liberals. SJWs believe in a "progressive" form of inequality, but that's still inequality. One of the pillars of Liberalism is equality for all, not equality for all who aren't straight, white and male.
As for the Democrats, I could probably write an essay on why they're actually Conservatives. To cite one clear example, the Democrats chose to back Hillary in the last election, who probably would have won had she not been caught red-handed conspiring to commit a very capitalist crime. Also, if you know her history, it's laughable that she should claim to be a champion for feminism. That's a ruse if I ever saw one. There's sufficient evidence that the lot of them have just as many corporate interests as their Republican brethren. The only difference is one party tries to hide their nature and appease left-leaning individuals, while the other doesn't.
Beyond political parties though, all this identity politics nonsense just grinds my gears, and no one who gets caught up in it that I've ever met truly believes in free speech.
Oh, and here's my unpopular opinion: SJWs aren't true Liberals, and the Democrat party are Conservatives who just want the misinformed public to believe they're Liberals. SJWs believe in a "progressive" form of inequality, but that's still inequality. One of the pillars of Liberalism is equality for all, not equality for all who aren't straight, white and male.
As for the Democrats, I could probably write an essay on why they're actually Conservatives. To cite one clear example, the Democrats chose to back Hillary in the last election, who probably would have won had she not been caught red-handed conspiring to commit a very capitalist crime. Also, if you know her history, it's laughable that she should claim to be a champion for feminism. That's a ruse if I ever saw one. There's sufficient evidence that the lot of them have just as many corporate interests as their Republican brethren. The only difference is one party tries to hide their nature and appease left-leaning individuals, while the other doesn't.
Beyond political parties though, all this identity politics nonsense just grinds my gears, and no one who gets caught up in it that I've ever met truly believes in free speech.
Honestly, it's hard to actually differentiate between SJWs and "liberals" (modern US meaning), the line looks more blurred. My perspective of it.
I also happen to think conservatives or the right feeling angry or persecuted is fair game. Just the equivalent tune of the left is more always-present and dominant.
I'm considered "right" in the modern US political climate.
18 Oct 2018, 10:21 pm
Hollywood_Guy wrote:
Honestly, it's hard to actually differentiate between SJWs and "liberals" (modern US meaning), the line looks more blurred. My perspective of it.
I also happen to think conservatives or the right feeling angry or persecuted is fair game. Just the equivalent tune of the left is more always-present and dominant.
I'm considered "right" in the modern US political climate.
I also happen to think conservatives or the right feeling angry or persecuted is fair game. Just the equivalent tune of the left is more always-present and dominant.
I'm considered "right" in the modern US political climate.
Conservatives are angry? You now control all three branches of government? What the more do you want? The majority of people don't like conservatives these days because you guys elected a narcissistic sociopathic bully for President. Keep crying about persecution though. If you can't take punches, stop dishing them out.
18 Oct 2018, 11:52 pm
NoClearMind53 wrote:
Hollywood_Guy wrote:
Honestly, it's hard to actually differentiate between SJWs and "liberals" (modern US meaning), the line looks more blurred. My perspective of it.
I also happen to think conservatives or the right feeling angry or persecuted is fair game. Just the equivalent tune of the left is more always-present and dominant.
I'm considered "right" in the modern US political climate.
I also happen to think conservatives or the right feeling angry or persecuted is fair game. Just the equivalent tune of the left is more always-present and dominant.
I'm considered "right" in the modern US political climate.
Conservatives are angry? You now control all three branches of government? What the more do you want? The majority of people don't like conservatives these days because you guys elected a narcissistic sociopathic bully for President. Keep crying about persecution though. If you can't take punches, stop dishing them out.
Majority? Like what 51% I’d hardly consider anything less then 75% a majority
It’s only the left I see calling people horrible things on this site. Which is probably why he feels how he does
ASPartOfMe
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Joined: 25 Aug 2013
Age: 66
Gender: Male
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Location: Long Island, New York
19 Oct 2018, 2:47 am
Hollywood_Guy wrote:
Tross wrote:
The extremes of both sides advocate for censorship, neither believe in free speech, and both annoy me to no end. I wish this horrid political climate would die a horrible death, but alas, stupid and annoying people will keep it alive rather than tearing it limb for limb and dumping it in the bottom of the ocean.
Oh, and here's my unpopular opinion: SJWs aren't true Liberals, and the Democrat party are Conservatives who just want the misinformed public to believe they're Liberals. SJWs believe in a "progressive" form of inequality, but that's still inequality. One of the pillars of Liberalism is equality for all, not equality for all who aren't straight, white and male.
As for the Democrats, I could probably write an essay on why they're actually Conservatives. To cite one clear example, the Democrats chose to back Hillary in the last election, who probably would have won had she not been caught red-handed conspiring to commit a very capitalist crime. Also, if you know her history, it's laughable that she should claim to be a champion for feminism. That's a ruse if I ever saw one. There's sufficient evidence that the lot of them have just as many corporate interests as their Republican brethren. The only difference is one party tries to hide their nature and appease left-leaning individuals, while the other doesn't.
Beyond political parties though, all this identity politics nonsense just grinds my gears, and no one who gets caught up in it that I've ever met truly believes in free speech.
Oh, and here's my unpopular opinion: SJWs aren't true Liberals, and the Democrat party are Conservatives who just want the misinformed public to believe they're Liberals. SJWs believe in a "progressive" form of inequality, but that's still inequality. One of the pillars of Liberalism is equality for all, not equality for all who aren't straight, white and male.
As for the Democrats, I could probably write an essay on why they're actually Conservatives. To cite one clear example, the Democrats chose to back Hillary in the last election, who probably would have won had she not been caught red-handed conspiring to commit a very capitalist crime. Also, if you know her history, it's laughable that she should claim to be a champion for feminism. That's a ruse if I ever saw one. There's sufficient evidence that the lot of them have just as many corporate interests as their Republican brethren. The only difference is one party tries to hide their nature and appease left-leaning individuals, while the other doesn't.
Beyond political parties though, all this identity politics nonsense just grinds my gears, and no one who gets caught up in it that I've ever met truly believes in free speech.
Honestly, it's hard to actually differentiate between SJWs and "liberals" (modern US meaning), the line looks more blurred. My perspective of it.
I also happen to think conservatives or the right feeling angry or persecuted is fair game. Just the equivalent tune of the left is more always-present and dominant.
I'm considered "right" in the modern US political climate.
“Liberals” in the 30’s to 70’s sense of the word are not much of a thing anymore. “Progressives” view some of the type of people liberals used to be for as impediments to historical eventualities of progress.
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ASPartOfMe
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19 Oct 2018, 3:22 am
NoClearMind53 wrote:
Conservatives are angry? You now control all three branches of government? What the more do you want? The majority of people don't like conservatives these days because you guys elected a narcissistic sociopathic bully for President. Keep crying about persecution though. If you can't take punches, stop dishing them out.
This is truth but partitally misleading. After massive gains in the last decade conservatives do control government. But the culture at large is progressive. The progressive bent of the mainstream media outside of Fox and “Hollyweird” has been discussed adnauseam. The influential companies used to be solidly Republican or neutral. A lot of the influential companies especially in the tech and social media are not only led by progressives but progressives willing to use the companies influence and money for example Apple supporting the boycotts of states over bathroom bills. Gay marriage is legal oppenents can scream all they want but there is nothing legal they can do about it same with abortion. Even if SCOTUS overturns these many if not most states and localities will allow it. Beyond gay to constant bombardment of sex in film and TV to course language and casual dress the America of 2018 offends thier sensibilities. While they have a right to say almost anything they want thier are certain words and opinions that if they choose to express them in public will result in a need to upgrade in security software and will limit their opportunity to earn a living.
_________________
Professionally Identified and joined WP August 26, 2013
DSM 5: Autism Spectrum Disorder, DSM IV: Aspergers Moderate Severity
It is Autism Acceptance Month
“My autism is not a superpower. It also isn’t some kind of god-forsaken, endless fountain of suffering inflicted on my family. It’s just part of who I am as a person”. - Sara Luterman
19 Oct 2018, 2:52 pm
ASPartOfMe wrote:
AspE wrote:
ASPartOfMe wrote:
AspE wrote:
I don't recall anyone on the left calling the press the enemy of the people, or apologizing for countries that murder journalists.
One side is probably worse than the other. We can engage in the oppression Olympics and spend days arguing about who that is. This obscures the situation we have which is that both sides are undermining this country by eating away at core values and the institutions set up to protect them.
No, both sides aren't doing that. One side is doing that.
.
Soviet Union, Mao They had apologists in their time.
Enemy of the people
Quote:
In the United States during the 1960s leftist organizations such as the Black Panther Party and Students for a Democratic Society were known to use the term. In one inter-party dispute in February 1971, for example, Black Panther leader Huey P. Newton denounced two other Panthers as "enemies of the people" for allegedly putting party leaders and members in jeopardy.
Then there all those hate speech codes and harrassment campaigns against people deemed Nazi or racist etc.
Facebook Page Ban Fox News
Should Fox News be shut down?
Move on Org Petition - Remove Fox News from cable TV
I find standards against Nazis and hate speech on a private platform perfectly reasonable. They incite violence.
While Trump endorses violence against a free press. As a representative of the Federal Government. This is far more dangerous and unacceptable, indeed it's unconstitutional.
19 Oct 2018, 3:03 pm
Usually, those who shout about being "offended" by mundane things and demand that those things be censored as a result are just immature attention seekers; they know that such attitudes are subject to media prominence because they're such easy pickings. What they don't realise is just that: that people are showering them with attention not because of any WORTH on the part of the attention seekers in question, but because they're so preternaturally stupid, narcissistic and gullible that that itself is newsworthy.
19 Oct 2018, 3:33 pm
Prometheus18 wrote:
Usually, those who shout about being "offended" by mundane things and demand that those things be censored as a result are just immature attention seekers; they know that such attitudes are subject to media prominence because they're such easy pickings. What they don't realise is just that: that people are showering them with attention not because of any WORTH on the part of the attention seekers in question, but because they're so preternaturally stupid, narcissistic and gullible that that itself is newsworthy.
That doesn't stop them from getting away with their actions and potentially misleading or brainwashing a majority of a country.
I don't know about any legal way to deal with that.
ASPartOfMe
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Age: 66
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Posts: 34,419
Location: Long Island, New York
19 Oct 2018, 4:18 pm
AspE wrote:
ASPartOfMe wrote:
AspE wrote:
ASPartOfMe wrote:
AspE wrote:
I don't recall anyone on the left calling the press the enemy of the people, or apologizing for countries that murder journalists.
One side is probably worse than the other. We can engage in the oppression Olympics and spend days arguing about who that is. This obscures the situation we have which is that both sides are undermining this country by eating away at core values and the institutions set up to protect them.
No, both sides aren't doing that. One side is doing that.
.
Soviet Union, Mao They had apologists in their time.
Enemy of the people
Quote:
In the United States during the 1960s leftist organizations such as the Black Panther Party and Students for a Democratic Society were known to use the term. In one inter-party dispute in February 1971, for example, Black Panther leader Huey P. Newton denounced two other Panthers as "enemies of the people" for allegedly putting party leaders and members in jeopardy.
Then there all those hate speech codes and harrassment campaigns against people deemed Nazi or racist etc.
Facebook Page Ban Fox News
Should Fox News be shut down?
Move on Org Petition - Remove Fox News from cable TV
I find standards against Nazis and hate speech on a private platform perfectly reasonable. They incite violence.
While Trump endorses violence against a free press. As a representative of the Federal Government. This is far more dangerous and unacceptable, indeed it's unconstitutional.
What is deemed Nazis and hate speech and is Nazi or hate speech are sometimes two different things. Fox news for all of its bluster and conspiracy theories has not advocated genocide. Trump for all of his authoritarianism has not done genocide. Then there is a matter of practicality. Fox news is lucrative and I believe the number 1 rated cable news channel. There are maybe a few hundred Proud boys, a few hundred Nazi marchers in Charlottsville and one willing to murder not an existential threat. If these people present a legitimate threat they are not the problem, we are. If they are inciting violence pressure the police to arrest the bastards.
The problem with the censorious left is the over expansion of what is defined as hate speech and who is a Nazi. These lines are getting so blurred if the real Nazis come I fear they will be thought of as another tired stunt.
A person who uses “colored people” was most likely out of date not practicing racist hate speech. But in an overeaction to the censorous left you have a bunch of people actually racist or not using the phrase to own the libs and now the lines are blurred further making it harder to determine the proper context.
_________________
Professionally Identified and joined WP August 26, 2013
DSM 5: Autism Spectrum Disorder, DSM IV: Aspergers Moderate Severity
It is Autism Acceptance Month
“My autism is not a superpower. It also isn’t some kind of god-forsaken, endless fountain of suffering inflicted on my family. It’s just part of who I am as a person”. - Sara Luterman
19 Oct 2018, 6:12 pm
ASPartOfMe wrote:
This is truth but partitally misleading. After massive gains in the last decade conservatives do control government. But the culture at large is progressive. The progressive bent of the mainstream media outside of Fox and “Hollyweird” has been discussed adnauseam. The influential companies used to be solidly Republican or neutral. A lot of the influential companies especially in the tech and social media are not only led by progressives but progressives willing to use the companies influence and money for example Apple supporting the boycotts of states over bathroom bills. Gay marriage is legal oppenents can scream all they want but there is nothing legal they can do about it same with abortion. Even if SCOTUS overturns these many if not most states and localities will allow it. Beyond gay to constant bombardment of sex in film and TV to course language and casual dress the America of 2018 offends thier sensibilities. While they have a right to say almost anything they want thier are certain words and opinions that if they choose to express them in public will result in a need to upgrade in security software and will limit their opportunity to earn a living.
I think the right is just constantly looking for scapegoats. They need a way to explain why millennial aren't doing as well financially as the boomers were at the same age. Since they're 100% unwilling to criticize capitalism in any way, they cannot blame external economic factors. They must blame individual character flaws as the cause of the economic decline of the middle class. The younger generations are simply weak, feminine, and lazy. That and we're being swamped by undesirable immigrants. This is how they think. It's all lizard-brain gut-level BS.
RetroGamer87
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20 Oct 2018, 6:48 pm
ASPartOfMe wrote:
NoClearMind53 wrote:
Conservatives are angry? You now control all three branches of government? What the more do you want?
This is truth but partitally misleading. After massive gains in the last decade conservatives do control government. But the culture at large is progressive.These conservatives thought their opinions were facts while thinking climate change and evolution are opinions. They felt very strongly about free speech, especially for people who agree with them.
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The days are long, but the years are short
20 Oct 2018, 7:22 pm
RetroGamer87 wrote:
These conservatives thought their opinions were facts while thinking climate change and evolution are opinions. They felt very strongly about free speech, especially for people who agree with them.
They feel very strongly about free speech yes, but only if it suits their agenda. They will support the free speech of a bakery using its power denigrate gays who go in to buy a wedding cake, yet howl at the moon like crazy if a restaurant owner asks Sarah Huckabee to leave. Free speech laced with double standards is what they seem to support IRL, they appear extremely intolerant of people who don't toe their lines even having a public voice - witness the recent example of them fiercely harassing a NZ school teacher and trying to get her fired from her job, because they thought (wrongly) that she was an American woman in the USA who had dared to criticise their hero.
It reeks, it really, really does.
20 Oct 2018, 7:51 pm
The bakery refused to print a political message on the cake. No one should be forced to do that in a free society.
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20 Oct 2018, 7:54 pm
RetroGamer87 wrote:
ASPartOfMe wrote:
NoClearMind53 wrote:
Conservatives are angry? You now control all three branches of government? What the more do you want?
This is truth but partitally misleading. After massive gains in the last decade conservatives do control government. But the culture at large is progressive.These conservatives thought their opinions were facts while thinking climate change and evolution are opinions. They felt very strongly about free speech, especially for people who agree with them.
But it’s liberals who control cultur and control 90% of media and all social media they want to tell everyone what they can say and how to think.
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