Florida yoga studio shootings - Incel terrorism?

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LoveNotHate
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06 Nov 2018, 11:19 am

Seems like a "terrorist" needs to instill terror in the public.

However, angry youtube videos, and sloppy killings doesn't appear to do that.


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Drake
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06 Nov 2018, 1:57 pm

Where is the ongoing threat? Where are the demands? You can't have terrorism without these. He was alone and is dead. There is no threat, no terror, nothing to fear.

Even the school shooters, who have created that ongoing fear, are not terrorists because there are no demands and they're not aligned.



cberg
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06 Nov 2018, 2:02 pm

LoveNotHate wrote:
Seems like a "terrorist" needs to instill terror in the public.

However, angry youtube videos, and sloppy killings doesn't appear to do that.


Oh so you're saying killing members of the public isn't terrorism? There is a big difference between desensitization & reality you're ignoring.


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cberg
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06 Nov 2018, 2:03 pm

Drake wrote:
Where is the ongoing threat? Where are the demands? You can't have terrorism without these. He was alone and is dead. There is no threat, no terror, nothing to fear.

Even the school shooters, who have created that ongoing fear, are not terrorists because there are no demands and they're not aligned.


There is an ongoing threat consisting of anyone who shares ideals with these terrorists.


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Drake
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06 Nov 2018, 2:05 pm

cberg wrote:
LoveNotHate wrote:
Seems like a "terrorist" needs to instill terror in the public.

However, angry youtube videos, and sloppy killings doesn't appear to do that.


Oh so you're saying killing members of the public isn't terrorism? There is a big difference between desensitization & reality you're ignoring.

Not by itself it isn't. You need to do more than that. Look, this is terrorism:



Tollorin
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06 Nov 2018, 2:08 pm

Drake wrote:
cberg wrote:
Can we stop splitting hairs & just call terrorists terrorists? The only reason for me to care about the questions of who, what, where, when & why are IF & ONLY IF that might serve to protect someone in the future.

Good, so then we can agree that this guy wasn't a terrorist.

There's a difference between a terrorist and an extremist.

Must I understand that the 9/11 plane hijackers were not terrorists? They were extremists after all.



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06 Nov 2018, 2:12 pm

Tollorin wrote:
Drake wrote:
cberg wrote:
Can we stop splitting hairs & just call terrorists terrorists? The only reason for me to care about the questions of who, what, where, when & why are IF & ONLY IF that might serve to protect someone in the future.

Good, so then we can agree that this guy wasn't a terrorist.

There's a difference between a terrorist and an extremist.

Must I understand that the 9/11 plane hijackers were not terrorists? They were extremists after all.

They were part of a group that was trying to get something. And they'd been launching attacks long before they hijacked those planes.



cberg
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06 Nov 2018, 2:15 pm

Anyone who kills out of self-righteous discrimination is a terrorist.


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Drake
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06 Nov 2018, 2:25 pm

Why is this so hard to understand? It seems so simple to me.



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06 Nov 2018, 3:29 pm

Terrorism is not just an individual's violent intent, but also the perception of the victims and public at large of that violence. In northern Ireland, members of the IRA see themselves as freedom fighters, but their victims definitely know them to be terrorists. Ideology taken to the extreme to where lives are violently lost is terrorism. This idiot became a terrorist the second he walked into that yoga class with a gun. As I've already posted, I fully understand how literally painful loneliness can be because I had once been there, but the shooter and others like him have turned this into a misogynistic ideology that has more than once turned homicidal.


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LoveNotHate
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06 Nov 2018, 3:49 pm

Terrorist: "a person who uses unlawful violence and intimidation, especially against civilians, in the pursuit of political aims".

Killing these women didn't achieve any "political aims".

He has no "aims".

He's an angry, mentally-ill person who finally popped.


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cberg
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06 Nov 2018, 4:41 pm

His political aim was to further misogyny & to associate loner guys with violence by force.


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06 Nov 2018, 5:55 pm

LoveNotHate wrote:
Seems like a "terrorist" needs to instill terror in the public.

However, angry youtube videos, and sloppy killings doesn't appear to do that.


Drake wrote:
Where is the ongoing threat? Where are the demands? You can't have terrorism without these. He was alone and is dead. There is no threat, no terror, nothing to fear.

Even the school shooters, who have created that ongoing fear, are not terrorists because there are no demands and they're not aligned.


All that means is that what the deceased tried to do failed if that is what he was trying to do, but it is all about the intent.

The 9/11 hijackers and Timothy McVeigh did not make a list of demands. Does that mean I have been wrong all these years about them being terrorists?

I agree that most school shooters are not terrorists as their motives if known at all seems personal


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06 Nov 2018, 6:15 pm

Tallahassee yoga studio shooting: Gunman's ex-student describes bizarre classroom behavior

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The man behind a mass shooting at a yoga studio was teaching in a Central Florida school district months ago.

Since the shooting, information about his past has emerged, including his history working as a teacher in two school districts.

There were multiple complaints about Beierle's erratic behavior during the application process with Leon County Schools, but he was still approved.

Because of concerns after his firing, the district said it changed how it interviews candidates.

Three Volusia County sisters told WFTV on Monday that Volusia County Schools should also consider changing its policies.

"It was exactly this time last year actually. That could have so easily been us in that situation," Savannah Fulcher said.

"I felt sick, because it was, like, the first moment that I was in his class. I knew something was wrong," Sarah Gillespie said.

Last year, the three sisters said they told a parent and a guidance counselor that Beierle, their Hinson Middle School teacher, made them feel uncomfortable.

"He would just stare at you very deeply and for such a long time, and he would never look away from you," Fulcher said.

They also said Beierle nicknamed and called on female students but not male students.

Worried her daughters and friend weren't being taken seriously, Nicole Gillespie called the school.

"His Facebook account was sketchy," she said. "I looked it up. I looked up his LinkedIn account. It showed he could not keep a job. I mean, these are all red flags."

A note in Beierle's personnel file shows the school heard from Gillespie.

It outlined her concerns about previous arrests but no conviction for battery.

The note asked if there were any concerns to warrant PSD, which stands for professional standards disqualification.

Shortly thereafter, Beierle was no longer in their classroom. Nine months later, the district terminated him for unprofessional conduct. Five months later, the Tallahassee shooting happened.

"It could have very easily been our schools. It could've been my girls," Nicole Gillespie said. "I just don't even want to think about that. It just hits a little too close to home."

The girls said they want to know why Volusia County Schools moved Beierle instead of terminating him after their complaints.

The district has not given WFTV an answer yet.


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cberg
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06 Nov 2018, 6:21 pm

That's about enough hair splitting. I'm not concerned about how personal the motives for an attack may be, I'm concerned about people's inconsistent responses to violence depending upon its' perpetrators.


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06 Nov 2018, 6:30 pm

cberg wrote:
That's about enough hair splitting.

This is a forum for autistic people :D


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