Better with machines than people :(

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cberg
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04 Dec 2018, 12:06 am

serpentari wrote:
well its a choice u make) anything, that suits u, feels better at this specific moment. but ya it often so happens, that people keep what they actually want to say (like hey cberg, get ur ass out of that nook and lets go booze) out of respect for what they perceive as ur comfort zone. and they might perceive wrong, or ur priorities can change) so if u want somebody in ur real life to keep u company, maybe try signalling them about it?) (like if u dont want to be very verbal about it, u could just like, come up to them when they are chilling, and see the reaction? have a good reason for that too, like refilling ur tea, just in case)))



I honestly wish my closest friends would just ignore my comfort zone more because I know there's no progression within it. I'm a very simple & loyal person when I set aside the technicalities and someone's actually listening.

The rest of the time I'm usually digging myself deeper in some logic problem & it makes me wonder if the knowledge gap is driving everyone away.


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serpentari
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04 Dec 2018, 2:19 am

or they are giving u space? because they just dont know u actually want to be bugged and dragged out?) yes, thats the issue. i have that. does that person just respectfully keep distance (and understand, that telling a paranoid person "trust me" is not gonna work) or they just cant stand me? and ya i give what i consider elaborate signals, but it looks like NT ppl dont think so. and if u want to connect wiht them, especially if it is specific people, u have to as much as literally tell them u want to be bugged. hard thing to do, ya. because turns out, many of my signals "talk to me" are read as "f**k off right NAU". maybe u have the same issue?


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cberg
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04 Dec 2018, 3:01 pm

I absolutely know how that goes. I think that the less I try to arrange things my way, the happier everyone will be around me, essentially because everyone just shakes me off if I want to do anything on my terms. I have a lot of trouble contacting anyone because of this. I think I just have to let them start the conversation when they finally do want to see me.


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serpentari
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04 Dec 2018, 3:24 pm

there are people in my real life, who really can do 1 best thing for me - f**k off and not get in my face, my flat, my life. close relatives. i cannot say anything about what exactly happens to ur contacts, given that i dont see them, but maybe if they are not engaging u, f**k them too?) find ppl who will want u^^


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sanity is a prison. insanity is doom. is there a third option, please?
beware the ire of the patient ones!
and if i walk away, who is gonna stay? i believe to make the world be a better place.


cberg
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04 Dec 2018, 4:24 pm

I have that problem more with my immediate family than my friends, who often treat me more like family than anyone else even if they're the ones I can't get ahold of. I think they're kind of waiting for me to fix my home life, which in my case means months more work just to get anywhere near enough money for rent around here.

I think the paranoia in this country is dividing everyone in every possible way. Considering who's running the place I'm not inclined to blame anyone for responding to my shyness by ignoring me. I can't really change who knows me best but hopefully I can manage to make them comfier around me.


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serpentari
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04 Dec 2018, 4:48 pm

cberg, i spent 30 years trying to make them comfier around me. only to be blamed again and again i dont do well enough. aspiration turn to fear and desperation, nothing's ever good enough for them. i now refuse to talk to 2 of my progenitors (mother and grandmother) before THEY make ME comfier around them. ofc they dont. if somebody, family or not, does not return ur emotion, they dont deserve it. end chapter, end book. yes family sometimes is disfunctional, for aspergerians most of all(((


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sanity is a prison. insanity is doom. is there a third option, please?
beware the ire of the patient ones!
and if i walk away, who is gonna stay? i believe to make the world be a better place.


cberg
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04 Dec 2018, 5:48 pm

Hmph. It feels better to love someone unconditionally than for me to selectively ignore them because they see things differently. I don't expect everyone to be in my life all the time but I also think this is mostly on me. I don't want to assign blame to other people for my own weirdness.

If someone doesn't share my emotions that's OK with me, my emotions are really confusing & they're not based on the same factors as most people. Considering how my family can be, I don't want to be that way towards anyone else. I'm not trying to exclude anyone from my life because I've seen my parents do just that & I want no part in it. I think there are ways to transcend this nonsense in order to stick together.


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serpentari
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04 Dec 2018, 6:38 pm

i am sorry. we are different persons, with different families, and different stories. i should not project, please forgive me. but i am not assighning blame for my weirdness. for my trauma, i do. i dont know how ur family can be. but it feels like u are being excluded from it, and u suffer that way. unless its u who does the excluding, like well what we autists do. i was not "loved unconditionally" to do that back. i was not loved. i was gaslighted, ghosted and denied an identity, and forced into playing a role of child they wanted to have, who was not me. i have a feeling something like this happens to u, but i could be alltogather wrong, and then please forgive me. it feels like u are accepting blame for being weird. blaming urself. because had been taught so. i could be wrong. i hope so. cause the longest hours i've had in my life were the ones i went through to know i was right. i hope i am not projecting my own experience and thus, misunderstanding u and ur problems, that could be all different from mine, and i have just an illusion they are simmilar. being weird is well, same as being white or not white. being man or woman. its waht u are born with. it cant be blame to anybody. least of all, urself. i had went thru hell to understand that.


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sanity is a prison. insanity is doom. is there a third option, please?
beware the ire of the patient ones!
and if i walk away, who is gonna stay? i believe to make the world be a better place.


cberg
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04 Dec 2018, 9:55 pm

You're right; I think the amount of this BS I see from my parents is a major factor in my isolation. I think my family is so skilled at gaslighting me that I've gotten stuck in mental wards as a result. They NEVER keep their noses out of my decisions. If I make any choice they dislike, I will not hear the end of it unless I do the exclusion thing & strictly say I am not a family member if/when they treat me this way.

I'm a black sheep for sure. My friends seem to appreciate that but it doesn't make things any easier for us.


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serpentari
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05 Dec 2018, 2:04 am

well then we are back at the previous point. all communication is a 2way street. if somebody wants to make it 1way, they better be cut off. for ur own safety first of all. i was so used to well, catering to them, letting them sham me for autistic behaviour, etc, that i never realised it was wrong. being brought up that way u dont even f*****g consider what they do is WRONG. and then u are branded as socially unacceptable jerk, because u treat others the same way u were treated urself from childhood and up. yes, it is a real f*****g killer when u cant connect with people, who should, as of nature, be ur unconditional and ultimate support. instead they leech of u emotionally and mistreat u in a f*****g subtle way that makes u believe its all right. its not. i learned that the hard way. i cant stand it, i cant see my mother's face, because now i know how badly she f****d me up before i could even realise it. and then she wouldnt admit it ofc. so ya the thing about "they finally come to appriciate me", it wont happen. they will want u to deserve it ya, and they will never decide that u did. thats what gaslighting is all about. making u think u didnt deserve it. i gave a lot of chances. a lot of explanations how to at least not hurt me. they were all ignored. i know better than to try again. i refuse to talk to them any more. full autistic mode, take that b*****s. im done pretending NT for u. ofc i am totally deranged and its nothing but my depression and they can force me to take a pill that will unfuck me and make me comfortable again. like f**k. dont let this happen to u, cberg. cut it earlier.


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sanity is a prison. insanity is doom. is there a third option, please?
beware the ire of the patient ones!
and if i walk away, who is gonna stay? i believe to make the world be a better place.


cberg
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05 Dec 2018, 4:33 pm

I think someone basically told me most of that in other words. My #1 fear is that I treat other people too coldly because I've never seen any other example firsthand. If I get depressed it's better to talk to the family that picked me vs. my family that's stuck with me. Pills do nothing but if I say so I'm forced to consume that many more. Side effects could kill me but as long as the part of me people disagree with is mostly dead, the pills are 'working'. I'm too accustomed to being told my emotions are wrong.


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"I fly through hyperspace, in my green computer interface"
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Raleigh
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05 Dec 2018, 5:19 pm

Feelings aren't wrong, they're how you feel.
Doesn't stop people from judging you because of it.
My feelings aren't often visible to others, but I feel deeply.
Externally, I'm non-feeling, unless I'm laughing or crying, that's about it.


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serpentari
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05 Dec 2018, 5:29 pm

gaslighting. i was right. this is what it does, u dont believe urself in the end. its one universal lie, and in the world of hatred and pain, u dont know urself, and its their damn fault. yes, fear of mistreating people. my own daughter to start with. how the hell am i to do good parenting if what i got was... well this. im f*****g trying. theese limitations, planted before u could even build an identity. built into ur identity. tearing them out is even bigger pain than living with them. when u just start trying to imagine what it can be like. when u hear people tell u, that it can be different. when u find out ur behaviour is not normal, but its all u ever knew. ya. been there had that, and if all the tshirts were actually real i'd be rich by selling them. dont wait for them to actually appriciate u. they had not in decades of ur life, they will not. they want u to cater to them. dont. stick with friends. thats what saved my life and keeps saving it. gaslighters never stop. and allways make it sound like they are right, and u are deranged. and with lifelong habit to believe that, its hard to fight. and its tearing u apart. this is NOT right. u are NOT deranged. u are feeling the danger, even when u dont understand where it comes from. it comes from whoever should have protected u. and that is so impossible to believe. this is my parent they cant be f*****g me up. they cant be dangerous to me. now i lie to myself so i can believe her as she disassembles my mind. i am sorry i cant write well and coherent, im so f*****g thin today. hold on. u have somebody to appriciate u, be with them. listen to them. let urself believe them, and not whoever f***s with u. hardest thing ever, fight on. hold on.


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sanity is a prison. insanity is doom. is there a third option, please?
beware the ire of the patient ones!
and if i walk away, who is gonna stay? i believe to make the world be a better place.


cberg
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05 Dec 2018, 7:25 pm

First of all thanks for the motivational f bombs :jester: the world needs more deadly serious positivity.

I understand you entirely but the trouble is that I have to wait around & work myself mad before I can see most of those people. Most of what I can do for my friends & myself socially is about pushing us to learn as much as we can. I'm thinking that the only antidote to a bunch of negative conditioning surrounding us all is more knowledge & better things to think about.


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-Georges Lemaitre
"I fly through hyperspace, in my green computer interface"
-Gem Tos :mrgreen:


cberg
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05 Dec 2018, 11:48 pm

Raleigh wrote:
Feelings aren't wrong, they're how you feel.
Doesn't stop people from judging you because of it.
My feelings aren't often visible to others, but I feel deeply.
Externally, I'm non-feeling, unless I'm laughing or crying, that's about it.


I'm not sure how aware I am of my outward demeanor. I'm trying to find more ways of getting a break from judgemental culture(s) and just have good conversations at the very least.


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"Standing on a well-chilled cinder, we see the fading of the suns, and try to recall the vanished brilliance of the origin of the worlds."
-Georges Lemaitre
"I fly through hyperspace, in my green computer interface"
-Gem Tos :mrgreen:


serpentari
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06 Dec 2018, 4:46 am

im doing what i can, and i am glad to see it does something for u. u clearly are closer to the surface, and quite sure to break it, at that. yes, good conversations) u can do that. u are interesting, u got good ability with language apart from many other things. u can formulate neatly. many ppl can not. yes, ofc, factor of time when u cant meet with ur good guys, is a hinder, but one managable, m?) just seek in the right direction from now on) (motivational F bomb - f*****g relax and enjoy it when u get it!)


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sanity is a prison. insanity is doom. is there a third option, please?
beware the ire of the patient ones!
and if i walk away, who is gonna stay? i believe to make the world be a better place.