Christianity, just a bunch of greedy liars or real evil?

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Hsingai
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18 Dec 2018, 9:51 pm

Now I know Christian will argue over my use of the word 'evil' because 'Evil' in christianity is to go against the will of god and it is god's will for humanity for suffer; but I'm using it is the colloquial sense of "Evil is the exercise of power to intentionally harm (psychologically), hurt (physically), or destroy (mortally or spiritually) others and to commit crimes against humanity." as Philip Zimbardo puts it.

Quote:
"the savages don't know money, their needs are very
limited, and they ask only for shotguns, ammunition, axes. machetes, mirrors, and occasionally hammocks." An Indian he described as a corpulent
and ugly savage declined to accept anything. On being pressed he replied,
"I don't want anything. I've got everything."
The whites insisted again that he must ask for something. Finally he
retorted, "I want a black dog!"
"And where am I going to find a black dog or even a white one if there
aren't any in all of Putumayo?" asked the rubber station manager.
"You ask me for rubber," replied the savage, "and I bring rubber. If I ask
for a black dog you have to give me one ."


In 1609, when the same Captain Smith, dissatisfied with trade negotiations resorted to bluster and threats, Powhatan made the following reply. "I an now old, and must soon die; and the succession must descend, in order, to my brothers, Opitchapan, Opekankamough, and Catataugh, and then to my two sisters, and their two daughters. I wish their experience was equal to mine; and that your love to us might not be less than ours to you. Why should you take by force that from us which you can have by love? Why should you destroy us, who have provided you with food? What can you get by war? We can hide our provisions, and fly into the woods; and then you must consequently famish by wronging your friends. What is the cause of your jealousy? You see us unarmed, and willing to supply your wants, if you will come in a friendly manner, and not with swords and guns, as to invade an enemy. I am not so simple, as not to know it is better to eat good meat, lie well, and sleep quietly with my women and children; to laugh and be merry with the English; and, being their friend, to have copper, hatchets, and whatever else I want, than to fly from all, to lie cold in the woods, feed upon acorns, roots, and such trash, and to be so hunted, that I cannot rest, eat, or sleep. In such circumstances, my men must watch, and if a twig should but break, all would cru out, 'Here comes Captain Smith'; and so, in this miserable manner, to end my miserable life; and, Captain Smith, this might be soon your fate too, through your rashness and unadvisedness. I insist that the gun and swords, the cause of all our jealousy and uneasiness, be removed and sent away."

Quote:
In Tahiti a Missionary Society was about this time set on foot by King Pomare, who at the first meeting of its members reminded the assembled natives how large a portion of their time had hitherto been spent in worshipping idols — how large a part of their property had been consecrated to their false gods — and how many lives had been sacrificed to their honour; and all this, said he, was done for what was no God, being generally nothing more than a piece of wood or a cocoa-nut-husk ! He contrasted how little they were now called upon to give in the service of the true God, with what they used to spend in the service of idolatry, and said, though they had no money, yet they might give pigs, arrow- root, cocoa-nut-oil. and cotton, "to buy money." He insisted, however, that there should be no compulsion — that what was given should be given voluntarily, and that those who did not contribute, should not be evil spoken of on that account.....and in consequence they were under no subjection, and could not be easily collected together for instruction. The same causes produced idleness and indolence among the people generally; for men would not readily work for that of which they felt no need. To create, therefore, among them artificial wants, was found the only means of forming in them habits of industry; and for this purpose the missionaries taught them to make clothes, and hats, and bonnets for themselves, and endeavoured to introduce the cultivation and manufacture of sugar on the islands, as well as of coffee and cotton. These failed at first, from ill-designing Europeans telling the natives that should the sugar-works succeed, people would come from beyond sea, and seize their lands, and make slaves of the natives.


And some Yanomamo, themselves, believe the miners have brought death to the human race. "Many people ask for the White man's things. I say to them, "Don't ask for those things. The miners are only going to lie to you. They've already killed some of our people. They're very fierce. When there are enough of them, they are going to kill us. That is what I say, but no one hears me."

The miners say, "Before the miners arrived here the Indians lived their normal life. They lived in the jungle, but now they have more comfort, they have more food and the miners bring them progress. They bring them food, clothes all the things that they need and the Indians adore the miners."

They only give then food until the Indian become dependant on the miner's food then they stop giving it.

Where they just taking advantage of the savages or do christians really believe it better world that is based on the opposite of positive psychology, that it is better to be worked to the bone doing another man's bidding, ever wanting more and on the edge of survival than to be free from subjugation, to have everything you want and having a life a leasure?

History has shown that they don't just want to ride on the coattails of others but that they want to make others suffer like themselves suffer. They refuse to support others even when it would benefit themselves to do so, like giving free homes to the homeless. Do Christians really believe that they are being selfless by sacrificing to punish the unworthy?


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Fnord
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19 Dec 2018, 9:23 am

Are you saying that ALL Christians are evil, or are you just trolling for reactions?



Arganger
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19 Dec 2018, 11:29 am

Christians aren't evil.
We are normal people that look up to and follow God.


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LoveNotHate
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19 Dec 2018, 12:19 pm

Good news is that modern Christians are slowly getting on board with a changing culture.

Image


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Taradine
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19 Dec 2018, 1:04 pm

^ i love that picture.


christians are usually a bunch of harmless older people, in my experience. i can't remember interacting with any christian children, then again i live in a rather godless part of the country.


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19 Dec 2018, 3:12 pm

Christianity is blamed for many of the evils in history where, in actual fact, if one looks at the Bible, the actions in question were prohibited. Some of the English and other settlers in America may have used "Christianity" to justify their wickedness, but what they were actually using was a distortion of Christianity as taught in the Bible. It's so easy to get Christianity and the Church confused, but they are two different things; all the Churches in the world that I know of, with the possible exception of the Quaker Church preach the moral equivalent of precisely the OPPOSITE of the Gospels in most cases.

I'm not a Christian, by the way, but I think the only evil Christianity per se is guilty of is the intellectual evil of imposing a rigid framework of belief upon its followers not subject to intelligent discourse.



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19 Dec 2018, 5:02 pm

I think a lot of Christains can be annoying and they have done terrible things in the name of Jesus over the years, but they are not "evil". They are no more or less evil than any other religion or even atheists.

Also some Christains will do nice things too. The money that gets donated to Catholic charities goes towards helping many of the less fortunate. They do missionary work where they offer food and aid to those living in places devestated by war, disaster, and poverty, and many of these "evil" Christians operate homeless shelters and soup kitchens. Without them many homeless people wouldn't be able to get food or a shelter to sleep in.

There are some Christains who are very horrible and selfish (I honestly feel the same way about some atheists despite being close to being one myself), but there are also some who really do believe in doing right by their fellow man.

It's just unfair to me to label them all as evil just because not everyone agrees with their religous beliefs. When people do that to Judiasm or Islam they get hated for it, but it's somehow OK to hate all Christians and claim that they are "evil"? That's bologna!



shlaifu
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19 Dec 2018, 7:17 pm

The examples OP has provided aren't particular to Christianity, though, but to a form of 'civilizationism', for lack of a better word.
The belief that one people is civilized and is its own creation, whereas the other is in a state of nature, and as such part of nature.
And nature is what civilization exploits and puts to work for its advancement.

It's racist, but more than that, because it sees everything non-human as fuel for its economy - including the humans that were considered less than human.

If anything,christianity is a spanner in the works of this conception, as it promises the hope of salvation to all humans - a unique idea, from which humanism evolved.
I'm no fan of christianity, but not everything any christian did or does is driven by his love for jesus. So... Yes, greed, but that's not unique and solely Christian.


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naturalplastic
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19 Dec 2018, 7:59 pm

Is Hsingai ...just a wife beater?

Or, is he really evil?



Hsingai
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19 Dec 2018, 8:58 pm

Prometheus18 wrote:
Christianity is blamed for many of the evils in history where, in actual fact, if one looks at the Bible, the actions in question were prohibited.
They are also encouraged by it. "Even the devil can quote scripture"

You're confusing what Christians call 'The Truth' with the " the beliefs and practices of the belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power based on the person and teachings of Jesus of Nazareth "

"Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword.
For I have come to turn "'a man against his father, a daughter against her mother, a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law--

You don't become a Christian by reading the Bible, you become an Atheist is.

Christianity isn't taught by the Bible it is taught by preachers.

Apperntly it's easy to get the worship of god as practiced by the people that call themselves Christians and the Bible confused too.

"I'm not a Christian, by the way, but I think the only evil Christianity per se is guilty of is the intellectual evil of imposing a rigid framework of belief upon its followers not subject to intelligent discourse."

If by Christianity you mean the Bible I would have to agree with you


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Hsingai
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19 Dec 2018, 10:10 pm

TW1ZTY wrote:
I think a lot of Christains can be annoying and they have done terrible things in the name of Jesus over the years, but they are not "evil". They are no more or less evil than any other religion or even atheists.

THanks for your completely off topic remark. You would also have to agree that they are no more evil than Nazis. Since you obviously don't correlate the amount of evil one does with evil they are



Quote:
It's just unfair to me to label them all as evil just because not everyone agrees with their religous beliefs.
Then don't do it. No one is claiming Christians are 'morally wrong or bad; immoral; wicked' for their religious beliefs. I said that their alleged worship practices caused people harm.

Nazis aren't evil because they believe Gypsies/homosexuals/etc. were cosmic evil. They are evil because they tried to commit genocide and for starting constant wars.

Quote:
When people do that to Judiasm or Islam they get hated for it, but it's somehow OK to hate all Christians and claim that they are "evil"? That's bologna!
non sequitur. but Funny. Atheist say the same thing

Are you implying that it's ok to hate someone because they are labeled as evil?

Are you trolling me or are you really that bad at verbal communication? You have a good grasp of metaphor so that suggest you're not autistic.


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Lumir
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19 Dec 2018, 10:15 pm

I believe that Christianity is a great evil, but not the Christians themselves. The people of Europe were violently pulled away from their original pantheons and forced to adopt the foreign Abrahamic religion. From then on, the successfully converted Europeans would pass Christianity down to their children. They don't simply choose their religion, and after they've been told as children, most of them are not going to put the mental energy into discovering truths they don't want to hear and then changing their views accordingly.



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19 Dec 2018, 10:24 pm

Hsingai wrote:
TW1ZTY wrote:
I think a lot of Christains can be annoying and they have done terrible things in the name of Jesus over the years, but they are not "evil". They are no more or less evil than any other religion or even atheists.

THanks for your completely off topic remark. You would also have to agree that they are no more evil than Nazis. Since you obviously don't correlate the amount of evil one does with evil they are



Quote:
It's just unfair to me to label them all as evil just because not everyone agrees with their religous beliefs.
Then don't do it. No one is claiming Christians are 'morally wrong or bad; immoral; wicked' for their religious beliefs. I said that their alleged worship practices caused people harm.

Nazis aren't evil because they believe Gypsies/homosexuals/etc. were cosmic evil. They are evil because they tried to commit genocide and for starting constant wars.

Quote:
When people do that to Judiasm or Islam they get hated for it, but it's somehow OK to hate all Christians and claim that they are "evil"? That's bologna!
non sequitur. but Funny. Atheist say the same thing

Are you implying that it's ok to hate someone because they are labeled as evil?

Are you trolling me or are you really that bad at verbal communication? You have a good grasp of metaphor so that suggest you're not autistic.


How the hell am I trolling you? You're paranoid.



Hsingai
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20 Dec 2018, 1:13 am

TW1ZTY wrote:
How the hell am I trolling you? You're paranoid.

By implying I think Christians are evil. Claiming all religions are just as bad a Christianity. Implying that I hate all Christians. So where you just rambling on on a tangent or did you think I said those things?


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20 Dec 2018, 3:11 am

Topic has descended into personal attacks.

Locked.


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