Alabama Woman Regrets Joining ISIS and Wants to Return Home
Campin_Cat
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https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/ ... eturn-home
Speaking from al-Hawl refugee camp in northern Syria, while her 18-month-old son played at her feet, Muthana said she misunderstood her faith, and that friends she had at the time believed they were following Islamic tenets when they aligned themselves to Isis.
“We were basically in the time of ignorance […] and then became jihadi, if you like to describe it that way,” she said. “I thought I was doing things correctly for the sake of God.”
...
Muthana fled her home and took a flight to Turkey in November 2014 after several months of planning, which she kept secret from her family.
She settled into the Syrian city of Raqqa, then one of Isis’s two main hubs – the other being Mosul in Iraq – where she married an Australian jihadist, Suhan Rahman, the first of her three husbands.
Rahman was killed in the town of Kobanî, and soon afterwards Muthana angrily tweeted: “Americans wake up! Men and women altogether. You have much to do while you live under our greatest enemy, enough of your sleeping! Go on drivebys, and spill all of their blood, or rent a big truck and drive all over them. Veterans, Patriots, Memorial, etc day … Kill them.”
For many months in 2015, her Twitter feed was full of bloodcurdling incitement, and she says she remained a zealot until the following year. She now says her account was taken over by others.
...
I turned to my religion and went in too hard. I was self-taught and thought whatever I read, it was right.
“I look back now and I think I was very arrogant. Now I’m worried about my son’s future. In the end I didn’t have many friends left, because the more I talked about the oppression of Isis the more I lost friends. I was brainwashed once and my friends are still brainwashed.”
...
Muthana describes her experience with Isis as “very mind-blowing”. “It was like a movie. You read one book and think you know everything. I’m really traumatised by my experience. We starved and we literally ate grass.”
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Muthana said she had not been in contact with US officials since her capture. “I would tell them please forgive me for being so ignorant, and I was really young and ignorant and I was 19 when I decided to leave. I believe that America gives second chances. I want to return and I’ll never come back to the Middle East. America can take my passport and I wouldn’t mind.”
So, should she be allowed to return, here?
Should she be tried for treason, or get a free pass cuz she was a "kid" and didn't know any better?
What if it is her TRUE plan to return, here, recruit others, and return THERE?
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White female; age 59; diagnosed Aspie.
I use caps for emphasis----I'm NOT angry or shouting. I use caps like others use italics, underline, or bold.
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Sweetleaf
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I'd say bring her home and have her face legal consequences, with the consideration of her age if she was a minor when she joined. I certainly wouldn't say bring her back and have all forgiven with a pat on the back that is for sure.
I understand adolescents and teens can get mixed up into bad things, doesn't necessarily mean they are irreedemable for life.
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We won't go back.
I've seen it argued that trying ISIS-members for treason would give legitimacy to ISIS as a state, which would be exactly what they'd want.
And I'd say it's a bit too late to conveniently find your conscience and get homesick now that ISIS are all but obliterated. Much as I'd usually be in favour of giving second chances, I suggest following Britain's lead on this.
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Campin_Cat
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Ah, an added wrinkle.....
I just heard on the radio that the State Department is saying that this woman is NOT a U.S. citizen, and will not be allowed to return----GOOD, if it's true. Her lawyer, however, is saying that she IS, and was born in Hackensack, NJ, and has a U.S. passport----surely he knows those things can be faked!!
_________________
White female; age 59; diagnosed Aspie.
I use caps for emphasis----I'm NOT angry or shouting. I use caps like others use italics, underline, or bold.
"What we know is a drop; what we don't know, is an ocean." (Sir Isaac Newton)
I just heard on the radio that the State Department is saying that this woman is NOT a U.S. citizen, and will not be allowed to return----GOOD, if it's true. Her lawyer, however, is saying that she IS, and was born in Hackensack, NJ, and has a U.S. passport----surely he knows those things can be faked!!
Could she have given up her citizenship when she left? Maybe that's what they mean by she isn't an American citizen, that she isn't an American citizen anymore.
Campin_Cat
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Joined: 6 May 2014
Age: 62
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Location: Baltimore, Maryland, U.S.A.
I just heard on the radio that the State Department is saying that this woman is NOT a U.S. citizen, and will not be allowed to return----GOOD, if it's true. Her lawyer, however, is saying that she IS, and was born in Hackensack, NJ, and has a U.S. passport----surely he knows those things can be faked!!
Could she have given up her citizenship when she left? Maybe that's what they mean by she isn't an American citizen, that she isn't an American citizen anymore.
Well, AFAIC, she renounced her citizenship when she went over there, to fight against us; but----and I don't know this, for a FACT----I would think that if one wanted to renounce their citizenship ("isn't an American citizen anymore"), they would have to write a letter, or fill-out a form, or something (to be deleted from the database), and I don't think she would've done that, cuz she didn't even want her family to know what she was doing (therefore, if she was ever a citizen, she would've been in the database).
_________________
White female; age 59; diagnosed Aspie.
I use caps for emphasis----I'm NOT angry or shouting. I use caps like others use italics, underline, or bold.
"What we know is a drop; what we don't know, is an ocean." (Sir Isaac Newton)
Apparently she wasn't just a foot soldier, or a cook, or a supply truck driver, but was a high profile face on social media for ISIS recruiting. Like a later day Tokyo Rose (not an exact analog, but like that).
Dunno if that makes a difference or not.
If she turns out to have been a citizen, then yes, it would depend. If she joined when she less than voting age then I would say that she is not totally responsible for making a bad political decision. And I am sure that the DOD would want to borrow her at Gitmo just to milk her for intelligence. Maybe her stint there could double as a kind of therapeutic deprogramming (like they do for kids taken from cults), and then they can consider her cured of ISIS, and then let her home.
I just heard on the radio that the State Department is saying that this woman is NOT a U.S. citizen, and will not be allowed to return----GOOD, if it's true. Her lawyer, however, is saying that she IS, and was born in Hackensack, NJ, and has a U.S. passport----surely he knows those things can be faked!!
Could she have given up her citizenship when she left? Maybe that's what they mean by she isn't an American citizen, that she isn't an American citizen anymore.
Well, AFAIC, she renounced her citizenship when she went over there, to fight against us; but----and I don't know this, for a FACT----I would think that if one wanted to renounce their citizenship ("isn't an American citizen anymore"), they would have to write a letter, or fill-out a form, or something (to be deleted from the database), and I don't think she would've done that, cuz she didn't even want her family to know what she was doing (therefore, if she was ever a citizen, she would've been in the database).
It's very costly to renounce your citizenship.
In 2014-2015, it was $2, 350.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Renunciat ... itizenship
I don't think she could afford it.
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Campin_Cat
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In 2014-2015, it was $2, 350.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Renunciat ... itizenship
I don't think she could afford it.
I dunno..... Her father was, at one time, an ambassador from his home country (some "brown" country, I think - I can't remember which one - not Libya or Namibia [actually, those are "black" countries] - it has an I A sound); so, I'm thinking they have money, and that amount would be a pittance----plus, someone has retained a lawyer, for her. She could've told her father she needed the money for college, or something - a little at a time, for books, or something (she was attending the University of Alabama, IIRC).
_________________
White female; age 59; diagnosed Aspie.
I use caps for emphasis----I'm NOT angry or shouting. I use caps like others use italics, underline, or bold.
"What we know is a drop; what we don't know, is an ocean." (Sir Isaac Newton)
How does the U.S. government fund a terrorist group, and consider them the enemy? That's a bit of a pencil scratcher, eh?
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