Trump's part in the New Zealand mass shooting

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karathraceandherspecialdestiny
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15 Mar 2019, 7:07 pm

Yahoo News: Brenton Tarrant: Christchurch shootings suspect said Trump is 'symbol of white supremacy'

Vox: The New Zealand shooter called immigrants “invaders.” Hours later, so did Trump.

Trump's policies and the way he talks about immigrants and PoC directly leads to violence like this. If only he were capable of feeling shame, he would be swimming in it now for the whirlwind he has reaped by supporting and talking up white supremacy.



cyberdad
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15 Mar 2019, 8:45 pm

Trump's role is in terms of emboldening people on the fence about taking action on their prejudice.

There's no doubt Trump's public comments about Obama being a Kenyan, Mexicans being rapists and Africans being undesirable Americans because they come from "shithole coutnries" (all his words) have given free publicity to the Alt-right movement in America and some semblance of respectability to racists.

Any wonder the gunman attributes his actions (at least in part) to Donald Trump. Trump has recently tried to play this down
https://www.apnews.com/a1fa7fd40d2a427fac6a04e0ba113f25

Statistics seem to support a rise in white violence
https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics ... rimes-2017



VegetableMan
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15 Mar 2019, 9:36 pm

cyberdad wrote:
Trump's role is in terms of emboldening people on the fence about taking action on their prejudice.

There's no doubt Trump's public comments about Obama being a Kenyan, Mexicans being rapists and Africans being undesirable Americans because they come from "shithole coutnries" (all his words) have given free publicity to the Alt-right movement in America and some semblance of respectability to racists.

Any wonder the gunman attributes his actions (at least in part) to Donald Trump. Trump has recently tried to play this down
https://www.apnews.com/a1fa7fd40d2a427fac6a04e0ba113f25

Statistics seem to support a rise in white violence
https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics ... rimes-2017


Whatever happened to personal responsibility? Humans, by nature, are tribal and violent by nature. But one man is responsible for unleashing these forces? Come on! It's all good and fine to point out Trump's racism and nationalism; it's another altogether to pin the entire blame on him for every hate crime. Again, and I keep reiterating this same point time and time again, but Trump is a symptom, not the problem. These polemic political arguments do nothing but widen the divide.


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15 Mar 2019, 9:48 pm

The left is really getting creative(sarcasm). If we get another hole in the ozone, I'm sure it will be because Trump farted.

Trump: "White supremacists are bad people, horrible people"

Just typical Trump calling for white supremacy in coded language only the insane portion of the left can decipher.

for the people who have missed this. There is an estimated 150,000 white supremacists in the US, there is an estimated 42,000,000 people who believe white people shouldn't be allowed to have an opinion on particular subjects(hint, they are part of the left). So which group do we really have to worry about causing racism to rise up? There are I think, about 7,000,000(2% of 350,000,000) people with schizophrenia, I don't think we have to worry about people with schizophrenia rising up, why should we feel we are in danger of 150k people rising up? How would you expect Trump to seek support from such a small fraction of society? Why would you believe such radical ideas? Which is spread by the 12%(42 million). Trump supporting them would do far more damage to his courier, if he supported white supremacy he would not have been voted in, there is not 175 million white supremacists in the US , the overwhelming majority of people in the US are strongly against white supremacy.



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15 Mar 2019, 10:11 pm

Crimadella wrote:
The left is really getting creative(sarcasm). If we get another hole in the ozone, I'm sure it will be because Trump farted.

Trump: "White supremacists are bad people, horrible people"

Just typical Trump calling for white supremacy in coded language only the insane portion of the left can decipher.

for the people who have missed this. There is an estimated 150,000 white supremacists in the US, there is an estimated 42,000,000 people who believe white people shouldn't be allowed to have an opinion on particular subjects(hint, they are part of the left). So which group do we really have to worry about causing racism to rise up? There are I think, about 7,000,000(2% of 350,000,000) people with schizophrenia, I don't think we have to worry about people with schizophrenia rising up, why should we feel we are in danger of 150k people rising up? How would you expect Trump to seek support from such a small fraction of society? Why would you believe such radical ideas? Which is spread by the 12%(42 million). Trump supporting them would do far more damage to his courier, if he supported white supremacy he would not have been voted in, there is not 175 million white supremacists in the US , the overwhelming majority of people in the US are strongly against white supremacy.


But Trump never said that, in fact he said some white supremacists are very fine people.



karathraceandherspecialdestiny
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15 Mar 2019, 10:27 pm

The title of my thread is "Trump's Part in the shooting" not "Trump is entirely responsible for the shooting". That's just poor reading comprehension, guys. These arguing tactics are so poor. Step up your game, or if you can't do that bow out. And don't start in on the personal attacks.



cyberdad
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15 Mar 2019, 10:29 pm

VegetableMan wrote:
it's another altogether to pin the entire blame on him for every hate crime.

If you read my post I only said he was "partly" responsible for inspiring Brendon Tarrant, (not entirely to blame)

VegetableMan wrote:
Trump is a symptom, not the problem. These polemic political arguments do nothing but widen the divide.

Agreed, I have always said the underlying social problems inherited from the 1950s and before have yet to be dealt with



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15 Mar 2019, 10:29 pm

endersdragon34 wrote:
Crimadella wrote:
The left is really getting creative(sarcasm). If we get another hole in the ozone, I'm sure it will be because Trump farted.

Trump: "White supremacists are bad people, horrible people"

Just typical Trump calling for white supremacy in coded language only the insane portion of the left can decipher.

for the people who have missed this. There is an estimated 150,000 white supremacists in the US, there is an estimated 42,000,000 people who believe white people shouldn't be allowed to have an opinion on particular subjects(hint, they are part of the left). So which group do we really have to worry about causing racism to rise up? There are I think, about 7,000,000(2% of 350,000,000) people with schizophrenia, I don't think we have to worry about people with schizophrenia rising up, why should we feel we are in danger of 150k people rising up? How would you expect Trump to seek support from such a small fraction of society? Why would you believe such radical ideas? Which is spread by the 12%(42 million). Trump supporting them would do far more damage to his courier, if he supported white supremacy he would not have been voted in, there is not 175 million white supremacists in the US , the overwhelming majority of people in the US are strongly against white supremacy.


But Trump never said that, in fact he said some white supremacists are very fine people.


Wrong. That is what the manipulating journalists on the left report, that is factually untrue, even though it is stated as a fact at snopes fact check. I have watched the announcement where that lie derived from, it was about Charlottesville, Va. There were three groups of people, white supremacists who marched the night before, Trump supporters doing a rally the next day and antifa which showed up to protest the rally. Trump said, "there were fine people on both sides", the 2 sides he was referring to were the two sides who started fighting, Antifa and Trump supporters, not white supremacists. One journalist yelled out, "Are you saying that there were some fine people among the white supremacists?", Trump specifically replied, "No! white supremacists are bad people, horrible people.", that's why I placed that line in my original post. If you search "Trump fine people" on youtube you can find a 7-13 minute clip which shows the whole thing. That's why you cannot trust left-wing media when it comes to Trump, they constantly lie. The sad thing is he directly clarified that he was not saying white supremacists where fine people, he said other bad things about the white supremacists also, that's just the only line I remember. It's so sad to see the extremely low level of the left, how they can have something called 'fact check' that spreads a lie that is very easy to confirm as a lie.



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15 Mar 2019, 10:34 pm

Crimadella wrote:
[ Trump said, "there were fine people on both sides", the 2 sides he was referring to were the two sides who started fighting, Antifa and Trump supporters, not white supremacists. .

You are throwing in your own interpretation....Trump was alluding to the protestors and the tikki torch carriers

The reason he said some the Nazis were fine people is because many were drawn from Virginia Tech and the armed forces...



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15 Mar 2019, 10:47 pm

cyberdad wrote:
Crimadella wrote:
[ Trump said, "there were fine people on both sides", the 2 sides he was referring to were the two sides who started fighting, Antifa and Trump supporters, not white supremacists. .

You are throwing in your own interpretation....Trump was alluding to the protestors and the tikki torch carriers

The reason he said some the Nazis were fine people is because many were drawn from Virginia Tech and the armed forces...

I'm not throwing in an interpretation, it's very obvious you haven't watched the announcement, I made everything very clear.



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15 Mar 2019, 10:52 pm

cyberdad wrote:
VegetableMan wrote:
it's another altogether to pin the entire blame on him for every hate crime.

If you read my post I only said he was "partly" responsible for inspiring Brendon Tarrant, (not entirely to blame)


Fair enough. However, my beef primarily lies with the assertion that Trump bears any responsibility for anyone else's actions, given that the culprits' attitudes were formed by a variety of influences that have nothing to do with the POTUS.


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16 Mar 2019, 12:04 am

Trump has long supported amnesty for illegal aliens.

As a candidate, he campaigned on giving touch-back amnesty to illegal aliens.

As president, he offered amnesty for DACA kids (illegal alien kids) too.

Anti-immigration critics like Ann Coulter and Steve Bannon call him names, and despise him.

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16 Mar 2019, 12:34 am

Timothy McVeigh said the government was responsible. Elliot Roger said women were responsible. David Berkowitz said his neighbor's dog was responsible. Adam Lanza said society was responsible (while others said autism was responsible) and so on.



cyberdad
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16 Mar 2019, 12:52 am

EzraS wrote:
Timothy McVeigh said the government was responsible. Elliot Roger said women were responsible. David Berkowitz said his neighbor's dog was responsible. Adam Lanza said society was responsible (while others said autism was responsible) and so on.


The people you listed (you forgot Anders Brevik and Dylan Roof) were "blaming the government".

Brendon Tarrant (and probably James Alex Fields Jr.) were "inspired" by Trump which is quite the opposite



karathraceandherspecialdestiny
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16 Mar 2019, 1:01 am

In the murderer's own words, he directly names Trump as an inspiration. We are not attributing that to him, he attributed that to himself. Why would Trump inspire a white supremacist if he has consistently shown that he is against white supremacy?--The answer is he wouldn't be called inspiring by these kinds of guys (like the mail bomber guy, Cesar Saroc or whatever his name was, don't forget him) unless something about the things he says and his policies speak to these people. Trump speaks in a coded racist language that appeals to these kinds of idiots, it's undeniable because the killers say it themselves in their own words like this piece of garbage in New Zealand did in his own words.