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TwilightPrincess
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06 May 2019, 11:46 am

Teach51 wrote:
Twilightprincess wrote:
Sometimes I think I know what others are feeling, but I often get it wrong.

As a kid, I would get panic attacks when an ambulance would go by because I’d envision some sort of horrible scenario and extreme suffering when, for all I knew, someone was mistaking a case of bad indigestion for a heart attack.

When people believe that they are empaths, I think it tends to come down to having empathy, imagination, and, at times, zeroing in on specific social clues - almost automatically. We can read a given situation, perhaps, without realizing the cognition behind the conclusion we seem to have come to intuitively.

I do get stressed when others are stressed and upset when others are, but I think that has something to do with having dealt with scary/upsetting situations involving stress when I was a kid. It can make me panicky and activate a fight or flight response.



"Without realizing the cognition behind the conclusion that we seem to have come to intuitively"

That's a valid point Twilightprincess.


I can give you a good example by relating an experience that happened to me.

My dad was teasing my little cousin about her hair (she’s a redhead), and I thought I could feel her distress and came to the accurate conclusion (I found out weeks later) that she was losing her hair, so I told my dad later that day not to tease her about it.

Reflecting on this later, I realized that I just picked up on several clues that no one else noticed. She never liked being teased, but she seemed more upset than usual. I saw her blink away tears from behind her glasses.

She also had started wearing an inch thick headband everyday that she was never in the habit of wearing before. (It covered her bald spot caused by alopecia so no one could notice her hair loss.)

She was also prone to various health conditions that made it difficult for her body to absorb the vitamins and minerals it needed.

These sorts of things were floating around in my mind with some discomfort which brought me to a conclusion that I thought was intuitive at first.

Being very introverted, I pick up on little details (or clues) that other people miss. No one else noticed that my cousin was so upset by the teasing even though there were several people present.


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Teach51
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06 May 2019, 12:54 pm

Twilightprincess wrote:
Teach51 wrote:
Twilightprincess wrote:
Sometimes I think I know what others are feeling, but I often get it wrong.

As a kid, I would get panic attacks when an ambulance would go by because I’d envision some sort of horrible scenario and extreme suffering when, for all I knew, someone was mistaking a case of bad indigestion for a heart attack.

When people believe that they are empaths, I think it tends to come down to having empathy, imagination, and, at times, zeroing in on specific social clues - almost automatically. We can read a given situation, perhaps, without realizing the cognition behind the conclusion we seem to have come to intuitively.

I do get stressed when others are stressed and upset when others are, but I think that has something to do with having dealt with scary/upsetting situations involving stress when I was a kid. It can make me panicky and activate a fight or flight response.



"Without realizing the cognition behind the conclusion that we seem to have come to intuitively"

That's a valid point Twilightprincess.


I can give you a good example by relating an experience that happened to me.

My dad was teasing my little cousin about her hair (she’s a redhead), and I thought I could feel her distress and came to the accurate conclusion (I found out weeks later) that she was losing her hair, so I told my dad later that day not to tease her about it.

Reflecting on this later, I realized that I just picked up on several clues that no one else noticed. She never liked being teased, but she seemed more upset than usual. I saw her blink away tears from behind her glasses.

She also had started wearing an inch thick headband everyday that she was never in the habit of wearing before. (It covered her bald spot caused by alopecia so no one could notice her hair loss.)

She was also prone to various health conditions that made it difficult for her body to absorb the vitamins and minerals it needed.

These sorts of things were floating around in my mind with some discomfort which brought me to a conclusion that I thought was intuitive at first.

Being very introverted, I pick up on little details (or clues) that other people miss. No one else noticed that my cousin was so upset by the teasing even though there were several people present.



Yes, I am also an observer. You are sensitive to others, that's a gift in itself. I pick up more than the average person by observation, I am an artist and pick up a great deal visually.
Sorry about your cousin, it was kind of you to tell your dad and spare her feelings. I'm also a redhead with slight alopecia, so I am really identifying here.
:P


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Nelbel
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13 May 2019, 10:08 am

Makes perfect sense. Sensing/feeling someone is angry does not make any assumptions as to why they are angry. When a stimulus is present that could be thought of as the reason then it is sometimes the conclusion but not necessarily correct.


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Quintzal
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28 May 2019, 8:22 pm

I've been struggling with a similar experience for awhile as well. I came across the following thread of research being done around Intense World Syndrome versus hyper-empathy syndrome which I'm still digging through. Some of the referenced articles may be of interest to you.

An article about Autism and Empathy: https://www.steadyhealth.com/articles/a ... ch-empathy

The research being referenced: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2518049/

One referenced page regarding coping with intense empathy: https://www.steadyhealth.com/articles/h ... y-syndrome

Excerpt from the Intense World Theory piece:

"We [...] propose that the autistic person may perceive [their] surroundings not only as overwhelming[ly] intense due to hyper-reactivity of primary sensory areas, but also as aversive and highly stressful due to a hyper-reactive amygdala, which also makes quick and powerful fear associations with usually neutral stimuli. The autistic person may well try to cope with the intense and aversive world by avoidance. Thus, impaired social interactions and withdrawal may not be the result of a lack of compassion, incapability to put oneself into someone else's position or lack of emotionality, but quite to the contrary a result of an intensely if not painfully aversively perceived environment." [8]

Excerpt from the article:

"Does That Mean That People With Asperger's May Have 'Hyper Empathy Syndrome'?

No, insofar as only one case of hyper empathy syndrome has really been documented in the medical literature — the fascinating case of a woman who had part of her amygdala (a part of the brain that processes emotions) removed in an attempt to relieve her epilepsy. The woman could subsequently not just recognize other people's emotions with almost frightening accuracy and "feel with" other people, but also physically experienced the effects of other people's emotions. [9]

"Hyper empathy syndrome might have been diagnosable as "Personality Disorder Not Otherwise Specified" in the previous version of the DSM, and the current DSM-5 just may cover it as "Personality Disorder Trait Specified" [10], but one of the diagnostic criteria is that the symptoms must not be explainable by other factors. If hyper empathy is an inherent part of your autism, that means you can forget about that particular diagnosis.

"Leaving official diagnostic criteria behind, it is, however, absolutely possible to suffer from hyper empathy — something some people refer to as being an "empath" — if you're an aspie. You may intensely experience other people's emotions and be overwhelmed by the "vibes" they give off to the point it causes genuine suffering. You may even experience panic attacks as a result. You may also, on the other hand, experience extreme and positive connectedness with humanity as a whole. Learning about how to control negative and positive emotions when you have hyper empathy syndrome may help you some, though."



Basil342
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24 Jun 2020, 12:35 am

I've never liked the idea that being an "empath" is some spiritual, psychic, supernatural power. It's really not nor should it be touted as one.

I could be classified as an "empath." When someone is around me I start to feel what they do. More like mimic it. My subconscious picks up on subtle clues and whatever previous interactions I've had with the person. I then start to feel that way. For example if someone is scared, I feel scared, angry, I feel angry, sad, I feel sad... and so on and so on. Clearly, this works better with people I interact with often. Call it a better well of information.

This is the result of being brought up in a household where my mother was Manic depressive and neurotic, My father was a depressed alcoholic and my brother was bipolar and prone to aggressive outbursts. I was always on edge and learned quickly how to read the room. Mainly for my safety. This gave me the ability to diffuse some issues before they blew up.

Why my body alerts me before my brain I have no idea. I usually suddenly get a mood shift and immediately reevaluate my surroundings. Then I can piece together what's going on. This is purely a defense mechanism that is completely explainable and not something mystical. Once people stop seeing it as something supernatural it's actually more useful.

Everyone wants to be "special" and the "special" ones just want to be normal.



Edna3362
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24 Jun 2020, 5:39 am

I can be classed off as an empath. :lol:
Not by choice -- I could never accept the idea, but I have to deal with it.

Unlike both the commonly mystified portrayal or the demystified versions of it.


I'm not easily triggered upset at things normally people find upsetting.
I have a screwed sense of fear to the point of not having phobias, relying on my sadness does not make me sympathetic but more aggressive. Anxiety is practically never one to describe me.
I'd be the kind who would take NSFW just for the heck of it.
In other words, I'm not that kind of sensitive.

Like any autistics, my cognitive empathy is shot, my sensory processing already gets in a way, and I have no social instincts to guide me where to look and what to mimic.
Also unlike those who are sympathetic and would compulsively approach others -- I'm not.
I'm asocial and my personal projections are wholly incompatible even amongst autistics.
My upbringing does not even encourage social vigilance.

And yet, and yet -- unlike emotional mimics and the socially vigilant.
I get to sense other emotions -- no eye contact, no voice tone, no what ifs or shoulds -- either being unaware of it until it's too late, or being aware that isn't what or how I would react.


At the end of the day, no matter how well versed I'm with 'vibes' and 'feels' and all those things -- I'm still just as socially clueless and just as socially apathethic to be swayed.



Instead of fussing around the label 'empath' and it's vulnerabilities, I'd just treat it like an internal states-emotional version of autistic cognitive-sensory processing.

I'd rather find a tool to enrich emotional intelligence, regulation and processing, not to mention work around the traits of alexithymia.


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