Are Friendships Just Business Transactions?
22 Jun 2019, 7:53 am
Anngables wrote:
Nt perspective. . . . . I have struggled for 4yrs to maintain a friendship with a male aspie (I am female)
It has often felt from my perspective that he views it as just a business relationship. If he needs or wants something he contacts me to see if I’m available, and then long periods where I hear nothing.
For me friendship is about valuing a particular person for their morals, their humour, their knowledge and their personality. It makes me care for them. So I am willing to go out of my way to help a good friend. I will try to think of things they might like to do and invite them along. I would include them in my social events if they wanted. NT friends often tell each other what they like and respect about each other. They notice if the other is struggling and go out of their way to help them either emotionally or physically.
Obviously these differences in needs or wants from a friendship can make it difficult within a cross spectrum friendship I would often feel “used” and my friend would often find me emotionally “needy” I often felt really hurt by what I perceived as his insensitivity.
After a longish break from each other my friend reached out to me, our friendship seems to be good again. I have learnt to just enjoy his company and the times he organises for us to do things and have no expectations from him. In return he is a lot more generous with his time and thoughtfulness around me. . . . .. . It has been a steep learning curve for me, but I do believe he appreciates me and our friendship just shows it in different ways. . . .. . . .. my NT friends don’t like him and feel he takes advantage of my good nature. . . .. but he often does v sweet and kind things for me. I wonder if he does see it as a business relationship. It’s an interesting thought.
It has often felt from my perspective that he views it as just a business relationship. If he needs or wants something he contacts me to see if I’m available, and then long periods where I hear nothing.
For me friendship is about valuing a particular person for their morals, their humour, their knowledge and their personality. It makes me care for them. So I am willing to go out of my way to help a good friend. I will try to think of things they might like to do and invite them along. I would include them in my social events if they wanted. NT friends often tell each other what they like and respect about each other. They notice if the other is struggling and go out of their way to help them either emotionally or physically.
Obviously these differences in needs or wants from a friendship can make it difficult within a cross spectrum friendship I would often feel “used” and my friend would often find me emotionally “needy” I often felt really hurt by what I perceived as his insensitivity.
After a longish break from each other my friend reached out to me, our friendship seems to be good again. I have learnt to just enjoy his company and the times he organises for us to do things and have no expectations from him. In return he is a lot more generous with his time and thoughtfulness around me. . . . .. . It has been a steep learning curve for me, but I do believe he appreciates me and our friendship just shows it in different ways. . . .. . . .. my NT friends don’t like him and feel he takes advantage of my good nature. . . .. but he often does v sweet and kind things for me. I wonder if he does see it as a business relationship. It’s an interesting thought.
No, I don't think his behavior had anything to be with a spectrumite and it really was not an excuse to treat you like that. I think his behavior sounds more "Human" because things can be one-sided.
Dan82
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22 Jun 2019, 5:36 pm
Summer_Twilight wrote:
No, I don't think his behavior had anything to be with a spectrumite
Autistic people can have difficulty with reciprocal relationships and can hyperfocus on what seems "logical" or "honest" to them/their constricted interests. I see it a lot on these boards, actually.
Not all autistic people are like that, but then not all diabetics' feet fall off and not everyone whose feet fall off are diabetic. It is a symptom of diabetes, though.
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22 Jun 2019, 6:56 pm
naturalplastic wrote:
But its rare that you actually reduce to that crass a level. Usually its just an emotional bond you get with person.
Dan82 wrote:
Autistic people can have difficulty with reciprocal relationships and can hyperfocus on what seems "logical" or "honest" to them/their constricted interests.
Both of these are true...
22 Jun 2019, 9:47 pm
SaveFerris wrote:
There is a psychoanalytic theory that states all our interactions are transactions - It's called Transactional Analysis
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transactional_analysis
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transactional_analysis
Quote:
there are four life positions that a person can hold, and holding a particular psychological position has profound implications for how an individual operationalizes his or her life. The positions are stated as:
1. I'm OK and you are OK. This is the healthiest position about life and it means that I feel good about myself and that I feel good about others and their competence.
2. I'm OK and you are not OK. In this position I feel good about myself but I see others as damaged or less than and it is usually not healthy.
3. I'm not OK and you are OK. In this position the person sees him/herself as the weak partner in relationships as the others in life are definitely better than the self. The person who holds this position will unconsciously accept abuse as OK.
4.I'm not OK and you are not OK. This is the worst position to be in as it means that I believe that I am in a terrible state and the rest of the world is as bad. Consequently, there is no hope for any ultimate supports.
1. I'm OK and you are OK. This is the healthiest position about life and it means that I feel good about myself and that I feel good about others and their competence.
2. I'm OK and you are not OK. In this position I feel good about myself but I see others as damaged or less than and it is usually not healthy.
3. I'm not OK and you are OK. In this position the person sees him/herself as the weak partner in relationships as the others in life are definitely better than the self. The person who holds this position will unconsciously accept abuse as OK.
4.I'm not OK and you are not OK. This is the worst position to be in as it means that I believe that I am in a terrible state and the rest of the world is as bad. Consequently, there is no hope for any ultimate supports.
I've found myself describing friendships in more or less formal concepts; yet I don't ever recall the term 'TransActional Analysis.' Usually, I don't view the more clinical terms favorably.
Here on WP, I've encouraged examples of HFA friendships amongst NTs; who've had favorable experiences both professional and personal with HFA. Here on WP, I have yet to find a term, concept (a non-clinical term beyond mere theory e.g., worthy of Wikipedia references) that actually encourages NT/HFA, NT/AS friendships.
I sense that many people with HFA and even NTs experienced with HFA are discouraged by the notions that NT/HFA friendships usually develop out of chance and accident. Why aren't there actively used terms describing the very spotty, hit & miss nature of NT/HFA friendships?
Anyways, relating to, and even acting on specific terms, classifications, etc. are probably a part of HFA; yet, I'm personally cynical of terms which attempt to narrowly define complex human behaviors.
In short, I sense it's best to view social skills/friendships more or less informally, yet thoughtfully - while minimizing these terms, and classifications!
23 Jun 2019, 10:09 am
Summer_Twilight wrote:
No, I don't think his behavior had anything to be with a spectrumite and it really was not an excuse to treat you like that. I think his behavior sounds more "Human" because things can be one-sided.
This is the million dollar question. Most of my friends get cross with me and say “stop making excuses for him” Or “stop blaming yourself for being too intense”, or even “why do you even bother with him he’s a weirdo . . . . .. “
I came on this forum during those times and did learn why my behaviour might be pushing him away. . . . .i also think he behaved badly at times as we all do. The difficulty in ability to maintain relationships is well documented about autism and I didn’t want to give up. . . . . .. . But I did in the end give up, and it was actually him that made the effort to repair the friendship.
Humans understanding each other is difficult at the best of times. I sometimes have issues with other friends, but they would notice I’m upset, or that something has changed (or vice versa” and we would communicate talk itout, explain how we feel and why and put it right. . . . .. .
That would go horribly wrong if I tried to do that with my aspie friend, he would just hear everything as me criticising him. . . . . . Even now can’t discuss what went wrong, he just doesn’t like it, it makes him uncomfortable. . . .so I don’t and we occasionally go do nice things, and send each other funny clips or interesting articles. And that is fine
24 Jun 2019, 10:21 am
lucgn01 wrote:
Recently, I (an 18-year-old about to enter my second year of college) have been attempting to improve my social skills. My main issue, though, is struggling to understand how neurotypical people can approach these relationships so casually. To me, friendships just seem like an exchange of services: Person A and Person B decide to be friends. Due to this, Person A will occasionally provide Person B with companionship and will do favors for them, and Person B reciprocates each individual act. This goes on until one person dies or if a person leaves the friendship after no longer finding it satisfactory. I'm probably being way too business-minded about this, but I honestly can't see how friendships are anything more than business transactions. Can someone please help me see this in a more relaxed, informal way?
Besides doing favors for each other, friendship usually involves at least most, if not all, of the following:
1) Having fun together.
2) Sympathy.
3) Comradeship, i.e. an emotional bond formed by facing common challenges together. (War buddies are the most extreme example of this.)
4) Caring about each other's well-being. This can grow gradually out of some combination of at least two of the above three.
Friendships usually start by having fun together. This often means either (a) participating together in a activity that you both enjoy or (b) talking with each other about topics you both are interested in. It also helps if at least one person is good at cracking jokes that the other one enjoys, though this is not an absolute requirement.
Additionally, NT's usually grease the wheels of all of the above via some sort of magic involving nonverbal communication that I don't understand.
I compensate for the above lack by seeking strong forms of intellectual companionship around common intense interests. I was thus able to make quite a few friends when I was in my twenties, and some more friends later. (Alas, nearly all of my friends are now either dead or drifted apart. I now hope to build a new network of friends via the local autistic community.)
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25 Jun 2019, 3:42 am
Mona Pereth wrote:
lucgn01 wrote:
Recently, I (an 18-year-old about to enter my second year of college) have been attempting to improve my social skills. My main issue, though, is struggling to understand how neurotypical people can approach these relationships so casually. To me, friendships just seem like an exchange of services: Person A and Person B decide to be friends. Due to this, Person A will occasionally provide Person B with companionship and will do favors for them, and Person B reciprocates each individual act. This goes on until one person dies or if a person leaves the friendship after no longer finding it satisfactory. I'm probably being way too business-minded about this, but I honestly can't see how friendships are anything more than business transactions. Can someone please help me see this in a more relaxed, informal way?
Besides doing favors for each other, friendship usually involves at least most, if not all, of the following:
1) Having fun together.
2) Sympathy.
3) Comradeship, i.e. an emotional bond formed by facing common challenges together. (War buddies are the most extreme example of this.)
4) Caring about each other's well-being. This can grow gradually out of some combination of at least two of the above three.
Friendships usually start by having fun together. This often means either (a) participating together in a activity that you both enjoy or (b) talking with each other about topics you both are interested in. It also helps if at least one person is good at cracking jokes that the other one enjoys, though this is not an absolute requirement.
Additionally, NT's usually grease the wheels of all of the above via some sort of magic involving nonverbal communication that I don't understand.
I compensate for the above lack by
Good post Mona, Sounds exactly like my life
Ages 20-35
Having fun together followed by developing comradeship developing both empathy and sympathy and caring about each other
Married life 35-51 - seeking strong forms of intellectual companionship around common intense interests. I was thus able to make quite a few friends when I was in my twenties, and some more friends later. (Alas, nearly all of my friends are now drifted apart)
Where I am different is that I have no desire to build a new set of friends as my daughter and wife take up all my time....
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