Would it matter if someone had no friends?

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KT67
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03 Jul 2019, 12:47 pm

Like to what extent would that matter?

Would it inherently make them either a meaningless or a bad person?

I know I have casual friends who like me irl. I know my stepdad gets by without anyone who isn't either an acquaintance or a relative (he managed to marry three women though whereas I can't get a gf or bf but that's me being picky). But I don't really have deep friendships or people who are 'into' me.

Does that make me a bad person either in a defective way or in a morally bad way? I keep hearing things about 'if nobody is their friend, that's a sign they're a wrong 'un'.

Thing is I don't want friendship for its own sake. I want it as 'proof' of my worth. As a sort of a validation that I'm not entirely weird or out there on my own.

I'm looking at the autistic average age of death and it's 5 years older than me. Because of suicides. I'm not suicidal but if I continue along this path of casual friendships, will I become that way?

And I know I'm using a lot of me and I and my own life in this but - if someone really didn't have friends, if none of their acquaintances liked them, etc (not my situation), would that person necessarily be immoral/useless?

Also yes, online, nobody watches me. Nobody follows me if I do twitter. Nobody friends me if I do facebook. People occasionally like my stuff and occasionally dislike it. Only a select few people on here like me. But I get the sense it wouldn't matter as much if people I wasn't related to irl would actually tell me they liked me.



shortfatbalduglyman
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03 Jul 2019, 9:25 pm

Having no friends does not mean you are a "bad" person or "meaningless"

Plenty of people with plenty of friends are "bad" and "meaningless"



:mrgreen:



Fireblossom
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04 Jul 2019, 9:04 am

shortfatbalduglyman wrote:
Having no friends does not mean you are a "bad" person or "meaningless"

Plenty of people with plenty of friends are "bad" and "meaningless"

:mrgreen:


What he said. It might be a sign of bad social skills though, but the majority of us autistic people have bad social skills so that's nothing to be all too depressed about. Some (most?) can get better with practice.



AprilR
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04 Jul 2019, 10:01 am

No, of course not. Having aspergers is not your choice. Being a bad person on the other hand is a choice. If you feel like you're inherently evil or something you're probably suffering from depression. You have every right to feel good about yourself. Beside being your own friend is a lot more important than other friends.



Prometheus18
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04 Jul 2019, 11:00 am

I don't have any friends, and I don't consider myself an especially bad person.



funeralxempire
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04 Jul 2019, 11:59 am

I don't have any friends at the moment, but I don't think I'm any worse now then when I did have friends.

Maybe I just haven't noticed. :twisted:


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blackicmenace
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04 Jul 2019, 12:41 pm

I don't have any friends. I doubt anyone other than my immediate family would take notice, nor care if I were to drop dead tomorrow. You should probably stop measuring your self worth by your social media experience. You're capable of complex emotions and thoughts in a universe filled with empty space and matter hurling through said space without the ability to comprehend how unique and special it is to understand you have difficulty creating and nurturing complicated interactions with other complex creatures. Perhaps you should cut yourself some slack and try to enjoy the finite time we have, stumbling through life because no one's life is as flawless as it's presented on social media.


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Mapofsteel
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04 Jul 2019, 8:14 pm

Prometheus18 wrote:
I don't have any friends, and I don't consider myself an especially bad person.

How can you be happy without any friends at all?



travelerrr
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04 Jul 2019, 8:30 pm

Consider vitamin deficiency. If you've always had it and you are so used to it that you consider that the norm, it doesn't mean you are well.

Humans need human contact. It needs to be the right kind of contact, in the correct form and quantity. But denying that basic need is unhealthy self-delusion.



Mona Pereth
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04 Jul 2019, 9:22 pm

KT67 wrote:
Does that make me a bad person either in a defective way or in a morally bad way? I keep hearing things about 'if nobody is their friend, that's a sign they're a wrong 'un'.

Thing is I don't want friendship for its own sake. I want it as 'proof' of my worth. As a sort of a validation that I'm not entirely weird or out there on my own.

What kind of validation are you talking about here? Do you mean:

1) Indirect validation: Proof (primarily to other people, not just you or your hypothetical friend) that you are capable of having friends after all, hence not "a wrong 'un'" according to the above-quoted bit of folklore?

2) Direct validation: Having a person in your life who shares your weirdness, understands it, and sympathizes with you, thus assuring you (directly) that you are not alone?

Or both?

If you desire #2 above, then you desire something that could be an important part (though not all) of the basis of a genuine and strong friendship.


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shortfatbalduglyman
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05 Jul 2019, 9:21 am

A medical doctor asked about friends

"I don't have that many friends"

Doctor Butler took a direct quote and wrote it in the progress notes

:roll:

Friendship is better than nothing, all things being equal

But not all things are equal

"You can't make a silk purse out of a sows ear"




Friendship is overrated



KT67
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05 Jul 2019, 11:24 am

Mona Pereth wrote:
KT67 wrote:
Does that make me a bad person either in a defective way or in a morally bad way? I keep hearing things about 'if nobody is their friend, that's a sign they're a wrong 'un'.

Thing is I don't want friendship for its own sake. I want it as 'proof' of my worth. As a sort of a validation that I'm not entirely weird or out there on my own.

What kind of validation are you talking about here? Do you mean:

1) Indirect validation: Proof (primarily to other people, not just you or your hypothetical friend) that you are capable of having friends after all, hence not "a wrong 'un'" according to the above-quoted bit of folklore?

2) Direct validation: Having a person in your life who shares your weirdness, understands it, and sympathizes with you, thus assuring you (directly) that you are not alone?

Or both?

If you desire #2 above, then you desire something that could be an important part (though not all) of the basis of a genuine and strong friendship.


All 3.

1 indirect validation but I'm less concerned about that
2 direct validation - someone who sees the world like I do
3 indirect? validation - someone to assure me I'm worthwhile.

I've noticed none of the masculine people in my life seem to have what I consider a 'friend' though. That deep friendship that my mother seems to get with about 10 other women whichever town she lives in and she manages to maintain some of these friendships over decades.

I'm an only child so when my parents die I'm going to have to rely on either casual friends or my cousins. My step siblings won't care and they won't live as long as me because they're about 10 years older than me.



Mona Pereth
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05 Jul 2019, 2:45 pm

KT67 wrote:
Mona Pereth wrote:
What kind of validation are you talking about here? Do you mean:

1) Indirect validation: Proof (primarily to other people, not just you or your hypothetical friend) that you are capable of having friends after all, hence not "a wrong 'un'" according to the above-quoted bit of folklore?

2) Direct validation: Having a person in your life who shares your weirdness, understands it, and sympathizes with you, thus assuring you (directly) that you are not alone?

Or both?

If you desire #2 above, then you desire something that could be an important part (though not all) of the basis of a genuine and strong friendship.


All 3.

1 indirect validation but I'm less concerned about that
2 direct validation - someone who sees the world like I do
3 indirect? validation - someone to assure me I'm worthwhile.

I've noticed none of the masculine people in my life seem to have what I consider a 'friend' though. That deep friendship that my mother seems to get with about 10 other women whichever town she lives in and she manages to maintain some of these friendships over decades.

I'm an only child so when my parents die I'm going to have to rely on either casual friends or my cousins. My step siblings won't care and they won't live as long as me because they're about 10 years older than me.

In what general geographic region do you live? Is there any kind of support group for autistic adults within easy traveling distance?

Do you have any hobbies, and/or any activities you enjoy, and/or any intellectual interests?


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- Finally diagnosed with ASD in May 2019, after having suspected it for over ten years, and after having deeply explored the autism community for over one year while waiting for and obtaining diagnosis.
- In longterm relationship with boyfriend who was diagnosed with Asperger's Syndrome in 2001.
- Long history of participation in various oddball subcultures.
- My "Getting to know each other" thread: Hello from NYC.


Prometheus18
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05 Jul 2019, 3:02 pm

Mapofsteel wrote:
Prometheus18 wrote:
I don't have any friends, and I don't consider myself an especially bad person.

How can you be happy without any friends at all?

I didn't say I was happy, although incidentally I do believe my unhappiness is due principally to factors other than lack of friendships.

Either way, I'm happier without friends than with friends from among my immoral, uneducated, uncultured, vulgar, immoral, irreligious peer group.



KT67
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06 Jul 2019, 4:39 am

Mona Pereth wrote:
KT67 wrote:
Mona Pereth wrote:
What kind of validation are you talking about here? Do you mean:

1) Indirect validation: Proof (primarily to other people, not just you or your hypothetical friend) that you are capable of having friends after all, hence not "a wrong 'un'" according to the above-quoted bit of folklore?

2) Direct validation: Having a person in your life who shares your weirdness, understands it, and sympathizes with you, thus assuring you (directly) that you are not alone?

Or both?

If you desire #2 above, then you desire something that could be an important part (though not all) of the basis of a genuine and strong friendship.


All 3.

1 indirect validation but I'm less concerned about that
2 direct validation - someone who sees the world like I do
3 indirect? validation - someone to assure me I'm worthwhile.

I've noticed none of the masculine people in my life seem to have what I consider a 'friend' though. That deep friendship that my mother seems to get with about 10 other women whichever town she lives in and she manages to maintain some of these friendships over decades.

I'm an only child so when my parents die I'm going to have to rely on either casual friends or my cousins. My step siblings won't care and they won't live as long as me because they're about 10 years older than me.

In what general geographic region do you live? Is there any kind of support group for autistic adults within easy traveling distance?

Do you have any hobbies, and/or any activities you enjoy, and/or any intellectual interests?


I have acquaintances/casual friends from watching football. I've been in writing groups but there aren't any around here. I don't really meet people on courses, I go to courses (hobby courses) but people don't really want to be my friend afterwards, we all break off and become strangers again.

Someone told me at the last writing course I was on 'I always start not wanting to like your work then like it despite myself' which?

I also have casual friends from a café I go to regularly where we sit and talk to each other. That's like a 'local' except not a pub.

I moved house last year. Before that I was literally stuck at home with social anxiety.

In person people can't get over the fact I'm 4"11 and don't have wrinkles. I have an MA but they treat me like an enigma, like a child prodigy or something. I'm 31.