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beneficii
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13 Sep 2019, 6:43 pm

Antrax wrote:
CNN released an article today on income inequality. As usual it made no acknowledgement of the glaring fact that poor people and middle class people are richer than they were when things were "more equal"

https://www.cnn.com/interactive/2019/09 ... index.html

From their own data:

The middle class had 7.1 trillion dollars in assets in 1989. In 2019 they had 29.3 trillion dollars in assets. Inflation calculations indicate that 100 dollars in 1989 is worth $197.68 in 2017. That adjusts the 1989 figure to ~14.03 trillion dollars in 2019.

So the middle class has gained 15 trillion dollars since 1989


The figure you quote only mentions the middle class, which includes the upper middle class.


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auntblabby
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13 Sep 2019, 8:27 pm

"low skilled labor is cheap" and the GOP intends to keep it that way.



Persephone29
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14 Sep 2019, 5:20 am

The right to be left alone. Wealth should not attract envious looks over the fence to size up what can be stolen.


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LoveNotHate
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14 Sep 2019, 8:45 am

Wealth lets you avoid working until you're near death.

I feel sad when I see really old people working low wage jobs.

I'm 85 and I want to go home ...


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kraftiekortie
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14 Sep 2019, 8:53 am

My mother is 85, and would probably just croak if she stopped working.



LoveNotHate
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14 Sep 2019, 9:01 am

kraftiekortie wrote:
My mother is 85, and would probably just croak if she stopped working.

Probably not retail or food service ?


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kraftiekortie
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14 Sep 2019, 9:02 am

She’s a psychoanalyst.

I know what you mean, really. I feel the same sort of sadness.

Ironically, though our old-age benefits suck, they suck less than the old-age benefits of other countries.



auntblabby
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15 Sep 2019, 12:41 am

if i was still in the rat race, i'd be dead long ago.



XFilesGeek
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16 Sep 2019, 3:05 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
She’s a psychoanalyst.

I know what you mean, really. I feel the same sort of sadness.

Ironically, though our old-age benefits suck, they suck less than the old-age benefits of other countries.


I'll probably work until I drop.

I don't really care, however. My purpose here is to take care of my mother and my dog. After they're gone, I'm fine with getting hit by a bus.

They way society is set-up, I highly doubt I'll ever get a "good" job. Not that I blame society since it's no one's fault I was born the way I was.


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Justin101
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16 Sep 2019, 5:49 pm

Are we talking wealth... Or money? Both are very different.

Material wealth includes property, stocks and shares, commodities, etc.

"Wealth" per se can include even more.


As for money -come on, it's a collective illusion. And like all illusions, it comes through fakery and blagging or a legacy of those who did those things better than you. I'm talking big money, not the stuff most guys accept like crumbs swept to them by the elites.

Money isn't wealth. As far as what it "should" convey - any other social construct, which is also essentially an illusion.

Justice should not be bought by money but it is.



auntblabby
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16 Sep 2019, 7:07 pm

getting hit by a bus would hurt big-time. i'd rather expire in my sleep. anyways, average working joes living in scandinavia have more of the benefits of wealth [as experienced by wealthy americans] such as high-quality health and dental care, high quality child care, high quality infrastructure, widespread ultra-high-speed internet- even if they don't have the same high amuuurican richie rich incomes. so wealth in amuuurica only insures that the wealthy here have those things at the same level as ordinary scandinavian citizens.



aghogday
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17 Sep 2019, 8:14 am

In any Human Society, When Language for 'Welfare' Becomes a Pejorative it is a Direct Indicator
of How Sick a Social Animal Has become in its Ability to Peacefully and Harmoniously Cooperate
With Each Other in a Way That Gives and Shares More than Takes and Hoards and Pillages and Rapes
Like a Territorial Competitive Animal Over one that Cooperates And Gives and Shares more than Takes and Hoards.

In Short, Human Societies that See 'Welfare' as a Pejorative Way of Life are Sick and Very Sick in deed.

On the Other Hand, the 'Dunbar Number' of 150 Max Human Acquaintances; and Research that also suggests that
the Human Capacity for Close and Intimate Friends is not much more than 5 Individuals; and For Hundreds of
Thousands of Years we lived Close to Naked, if not Naked, in Very close Knit Groups of not much more than
40 Individuals as a Huddled Mass of Hugs Foraging together; where the Child was the Ultimate Prize of
A Village then for another Pair of Hands to make Foraging a Success; where even a Dance and Song
may come in Joy around a Moonlit Night of Peace and Harmony; and even Ascending And
Transcending Bliss in Beats of Drums and Dance and Song all together; not much
Different than what i do totally Sober and Drunk In Flow on Thursday Nights
with Hundreds of Intoxicated College Age Students who haven't quite
Figured out how to let go, ascend and transcend without 'Shots' all night
Spending a Hundred Bucks or so; as actually some folks have spent over A Thousand
Bucks in one night for intoxicated rounds for all their friends; sadly for a Species out of synch with Free Nature.

Change for Balance is the Law and Wealth of Nature;

Go Against that rule and face the eventual suffering and misery of the masses;

Square Root one Problem one: There are too many of us living together.

That's Against What we are evolved to do in Peace and Harmony
in Change for
Balance of
Nature.

Why?

The Virus of the Written Word that ends up as the 'Wealth of Nuclear Bombs' to Shoot ourselves in
the Foot over Dinosaur Parts that have become Tar and Oil rather than the Star Seeds and Flowers
we are evolved to be.

What does Wealth Convey:

Death the most...

'Ask' 1 out of 8 of all the Plants and Animals We have 'scheduled' for extinction in the coming decades.

Ask a Hurricane; Ask a Fire; Ask the Breath of Fiery Change and Balance coming Back to Haunt Taking
and Hoarding more than Giving and Sharing. Trick or Treat; Nature is Karma; Just wait and see what We do next to 'US';

By the way; Us is ALL.

We LiVE iN an Insanity too Big Now for most to see with Tiny Human Brains Overwhelmed by 'The Virus' of CuLTuRES.

The Rest off US; Yes, Nature; Yes, ALL; Yes God; Will Bring the Balance of Change Back; With or Without the Species that is Us; Could be a Fungus; A Virus; A Water Born Illness, a Bacteria Resistance to Drugs; Nature is Watching us Closely
Very Closely in the smallest and largest ways oF a Reality there is no escaping from; once again class: Change For Balance;
in other Words: Karma: Mother Nature's Fire; Mother Nature's Breath; Mother Nature's Life the Rest of Mother Nature Will Change for Balance.

Wealth Should Convey: Change For Balance; Without Balance Within, inside, outside, so above and below: THere is Poverty
All Around....


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Antrax
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17 Sep 2019, 11:36 am

Justin101 wrote:
Are we talking wealth... Or money? Both are very different.

Material wealth includes property, stocks and shares, commodities, etc.

"Wealth" per se can include even more.


As for money -come on, it's a collective illusion. And like all illusions, it comes through fakery and blagging or a legacy of those who did those things better than you. I'm talking big money, not the stuff most guys accept like crumbs swept to them by the elites.

Money isn't wealth. As far as what it "should" convey - any other social construct, which is also essentially an illusion.

Justice should not be bought by money but it is.


I'm going to have to disagree with the premise that money is a social illusion but material wealth is not. Without society respecting property and ownership rights, the only thing anyone would own is what they could possess by force.

In that sense a deed to a house, stocks, car registration etc. are no more or less an illusion than cash. Anyways this discussion is in my opinion a bit of a red herring. Money may be a social construct, but it is an ancient and entrenched one that isn't going anywhere anytime soon.


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kraftiekortie
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17 Sep 2019, 11:42 am

Money is an absolute requirement for at least 99% of the population of the world today.



Antrax
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17 Sep 2019, 11:49 am

auntblabby wrote:
getting hit by a bus would hurt big-time. i'd rather expire in my sleep. anyways, average working joes living in scandinavia have more of the benefits of wealth [as experienced by wealthy americans] such as high-quality health and dental care, high quality child care, high quality infrastructure, widespread ultra-high-speed internet- even if they don't have the same high amuuurican richie rich incomes. so wealth in amuuurica only insures that the wealthy here have those things at the same level as ordinary scandinavian citizens.


Norway has a population of 5.2 million. Sweden has a population of 9.9 million. Denmark 5.7 million, and Finland 5.5 million.

Combined these countries have a population ~ 24 million which is 2/3rds that of Canada and less than 1/10th of the U.S. population.

The U.S. has a population of 330 milllion. Comparable countries include:

Indonesia: 264 million
Pakistan: 210 million
Brazil: 210 million
Nigeria: 209 million

Everyone else is either 4x the US population (China, India), or less than half (Bangladesh, 161 million).

Please inform me which country operating at a similar scale to the U.S. we should emulate?


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