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SpiceWolf
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18 Jan 2020, 10:28 pm

Tross wrote:
It helps that we're a pretty fun church too, but most of all, we're a church that actually respects what's written in the bible as opposed to some arbitrary doctrine written who knows how long ago.


https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?s ... ersion=NIV

I hope this will be of some help to you.



Tross
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19 Jan 2020, 1:07 am

@funeralxempire: Maybe you're right about the weather patterns. It's difficult to say what my client does or does not know since he cannot talk to me. He actually broke routine by pulling me towards my car, and really, the only "fun" thing he had to do afterwards was more ABA stuff with some BIs from a different company. Still, if the kid has no gift of prophesy, then it's a heck of a coincidence that his insistence on leaving early was actually the best thing for both of us.

@Twilightprincess: That's certainly the first and only time I've heard of that particular gifting, but if a fellow leader believes it is a gifting, then I'm not going to question it. It had never occurred to me to imagine demons making appearances in our world, but maybe it is so. I've never been able to see them so I it's not something I can verify or falsify.

@techstepgenr8tion, Mountain Goat: If I've learned anything about this experience, it's that I do believe in a lot more than I thought I did when it comes to the unseen, and demons, and whatnot. Thanks for all the info you've provided and sharing your experiences.

SpiceWolf wrote:
Tross wrote:
It helps that we're a pretty fun church too, but most of all, we're a church that actually respects what's written in the bible as opposed to some arbitrary doctrine written who knows how long ago.


https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?s ... ersion=NIV

I hope this will be of some help to you.
That actually is. Thanks! I don't believe The Lord is as heavy-handed under the New Covenant, but that what I am doing is sinful and the bible says such is helpful. No sin can truly separate me from Him, but I should try and climb out of this rabbit hole if at all possible. All that's left is to verify if it was Him who spoke to me and my friends through the cards, or if that came from another source. It's all the more concerning that multiple fellow Christians have also dove down this rabbit hole with me, with at least one more expressing interest in doing so too.



TwilightPrincess
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19 Jan 2020, 8:29 am

funeralxempire wrote:
Twilightprincess wrote:
If I had a ten year old who claimed to see demons, I’d get him evaluated by a psychologist ASAP!


I'd feel the exact same about an adult. :|



Me too, actually...

Of course, with one’s own kid, there’s more responsibility involved.

Also, it’s harder to get adults to cooperate with this sort of thing. You can’t really force them unless they pose a threat to themselves or others. They might not be honest about their experiences with professionals, either.

Sometimes if these experiences are considered a cultural norm, mental health professionals treat them differently than they normally would, too.

It can be pretty complicated.


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Tross
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19 Jan 2020, 7:22 pm

Twilightprincess wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
Twilightprincess wrote:
If I had a ten year old who claimed to see demons, I’d get him evaluated by a psychologist ASAP!


I'd feel the exact same about an adult. :|



Me too, actually...

Of course, with one’s own kid, there’s more responsibility involved.

Also, it’s harder to get adults to cooperate with this sort of thing. You can’t really force them unless they pose a threat to themselves or others. They might not be honest about their experiences with professionals, either.

Sometimes if these experiences are considered a cultural norm, mental health professionals treat them differently than they normally would, too.

It can be pretty complicated.

Well, the kid did say they come in different colours. He saw one that was yellow, and another that was blue. I never knew they came in more than one colour. I did show him a picture of my then GF making her angry face and asked if that's what the demons looked like, and he said he had now seen three demons. I have no reason to doubt this. :lol: She's been my ex for years.

In all seriousness though, I was actually able to catch the wife I mentioned and asked for a prayer. It did not go at all as I had anticipated. She did pray that I would listen to The Lord and only to The Lord, and also that she knows I have the ability to discern the voice of The Lord from other voices. I did not tell her about the tarot thing, of course, but she seems convinced that I know what the right decision is in that one aspect of my life.

If there is power of discernment to be had, apparently I have it in me. Hmmm...I mean, I know that God would never speak to me in a manner that is in any way discouraging. Semantically speaking, He will sometimes say there are certain things I shouldn't do or certain paths I shouldn't take and instead recommend others, but He has never once said I can't do something. The Devil has certainly tried speaking like that in the past and I was able to recognize his voice right away. Moreover, I know that God would never lead me down a path that wasn't ultimately for my own benefit. He may not give me the easiest route, but he would never lead me down the path to ruin and despair.

In that case, maybe I will keep walking the path I'm on. Heck, I might go a little deeper down the rabbit hole I found myself in, as sinful as it apparently is. I have the ability to turn back and right my path if I seem to be heading in an aberrant direction. What the cards told me seems to be the right decision in regards to that crossroads I found myself at. Heck, I did try experimenting by dealing with a more minor situation I had put off solving by acting according to what the January card said I ought to do, and the outcome seems to be for the best. I shall be cautious (and probably won't do any spreads for a while), but I don't seem to be in a bad place so far. If I ever have any doubt I can also get prayer whenever I need it. I read an argument too that Tarot isn't actually divination at all. If that's the case I have nothing to worry about.



StephanieFisher
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11 Feb 2021, 11:19 am

You did hear something unusual. I just think you're imagining it



Fnord
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11 Feb 2021, 11:33 am

StephanieFisher wrote:
You did hear something unusual. I just think you're imagining it
Which do you mean?  Did he hear it, or did he just imagine hearing it?

You replied to a post that is over a year old, by the way; so the person to whom you are replying may not notice.


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The_Walrus
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15 Feb 2021, 7:25 am

Tarot cards do not have predictive power. They are bits of card. It is not possible to distinguish between real and fake readings. And one would expect that immediately consecutive readings performed for the same person would be identical if they were non-random... but they aren’t.

That is not to say that a sufficiently emotionally intelligent individual cannot provide “readings” that give their clients comfort. But that doesn’t make their readings true.



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15 Feb 2021, 8:45 am

StephanieFisher wrote:
Nothing wrong. Many people have been sitting on this forum for several years. But I still can't find the people who know the Tarot cards. I've been studying them for a year, but I still don't understand many of the subtleties, such as how to find out my future daughter-in-law or how to bring finance into my life. Right now, I can only use them to choose the best answer when choosing where to choose between yes or no. We can exchange resources if you are also interested in this. First I studied tarot cards on YouTube, and then one blogger shared this source {Mod. edit: spam redacted}. I basically like it, but I want to know more about these cards and how to use them to improve my life.

If you want something that's relatively comprehensive there's Benebell Wen's Holistic Tarot that's a good 800 page brick:

https://www.amazon.com/Holistic-Tarot-I ... =8-1-spons

My only advice, if you're strictly into the divining but not all that curious on the theory or philosophy there aren't many inroads aside from raw intuition. I personally err in the other direction - ie. have a lot less general faith in the divining but I find the symbolic interrelations and the way the system is used as sort of a lock-pick for your own mind or as a self-authoring tool (open-sourcing your own cognitive software), much more stable in its returns.


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techstepgenr8tion
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15 Feb 2021, 8:56 am

techstepgenr8tion wrote:
I personally err in the other direction - ie. have a lot less general faith in the divining but I find the symbolic interrelations and the way the system is used as sort of a lock-pick for your own mind or as a self-authoring tool (open-sourcing your own cognitive software), much more stable in its returns.

A thread I authored back in late 2016 on that topic - 'The Tarot As A Map Of Cognition And Learning':

viewtopic.php?t=335000


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The_Walrus
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15 Feb 2021, 11:24 am

So if I’ve got it right, tech, you’re saying that tarot can almost be like a “prompt”? So drawing The Fool can prompt someone to think about foolishness, while drawing The World could prompt you to think about change, and drawing the two together could prompt you to think about the way they are connected?



techstepgenr8tion
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15 Feb 2021, 11:52 am

The_Walrus wrote:
So if I’ve got it right, tech, you’re saying that tarot can almost be like a “prompt”? So drawing The Fool can prompt someone to think about foolishness, while drawing The World could prompt you to think about change, and drawing the two together could prompt you to think about the way they are connected?

The Fool is actually tricky, its a description of Pantheos or Source. The tarot is thus seen as 'The Fool's Journey' where The Fool steps off the ledge of the mountain top and falls into physical form.

The thing that would be a hard line in the sand probably for people getting started with the philosophy that's at least baked itself into the tarot over the last few centuries is whether their own sense of metaphysics allows for some of the assumptions that are in the system of logic that's behind the cards.

Otherwise to your point - in some sense yes, you could call it a prompt but it's a bit deeper than that. A good analogy, particularly looking at something like Rider Waite's Fool and any other card in that deck and pretty much anything that's a tarot deck from either the Golden Dawn or diaspora organizations, it's a lot like what goes into heraldry and family crests in its attention to every detail. The bag over the fool's shoulder is memory and experiences, the colors on The Fool's outfit, the red and yellow wheels, the seven bulbs on the belt where five are hidden on the other side if It's waist, the white rose, etc..

That depth is part of why each card can have a stack of inter-related symbols that then can be compared against another card and it's interrelated symbols as something like a system of interactions.

The obvious note there - the system of symbols and relationships is only as good as the metaphysics of the author, so if their ideas are half baked then it doesn't work that well for these purposes. Still - the idea of having stacking sets of symbols with relationships based on other parameters like the number associated with the card or, getting into another labyrinth the Hebrew alphabet and all the interrelated meanings there, you can get a pretty deep system of meaning.

Way back when, early days of the Golden Dawn (as in the UK thing - not the Greek nazis) every person in that organization was in charge of making their own deck from what they were learning. In a completely different context I sometimes wonder if it wouldn't be a bad idea, as people get through grade school, elementary school, high school, college, etc. that they were encouraged to build similar maps of reality through clusters of logical operators in symbol (could be reductive materialist metaphysics, could be idealist, could be anything really) because they'd get to really understand the workings of their own minds let alone it would be great for building a stronger relationship with 'known unknowns'.


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18 Feb 2021, 2:58 am

Mountain Goat wrote:
I can share what happened to my parents when they went down the tarrot card and spirit of the glass route.

By "spirit of the glass," do you mean a Ouija board?

Mountain Goat wrote:
The house became so haunted through these demonic openings, that when I was 4 years old we moved, and when my parents were putting pictures off the walls and packing them in boxes, they would turn arouns and the pictures were back on the walls.

How do you know that this happened? Did you see it yourself, or did they tell you about it?

Are you sure there wasn't some chemical in the air or water affecting your and/or their short-term memories, such that, for example, your parents may have had false memories of actually doing some things (e.g. packing a particular picture in a box) that they had only intended to do?

Also, were they using any drugs at the time? (Getting heavily stoned can mess up one's short-term memory for a while.)

Mountain Goat wrote:
As a kid I used to talk to the demonic ghosts, one being an old decrepid lady... .

How did the ghosts manifest themselves?

I should probably mention here that I'm an agnostic supernaturalist. I believe in the likely existence of a supernatural realm, i.e. I don't believe in what techstepgenr8tion calls "reductive materialism," but I tend to be skeptical toward any and all specific supernatural claims.


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18 Feb 2021, 3:48 am

Mountain Goat wrote:
I often see demons and on rare occasions have seen angels etc. See demons in people. Is how I can tell if a person is into freemasonry because of how the demons they invite in during their ceromonies alter their faces. It can be quits obvious to me.

What do you mean when you say that you "see" demons?

The example you give is of people's facial expressions (or other facial characteristics?) that you interpret as demonic. Can you describe these facial expressions/characteristics? Whether you can or can't describe them, what is your basis for believing them to be demonic?

Do you see demons in any other way, besides seeing them in people's faces?

And what is your basis for saying that Freemasons invite demons in during their ceremonies?

Mountain Goat wrote:
Many people can't see demons. I see and feel them.

What do they look like and feel like?

Mountain Goat wrote:
I can also see and feel the anointing of God.

Can you describe what this looks like and feels like to you also?


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18 Feb 2021, 6:21 am

Fnord wrote:
StephanieFisher wrote:
You did hear something unusual. I just think you're imagining it
Which do you mean?  Did he hear it, or did he just imagine hearing it?

You replied to a post that is over a year old, by the way; so the person to whom you are replying may not notice.

Most of the other people in this thread are still here, however. I would be interested to read about any subsequent developments.


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