People who complain about diversity annoy me

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cyberdad
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18 Jul 2020, 11:12 pm

Offset wrote:
That's just what i have to say, why diversity is important, and yeah


Thanks Offset, I can certainly see the benefits of having more diversity. The toy story analogy is really good.

I also think it can correct some really bad misrepresentation of the past in modern film. Examples I think of
- the role of people of color in the development of modern western music and art (the latter really annoys me how much has been culturally appropriated)
- historic depiction of things relating to the ancient world as eurocentric as if other types of people didn't matter
- the complete ignoring of americans of color in cowboy culture where historically 1 in 3 cowboys were either black or hispanic.

A few examples that come to mind



Bradleigh
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19 Jul 2020, 12:36 am

cyberdad wrote:
Fascinating! I never thought animators would do that? do you think they are deliberately trying to desexualise the female character by giving male characteristics? I certainly remember masturbating to the old wonder woman (who resembled the actress Linda Carter) but find the modern wonder woman very neutral. Perhaps its a form of censorship?


I just don't think the show creators thought it necessary to give the characters sexualized outfits or designs. The original She-ra was made as a spinoff to He-man, so they could sell more toys, and thus all had very similar body types to make manufacturing easy in just swapping clothes and hair, and whatever reasons you might think about dressing characters as in the 80s.

Just because her design has less pronounced boobs, does not mean she is any more masculine.

Image
Image

Nothing was negatively affected by making it a diverse group of ethnicities, body shapes and even sexualities. Even has a likely neurodivergent character. But some people see this sort of thing and just complain about diversity like it is bad by default.


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Kraichgauer
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19 Jul 2020, 12:53 am

cyberdad wrote:
Offset wrote:
That's just what i have to say, why diversity is important, and yeah


Thanks Offset, I can certainly see the benefits of having more diversity. The toy story analogy is really good.

I also think it can correct some really bad misrepresentation of the past in modern film. Examples I think of
- the role of people of color in the development of modern western music and art (the latter really annoys me how much has been culturally appropriated)
- historic depiction of things relating to the ancient world as eurocentric as if other types of people didn't matter
- the complete ignoring of americans of color in cowboy culture where historically 1 in 3 cowboys were either black or hispanic.

A few examples that come to mind


Here in the Pacific Northwest, a great many cowboys were actually Native Americans. So I guess kids around here should play "Indians and Indians."


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cyberdad
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19 Jul 2020, 2:12 am

Kraichgauer wrote:
Here in the Pacific Northwest, a great many cowboys were actually Native Americans. So I guess kids around here should play "Indians and Indians."


LOL! yes it would turn that cultural foundation of childhood on its head wouldn't it.

I watched a documentary on black cowboys. Apparently (according to the documentary) the first cowboys were black slaves who were used by the Spaniards to herd cattle who became free when the United States defeated Mexico and the states of Texas and California were formed. They were called "boys" because they were slaves and cowboys because they herded cattle.



Kraichgauer
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19 Jul 2020, 4:56 am

cyberdad wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
Here in the Pacific Northwest, a great many cowboys were actually Native Americans. So I guess kids around here should play "Indians and Indians."


LOL! yes it would turn that cultural foundation of childhood on its head wouldn't it.

I watched a documentary on black cowboys. Apparently (according to the documentary) the first cowboys were black slaves who were used by the Spaniards to herd cattle who became free when the United States defeated Mexico and the states of Texas and California were formed. They were called "boys" because they were slaves and cowboys because they herded cattle.


Yes, "cowboy" was hardly a compliment. Just as itinerant farm workers who'd get around by jumping trains were called hoe boys, or "hobos."


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cyberdad
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19 Jul 2020, 5:43 am

Kraichgauer wrote:
Just as itinerant farm workers who'd get around by jumping trains were called hoe boys, or "hobos."


Yes I saw a documentary about the great depression in the US and a great many itinerant farm workers got around stashing themselves inside (and on the top of) trains. A lot of fights broke out on the tops of trains long before James Bond made such fight scenes famous :lol:



cyberdad
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19 Jul 2020, 5:49 am

Bradleigh wrote:
I just don't think the show creators thought it necessary to give the characters sexualized outfits or designs. The original She-ra was made as a spinoff to He-man, so they could sell more toys, and thus all had very similar body types to make manufacturing easy in just swapping clothes and hair, and whatever reasons you might think about dressing characters as in the 80s.


That made sense. In the 1970s Lee Majors was made into a doll (the 6 million dollar man) with movable parts and costumes. A spin-off was the "bionic woman" with the incredible Lindsay Wagner. The dolls came with costumes in those days.

Bradleigh wrote:
Nothing was negatively affected by making it a diverse group of ethnicities, body shapes and even sexualities. Even has a likely neurodivergent character. But some people see this sort of thing and just complain about diversity like it is bad by default.


A lot of this stuff is market driven. Its like trying to diversify death metal or heavy metal. You could have diverse ethnicities and genders but at the end of the day the market wants heavy metal bands with members whom look like they are from a viking movie.



kokopelli
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15 Jun 2021, 8:35 pm

Kraichgauer wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
Offset wrote:
That's just what i have to say, why diversity is important, and yeah


Thanks Offset, I can certainly see the benefits of having more diversity. The toy story analogy is really good.

I also think it can correct some really bad misrepresentation of the past in modern film. Examples I think of
- the role of people of color in the development of modern western music and art (the latter really annoys me how much has been culturally appropriated)
- historic depiction of things relating to the ancient world as eurocentric as if other types of people didn't matter
- the complete ignoring of americans of color in cowboy culture where historically 1 in 3 cowboys were either black or hispanic.

A few examples that come to mind


Here in the Pacific Northwest, a great many cowboys were actually Native Americans. So I guess kids around here should play "Indians and Indians."


Most of the working cowboys around here any more are Hispanic.



ASPartOfMe
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16 Jun 2021, 6:08 pm

Bradleigh wrote:


Image

Even has a likely neurodivergent character.

Quote:
rednid enjoyer
@polypearIs
·
May 22, 2020
@Gingerhazing
many autistic fans of the show, including myself are wondering if entrapta is autistic? many of us relate to her and love her so much and it would mean a lot if we could get confirmation of her being autisticPleading face
Noelle Stevenson
@Gingerhazing
·
May 22, 2020
Yes, we wrote her that way. One of our crewmembers was on the spectrum and related to her specifically, and had a huge part in shaping her story and character!


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cyberdad
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16 Jun 2021, 6:38 pm

It's interesting how research for character development occurs to accommodate a cast member playing an autistic person. I am assuming the cast member doing the voice for entrapta (for example) is not autistic.



Spunge42
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16 Jun 2021, 11:10 pm

Bradleigh wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
People protested about anime???


A children's cartoon. Reactionaries, like a guy who goes by The Quartering, complained that things like the bellow character design were to masculine that she was practically a boy.

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Pretty much that it was not as much of a sexy design as the old series.

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The whole show was inclusive with things like gay couples, skin colours and body shapes.


What? I think she looks super cute in her new outfit. It definitely looks more comfortable and practical to fight in. Since when are cute biker shorts under a skirt masculine. I guess a woman can't be modest without being accused of wanting to look like a man :roll:

I mean the original outfit always frustrated me, if she kicked in a fight she'd be flashing everyone. Many of the older female super hero costumes just weren't practical for actual combat :lol: I know I'm taking this more seriously than necessary, but since it was brought up... just thought I'd air my confusion on their attire since I was a kid. I was in martial arts since 2nd grade so I never understood how they could fight in a tight mini skirt and no bra 8O


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Bradleigh
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17 Jun 2021, 3:29 am

Spunge42 wrote:
What? I think she looks super cute in her new outfit. It definitely looks more comfortable and practical to fight in. Since when are cute biker shorts under a skirt masculine. I guess a woman can't be modest without being accused of wanting to look like a man :roll:

I mean the original outfit always frustrated me, if she kicked in a fight she'd be flashing everyone. Many of the older female super hero costumes just weren't practical for actual combat :lol: I know I'm taking this more seriously than necessary, but since it was brought up... just thought I'd air my confusion on their attire since I was a kid. I was in martial arts since 2nd grade so I never understood how they could fight in a tight mini skirt and no bra 8O


Better designs for female characters is certainly an improvement in general pop culture, from elements of being more practically realistic, and empowering.

There has been some return to the topic in regards to video games recently, where certain "gamer" people are crying that female characters are being designed too masculinely because of elements like not wearing makeup in a survival game. And it brought to my attention some discourse in regards to the character Tifa from Final Fantasy VII and its remake, Tifa being well known as a character with a large chest, and arguably probably erasure of large chested women if they changed too much.

Tifa is well known for her design of a white tank top and black miniskirt, it is clearly sexual, and certain parts of the gaming community (that type that cry about diversity and stuff) complained that despite the style carried into the remake they read somewhere that they restricted parts and thus ruined her. The thing was that they mostly gave her a firm black sports bra, that would provide her support along with black leggings, over there being not much of an idea what visible support she had, along with looking more athletic, considering that she was meant to be a brawler.

At the same time, putting some hot dudes to match the same level of attire at times that it might be acceptable to put everyone in something like bikini armour.


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Lost_dragon
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03 Jul 2021, 8:44 am

Bradleigh wrote:

Just because her design has less pronounced boobs, does not mean she is any more masculine.

Image
Image

Nothing was negatively affected by making it a diverse group of ethnicities, body shapes and even sexualities. Even has a likely neurodivergent character. But some people see this sort of thing and just complain about diversity like it is bad by default.


She just looks younger rather than masculine, which makes sense she's 17 at the start of the new series. How old is the original Shera supposed to be? She looks to be in her 30's to me.

Image

Personally I liked her design in an episode where there's a dream sequence about her future.


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