How Do We Know If There Is Something Missing....?

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Mountain Goat
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01 Oct 2020, 8:59 am

How do we know if there is something missing in regards to our feelings?

I have discovered though I can't quite work it out, that something is missing. I mean... Example. I was never able to explain what shutdowns were to doctors before they were called shutdowns. Somehow I was never able to use the right words.
Anxiety.. I did not know that a feeing I had on and off throughout my life was anxiety. I heard people talk about it. I never knew what the feeling actually felt like only to discover that I almost daily knew what it felt like if that makes sense?

Sympathy and empathy. Has been explained and explained to me and I can repeat what was explained, but I still don't "Get it" because the two are the same thing to me! I can't seperate them. This does not mean that I do not show sympathy and I do not show empathy. I show them very much I think... I just can't seperate them. (Could be also connected to how I "Group" faces in regards to prosopragnosia, and there is also this grouping effect in regards to other things like a few peoples usernames.

But anyway. Is it possible that some feelings I get are missing something? How would I know?

(I never realized this until being on this site! Aaah! (HAHA!).


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Edna3362
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01 Oct 2020, 9:21 am

Alexithymia?

Aphasia?
??? Hfxitcohvljsvipqbihfijaojd ??? No, wait...

Pure inexperience turn lack of inner discernment or just not enough inner scope of awareness?

Or plain verbal; vocabulary-recall difficulties mixed with emotional immaturity or inexperience.


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Jiheisho
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01 Oct 2020, 10:09 am

I have a hard time to understand my feelings in real time--this is common for autistics. I also have real difficultly in broad questions. "How are you feeling?" is a tough one for me. But "are you stressed?" I can figure out.



AuroraBorealisGazer
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01 Oct 2020, 10:15 am

Mountain Goat wrote:
Example. I was never able to explain what shutdowns were to doctors before they were called shutdowns. Somehow I was never able to use the right words.
Anxiety.. I did not know that a feeing I had on and off throughout my life was anxiety. I heard people talk about it. I never knew what the feeling actually felt like only to discover that I almost daily knew what it felt like if that makes sense?


Yes this has been a big struggle for me, with both physical and cognitive dilemmas. I have a lot of physical health problems and it takes a while for me to get answers to things partly because I can't find the words to explain it in the typical manner. For instance, I have acid reflux issues, and kept trying to explain how it felt but my words weren't typical so no one knew what I was talking about. It's a very frustrating problem to have.

But to answer your question, I don't know how we can tell if there's something missing. I guess I just wait until it comes up.



kraftiekortie
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01 Oct 2020, 10:23 am

I was told by a girlfriend once that there is "something missing" within me.



Steve1963
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01 Oct 2020, 10:24 am

I know there's something missing just by observing other, "normal" people, like my wife.



kraftiekortie
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01 Oct 2020, 10:30 am

There are many times when one is able to make up for what is supposedly "missing." Through something that's alternative to what is supposedly "missing."

One might not be the most efflorescent social butterfly----but that same person can, perhaps, perform CPR really well.



that1weirdgrrrl
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01 Oct 2020, 11:12 pm

I don't think it's so much that anything is missing, so much as it's a knowledge gap....

I'll try really hard to give an example....

I have heard of and known the definition of emotion A*, then I feel and experience emotion A. But I don't make the concious connection right away.

So if someone asked me "Do you feel emotion A?" I would not be able to answer immediately, because the emotion feels foreign and I need time to process and categorize it.

It's like the neural pathway that would normally make a fast connection between the title and the feeling is blocked, and the information had to take a roundabout way to get where it makes sense in the brain.

*insert chosen emotion here


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01 Oct 2020, 11:24 pm

Other people seem to insist that's the case.


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Mountain Goat
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02 Oct 2020, 5:47 am

that1weirdgrrrl wrote:
I don't think it's so much that anything is missing, so much as it's a knowledge gap....

I'll try really hard to give an example....

I have heard of and known the definition of emotion A*, then I feel and experience emotion A. But I don't make the concious connection right away.

So if someone asked me "Do you feel emotion A?" I would not be able to answer immediately, because the emotion feels foreign and I need time to process and categorize it.

It's like the neural pathway that would normally make a fast connection between the title and the feeling is blocked, and the information had to take a roundabout way to get where it makes sense in the brain.

*insert chosen emotion here


But can it be that this is the same for everyone? I mean... Is it possible that everyone may struggle with identifying their emotions? How would we know if this is the case or not?

I ask to clarify things in my mind as I seem to have noticed something different with my own self, but it is hard to define.

I can give surprize examples where I feel certain emotions and have done ever since I can remember, but never knew what these emotions were called. Anxiety was oneof these. (It comes and goes. If I was working or when I was in school it would hit me every morning to the point where going to school or work took great effort to overcome. But I never knew what it was called, that it was a "Thing" and that others did not have it. I did not get it every day, but in the mornings getting ready for work or school or an appointment... Oh.. These days I can have anxiety for appointmwnts which are years away! Why I have cancelled rather important appointments rather then go through the stress of waiting as once cancelled, the anxiety leaves. I actually found out it was called anxiety through being on this site when Krafty explained it in a way where I realized what it is... Doctors used to ask if I was anxious. I would say "No" because I did not connect the word to how I felt. I heard anxiety had something to do with stomache ulcers with older people so I assumed it was something I did not have).
[Calm down MG! Relax!! !! :D]


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02 Oct 2020, 7:23 am

Emotions confuse me sometimes. Most times. :lol:

I don't know how to know if I feel things different than anyone else or am missing feelings others have. Until I find a way to put myself in someone else's mind and body, I'll never know for sure. I've asked people about their feelings, and from their answers I think I am missing emotions others have. My mom, for example say she she feels things like frustrated and angry as different things. And she feels excited and anxious as different things. I don't. For me I only use different words based on the context of what happened to me. Both 'feel' the same to me, but I know I'm excited because say, I got a package I've been wanting v/s anxious because I don't want to stoop a thing the gas station, but I don't want the car to run out of gas either.

I got diagnosed with general anxiety disorder and actually argued with my therapist a therapist the time about it because I didn't think I had anxiety. I thought anxiety was like panic attacks where you thought you were dying and I never thought that. But apparently I get all the physical symptoms of anxiety but never knew that was what I thought was. Point being, I think I understand what you mean.



Mountain Goat
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02 Oct 2020, 7:52 am

It is not that I don't have feelings and emotions. I have lots... But trying to put feelings into words... It is like I can have an exploding force of feelings inside me but no way of knowing how to get them out or express them into words.

I don't know if it is normal or not.

I never forget my brother having a feeling which he was in great disscomfort with but he did not know what it was. This happened when we were younger. My Dad asked him to try to describe it. He said that his toes kept curling up. Turns out it was cramp, which is actually a brilliant description of cramp in ones foot in which he had.

But sometimes one can have deep emotional feelings from the depths of ones soul, and not know how to describe them or how to express them. How to let them out!

I remember as I child I was often really frustrated and get huge rages because I was unable to express what or how I felt. When I was a baby my mother nearly chucked me out the window to stop my crying as I was unable to express how I felt. Now that is expected at that age because one is not able to talk...
But as an adult, though I can express myself better as I speak English, I still feel limited. I know my use of the English language is limited. I keep to simple words I remember. My vocabluary is limited, so I am wondering if there is a link between these?
I can learn words and words but soon after it has gone! Is why I was hopeless trying to learn other languages. I only am able to use words that "Stick" so I am often having to ask others what certain words mean. You see myy brain works well in pictures. I translate word scenes into pictures so reading books, I have to stop and wait for a picture to form in my head before I can move on. If my Mum reads something to me I am often still forming these imaginary pictures in my mind before I can move on so I have to get her to stop ans go back to where I was whilw I was forming the last picture before I can form the next picture.
In school when learning to read, I was told off because I needed to see the pictures relating to the words for me to make sense of the words... I think it took me longer to learn to read? But once I let go of real pictures and made my own imaginary pictures in my head, I then was ok to move on to books with the occasional picture... But even today I love "Reading" pictures!


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02 Oct 2020, 9:47 am

I was looking into this a few years ago.

Autistic people do seem more likely to have internal states that are harder to describe and may not be experienced broadly by others. I believe this is from using different social input in developing ideas about internal states, what they mean, and how to discuss them. For example, I am NT, and can distinguish facial expressions and vocal tones easily. Some autistic people can’t, and may also use less (or different) facial expressions themselves and have a different or smaller range of vocal tones.

So, I can point at a tree, say “tree”, and you may hear me, see the tree, and agree that it is a tree. I could say “I feel fluttery inside.” You would then have to ask me more questions or examine my mannerisms closer to get an idea of what I meant. Even then, you may not be correct.

Empathy is like if you are a guy and see another guy get hit in the “goods” and it makes you involuntarily cringe, perhaps grab yourself protectively. I am a woman and have no idea what that feels like so I may feel a little sad for the guy and comment that it sucks. I would be using sympathy.

Empathy and sympathy seem to serve the same function. Do not worry if you don’t think you experience one of them.

Also, among NTs even, there is likely to be as not as many many shared internal states as is commonly thought. But we have to have shared general concepts to be able to communicate and make rules.



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02 Oct 2020, 10:01 am

If you point to a tree and say 'tree' ... right now, I can feel the rough bark un my palms, see the dappled sunlight through the leaves, hear some squirrels chittering nearby, and smell the musty, moldy aroma of the dirt beneath my feet.  My emotional state is 'calm'.

Imagine trying to sit through a botany class when all of these sensory impressions bombard you from within.


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02 Oct 2020, 7:37 pm

Mountain Goat wrote:
How do we know if there is something missing in regards to our feelings?

I have discovered though I can't quite work it out, that something is missing. I mean... Example. I was never able to explain what shutdowns were to doctors before they were called shutdowns. Somehow I was never able to use the right words.
Anxiety.. I did not know that a feeing I had on and off throughout my life was anxiety. I heard people talk about it. I never knew what the feeling actually felt like only to discover that I almost daily knew what it felt like if that makes sense?

Sympathy and empathy. Has been explained and explained to me and I can repeat what was explained, but I still don't "Get it" because the two are the same thing to me! I can't seperate them. This does not mean that I do not show sympathy and I do not show empathy. I show them very much I think... I just can't seperate them. (Could be also connected to how I "Group" faces in regards to prosopragnosia, and there is also this grouping effect in regards to other things like a few peoples usernames.

But anyway. Is it possible that some feelings I get are missing something? How would I know?

(I never realized this until being on this site! Aaah! (HAHA!).

I have similar problems expressing myself and whether it's because the way i see things makes no sense to other people or that I'm failing to communicate. It has caused much frustration on both parties. I think something that only adds to the frustration is a-lot of times things that would be easy for most people to explain. I.E. I have alot of trouble explaining what motivates me to do things, What I feel/Why I feel it. I think most people being able to understand these things so easily and having never experienced them. Along with me just not being very good at explaining things complicates this. Part of this is my alexithymia. Even, IF i do happen to understand how I am feeling and why I am feeling it. I am unable to explain it. It's weird It's like I know I'm sad, and I know why I am said but if anyone asks me why I'm just blanking.

As for the Shutdown thing. I have a similar problem with burnout. It seems time and time again I try to explain to them what burnout is using precise details. (Which is hard cause aot o times when i try to it just goes blank like i referred to before) They usually just assume it's depression which while that is a part of burnout depression is way different and I would know having had a depressive episode without burnout coming into play. As for anxiety I have had a similar feeling but I didn't really start having much anxiety till i started to become self-aware when I was about 9-10. I never really understood the names of feelings other than like the really basic ones (i.e. happiness, sadness, anger.)It wasn't untill people starting to explain it

I know this is probably not gonna help but, Sympathy is the act of expressing that you understand someones pain and trying to comfort them.
While Empathy is feeling other people's pain. Like if someone else feels sad you might become sad as a result.
One way to look at it is empathy is the act of feeling other people's emotions
while sympathy is the act of expressing that you do and trying to help peope deal with those emotions
Autistic people have problems picking up on the social cues to tell when other people feel a certain emotions. I can't really understand peoples emotions unless tehy mkae it obvious like if they are crying our yelling. And I have no idea how to deal with especially crying.
As for the grouping effect I think alot of peoples brains work that way things are linked together.
I don't know about the feelings being missing. With Alexitymia and even emotional blunting they arne't missing tey are still there. With alexithymia you dont' really understand the feelings that come from emotions and with emotional blunting tehy are kinda blocked out I like to refer to it as a dam where it builds up overtime till it flows it's kinda like that. But The thing is they still affect you and can be observed.
As for how you know if this is the case. Once you stop feeling emotion it's kinda obvious. When my emotional bluntness kicked it it was traumatic I dind't liek the feeling or more lack of it. Cause remember with alexitymia you cna still feel teh sensations but you don't really know what they mean. As for alexithymia you wouldn't know btu the lack of knowing would be a clue.


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02 Oct 2020, 7:42 pm

Thank you all for your repliws. I have read them. :)


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