Know your Pronouns

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In this era of watching/minding your language; Singer Shawne Mendes got in hot water with fellow pop singer Sam Smith for referring to him at a public event as "him".

https://www.news.com.au/entertainment/c ... 928c2c1623

Mendes has subsquently apologised to Smith who self-identifies as non-binary (uses the pronouns “they, them, and theirs.”)

It made me realise I have absolutely no idea of the correct pronouns to use with people unless they introduce themselves as such. Is this appropriate for non-binary people to get angry when a person has no knowledge of the correct pronouns or is it up to us to learn them?

I will have to enrol myself into a training course as I don't want to be caught out, and recommend others do the same.

I’m not going to call someone “they” until I’m asked to call them “they.”

Or if I know someone is non-binary.

Or a person appears non-binary at first glance.

If the person gets offended and doesn’t accept an apology, that’s their problem.

I'm nonbinary and i don't care what people call me. Think if me as a man? Call me he. Think of me as a woman, go for she. Think of me as neither or both, they is fine. I don't care. I know some people do care though, but to raise a fit over someone making a mistake...that's not cool. A simple, I prefer this over that would suffice.

I think the thing is, you can't always tell by looking at a person how they identify and what they want to be called. If you use an incorrect pronoun, get told the preferred one, use it. That simple. From where I sit, there's no reason to get mad over an oops moment. Now if you know the correct pronoun and go ahead and keep using the incorrect one, then there's reason for the other person to be upset.

My two cents anyway.

Makes sense to me.

I'm too old for this crap.
But the good thing is that I have never come across a situation where I was challenged, regarding pronouns.

Eventually, it will sink in.

I think most people try to see the attitude behind the words.

You are a reasonable person.
I see you as feminine, btw.



Agreed.

Agreed.
Some people look for an excuse to have an argument. [cough] PPR.

FFF, we are not mind readers. I will even tell anyone that who gets mad at me for misgendering someone. I will say "I was not aware of their gender because I am not a mind reader so if they do not have it in their bio, don't assume I did it on purpose."

IRL, if they do not look feminine, unless they wear a pronoun on their shirt, no one has a way of knowing.

I prefer to be referred to as: "Your Magnificence."
You have all been informed.
If you don't use this descriptor, it will be deemed as a deliberate insult and will be reported to the mods.

Im with League and Pepe, and pretty much everyone else above. I dont see why it matters to you so much. You dont owe it to nonbinary people to do so much hard work. you're obviously not some peckerwood homophobe. So dont feel so guilty about pronouns. I have nothing against South Asians. But I dont feel guilty if I cant speak to the manager of the local 7-11 store in his native Urdu.

I've never felt comfortable with "they" or any of the non-binary pronouns.
Which is to say, I would do my best to address people in whatever terms they prefer, but for myself, I really don't want the hassle of having to correct people all the time. I'll take "she", "he", "mate" or whatever.

Besides, I'm not sure it's healthy to place that much importance over which gender one is recognised as. Wouldn't it be more healthy to recognise us all as integral and important parts of humanity, regardless?

It's kind of like mixed race people trying to define themselves by not belonging to either race but to a special category in between. Like, stressing they're Eurasian rather than Chinese. As if it would be so terrible to be placed in the wrong racial category, to be considered purely one or the other. It might be more healthy to define one's identity more holistically than something based on race (or gender), I think.

The article looks like a bit of a non-story. Someone said the wrong word then apologised and the other person wasn't too upset. I often get he/she mixed up for my own kids, or accidentally call them by the dog's name

I think this has more to do with the ego of singers than it does to do with the ego of non-binary people.

Ever heard the expression famous people use 'don't you know who I am?!'

Most non-binary people I know don't mind unless it's intentional and most introduce themselves with pronouns as well as name.

Anyone who knows anything about Sam Smith knows they're non-binary as it's a famous thing for them, they were one of the first people to come out. Smith was probably insulted by someone not knowing who they are - the ego of a celebrity showing there. Either that or, again due to celebrity ego, Sam Smith assumed it was intentional when it wasn't because 'surely everyone has heard of me?!'

Cis and binary trans celebrities have huge egos too. It's not a non-binary thing. One band insisted on always having a bowl of m&ms in their room with no blue ones for eg.

Exactly.

And why is it important to "represent" for their particular identity, anyway?  For example: As a white, gynotropic, middle-class cis-male with an MSEE, a pretty Asian wife, a female black cat named 'Naia', an Amateur Radio license, and membership in the Freemasons, I believe that labels are both pointless and tedious.

See my point?

Seriously though, how often do we have real-life conversations in which we are required to use any and every means possible to identify ourselves before saying something like, "I agree with your opinion"?

That’s basically what I was going to say, as a fellow non-binary. Even with people who are binary, sometimes it isn’t obvious which pronouns a person uses. Getting upset over someone you don’t know using different pronouns than you prefer is like getting upset at a stranger for wearing a red shirt because you hate the color red. If you tell someone which pronouns you prefer and they deliberately use others, then it’s reasonable to be offended.

In one way it is a power-play.
It depends on the person.

Avoid obnoxious people.
Problem solved.

There are consequences for bad attitudes.