When a woman rejects someone

Page 1 of 5 [ 71 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next

KT67
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 6 May 2019
Gender: Female
Posts: 2,990

07 Jan 2021, 7:48 pm

I'm talking about cis het/bi women here...

When a woman rejects someone she has:
1 A lifetime of conflicting advice. "Good girls don't have sex before marriage/outside of love/before dating for six months" etc versus "It's rude to say no/good girls don't shout/please your man" versus "How can you be a modern woman if you don't follow Cosmo advice"
2 A sexual history (if she's not a virgin) of sex with people who have greater muscle mass than her and tend to be about a foot taller than her
3 Someone in front of her who is stronger than her and taller than her.
4 That someone has been told "Girls play hard to get" and "Real men have sex"

If the guy is a decent guy and she knows he is decent, then saying "no" shouldn't be a problem. But if she's approached by a stranger at a bar? Or even worse, if she's approached by an acquaintance/stranger in private? How is she to know he's decent?

If he isn't decent then that muscle mass and height differential matters. And not just in terms of r... but also in terms of him posing a threat to her in terms of violence.

So sometimes girls don't say 'no' in order avoid offending guys.

Don't push her into things if you get the slightest inclination she's not ready. Wait til she wants it. It's a modern world so she might ask you or you might ask her and she's enthusiastically saying yes to you. If she says no, take her at her word & don't push. If she seems like she's saying yes to you just to please you, have that honest conversation.

I know idiots who say 'that isn't sexy'. Nonsense. I would rather hear a woman say "hell yeah" with excitement than a woman say "yeah ok I guess..." in a sad little voice that tails off at the end. And I'd rather have a powerful woman who's my intellectual/emotional equal than some sad little girl who doesn't know her own mind.

Rejection is awful but it's not the worse consequence of all this. Quit pretending like it is. And don't take it personally - you're probably a nice guy but she might have her experience with guys who weren't.

Also, you're not 'less of a man' if you don't bed every woman you date/see. You're strong for setting your own boundaries, and for respecting hers.

If she's the type to 'play hard to get' then she's mucking about with your feelings & with her own safety. She's not worth the risk. But in my experience, those sorts of women are a lot rarer than the sort of women who did things they didn't actually want to because they felt pressured.



Pepe
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 11 Jun 2013
Gender: Male
Posts: 12,976
Location: Australia

07 Jan 2021, 8:06 pm

Interesting. 8)


_________________
Laughter is the best medicine. Age-appropriate behaviour is an arbitrary NT social construct.
Don't tell me white lies. Gaslight me at your peril. Don't give me your bad attitude.
If I'm so bad, pass me by. ;)


And one more thing,


"A stranger is a friend gang-stalker you haven't met yet."

Truth may be inconvenient but it is never politically incorrect...The Oracle of Truth has spoken...8)


THERE WILL BE NO COUP IN AMERICA!


kraftiekortie
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 4 Feb 2014
Gender: Male
Posts: 72,506
Location: Queens, NYC

07 Jan 2021, 8:30 pm

It hurts to be rejected.

I've been rejected many times. It hurts......BAD! I've been in despair because of rejection. I've even felt like killing myself a couple of times.

But you have to move on from the rejection. You can't let it affect how you live your life.

There is more to life than just romance.



idntonkw
Deinonychus
Deinonychus

Joined: 29 Apr 2020
Age: 34
Posts: 346
Location: Boston

08 Jan 2021, 1:18 am

if you don't have sex when she is not ready, she will get offended that you did not try, look down on you, get turned off, and forget about you. more often than not unfortunately womens' sexual thinking is NOT logical and is NOT politically correct OR in their self interest!!



OutsideView
Deinonychus
Deinonychus

User avatar

Joined: 4 Oct 2017
Age: 37
Gender: Male
Posts: 350
Location: England ^not male but apparently you can't change it

08 Jan 2021, 6:18 am

idntonkw wrote:
if you don't have sex when she is not ready, she will get offended that you did not try, look down on you, get turned off, and forget about you. more often than not unfortunately womens' sexual thinking is NOT logical and is NOT politically correct OR in their self interest!!

Looks more like it's your own interests you're worried about there.


_________________
Silence lies steadily against the wood and stone of Hill House. And we who walk here, walk alone.


Pepe
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 11 Jun 2013
Gender: Male
Posts: 12,976
Location: Australia

08 Jan 2021, 6:30 am

kraftiekortie wrote:
It hurts to be rejected.

I've been rejected many times. It hurts......BAD! I've been in despair because of rejection. I've even felt like killing myself a couple of times.

But you have to move on from the rejection. You can't let it affect how you live your life.

There is more to life than just romance.


It more than stings, yup. 8O
And, yes, "romance" is nature's little trap to make babies. 8)


_________________
Laughter is the best medicine. Age-appropriate behaviour is an arbitrary NT social construct.
Don't tell me white lies. Gaslight me at your peril. Don't give me your bad attitude.
If I'm so bad, pass me by. ;)


And one more thing,


"A stranger is a friend gang-stalker you haven't met yet."

Truth may be inconvenient but it is never politically incorrect...The Oracle of Truth has spoken...8)


THERE WILL BE NO COUP IN AMERICA!


ezbzbfcg2
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 15 Feb 2013
Age: 38
Gender: Male
Posts: 990
Location: New Jersey, USA

08 Jan 2021, 6:34 am

OutsideView wrote:
idntonkw wrote:
if you don't have sex when she is not ready, she will get offended that you did not try, look down on you, get turned off, and forget about you. more often than not unfortunately womens' sexual thinking is NOT logical and is NOT politically correct OR in their self interest!!

Looks more like it's your own interests you're worried about there.


Disagree. It was a fair assessment. Onus is on the man, regardless of what is said or is politically correct.



KT67
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 6 May 2019
Gender: Female
Posts: 2,990

08 Jan 2021, 6:43 am

idntonkw wrote:
if you don't have sex when she is not ready, she will get offended that you did not try, look down on you, get turned off, and forget about you. more often than not unfortunately womens' sexual thinking is NOT logical and is NOT politically correct OR in their self interest!!


Disagree.

I've been in that situation from the other end and it feels like rape.

It's not rape because the guy doesn't know how it feels so it's unfair to label it that way. But it feels like being taken advantage of.

Kinds of women who would do the rest of it are brought up in a sick society & aren't worth pursuing. Low kinds of women with low self esteem.



KT67
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 6 May 2019
Gender: Female
Posts: 2,990

08 Jan 2021, 6:44 am

kraftiekortie wrote:
It hurts to be rejected.

I've been rejected many times. It hurts......BAD! I've been in despair because of rejection. I've even felt like killing myself a couple of times.

But you have to move on from the rejection. You can't let it affect how you live your life.

There is more to life than just romance.


Yeah, I'd rather be rejected than be in a situation where I ended up hurting someone cos they wanted to say no but were scared. Even if I didn't know that until after the event, I would feel dirty and gross and guilty.



OutsideView
Deinonychus
Deinonychus

User avatar

Joined: 4 Oct 2017
Age: 37
Gender: Male
Posts: 350
Location: England ^not male but apparently you can't change it

08 Jan 2021, 6:49 am

ezbzbfcg2 wrote:
Onus is on the man

Maybe, but in the context of the thread it does kind of imply that women saying no to sex when they're not ready is illogical, politically incorrect and not in their best interest just in case they're disappointed to miss out later.

Edit:
KT67 wrote:
Kinds of women who would do the rest of it are brought up in a sick society & aren't worth pursuing. Low kinds of women with low self esteem.

That's a bit harsh.


_________________
Silence lies steadily against the wood and stone of Hill House. And we who walk here, walk alone.


KT67
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 6 May 2019
Gender: Female
Posts: 2,990

08 Jan 2021, 7:38 am

I don't really care, I know too many women (and other afab people because this is all about sex rather than gender) who have paid the price for the notion that women 'play hard to get'.

Women who do choose to 'play hard to get' are putting other people at risk.

It's to the point where the only reason I know I'm bi with a preference for women, rather than orientated only towards women, is because I fancy celebrities. Every guy I've been with has used some kind of (usually subtle/'romantic' like holding me over train tracks in a 'romantic' way or pushing up against me etc) physical force before I got into the relationship with him, to show dominance & show 'this is what happens when people say no to me' and have then gone onto isolate me from people I trust. So in practice, I stick to women.



The_Face_of_Boo
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 16 Jun 2010
Age: 38
Gender: Male
Posts: 30,132
Location: Beirut, Lebanon.

08 Jan 2021, 8:19 am

When she rejects....


end of story, that's it all, anything else is pointless.


_________________
Come here to get the Block functionality for Wrongplanet:
viewtopic.php?f=13&t=390645


Fnord
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 6 May 2008
Gender: Male
Posts: 45,683
Location: Stendec

08 Jan 2021, 9:18 am

"No" means "No".  "I don't know" means "No".  Silence means "No".  Unconsciousness means "No".  Anything other than "Yes" means "No".  Women do not owe men sex -- it is not a man's right to have sex with any woman of his choosing.  Sex with a woman becomes a man's privilege ONLY if she consents without being threatened or coerced; without that consent, having sex with her is rape.

It does not matter why she turns you down; if she turns you down, walk away.  It is over.  Deal with it.


_________________
*TRE45ON!!*
Lock Him Up!

(Claiming moral equivalency between one's own
immoral acts and those of another is a null defense.)


KT67
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 6 May 2019
Gender: Female
Posts: 2,990

08 Jan 2021, 10:24 am

Fnord wrote:
"No" means "No".  "I don't know" means "No".  Silence means "No".  Unconsciousness means "No".  Anything other than "Yes" means "No".  Women do not owe men sex -- it is not a man's right to have sex with any woman of his choosing.  Sex with a woman becomes a man's privilege ONLY if she consents without being threatened or coerced; without that consent, having sex with her is rape.

It does not matter why she turns you down; if she turns you down, walk away.  It is over.  Deal with it.


Exactly.

And yes, this does apply across genders and between sexes.

Just - be aware that when it comes to someone who's smaller and weaker than you physically, the reason they're not outright saying 'no' is probably because of physical fear. Even if you're a decent person, unless you have built up that trust with them, they don't know that.

The cis het dynamic is a clear demonstration of this because women tend to be about a foot smaller than men with less muscle mass than men. And women tend to be socialised to be 'nice' which means not saying 'f**k off' when they want to or even 'no'. But it applies if you're a big butch woman hitting on regular size women too. And it applies if you're a female body builder who keeps hitting on regular guys & pinning them down & they say 'um...' or if you're a gay guy who keeps finding 5"6 scrawny twinks to hit on and their answer is 'um...'

Obviously it doesn't apply if you're the kind of person who doesn't care how their potential partner feels. But I feel little point in writing to such people - they're not decent people so it's hard to get through to them. I find a point in trying to get through to decent, probably autistic, guys who might genuinely be falling into the 'she's playing hard to get' trap or not realise the kind of bravery it takes for women to say 'no' outright & why they might say 'um...' instead. Because if you've always been the taller partner and the more muscular partner in a situation, it can be hard to put yourself in the shoes of someone who hasn't been and understand why 'no' isn't always spoken outright.



OutsideView
Deinonychus
Deinonychus

User avatar

Joined: 4 Oct 2017
Age: 37
Gender: Male
Posts: 350
Location: England ^not male but apparently you can't change it

08 Jan 2021, 11:30 am

I can definitely understand this and have occasionaly felt scared when having to say "no" to someone; something that was a lot more difficult when I was younger.


_________________
Silence lies steadily against the wood and stone of Hill House. And we who walk here, walk alone.


KT67
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 6 May 2019
Gender: Female
Posts: 2,990

08 Jan 2021, 11:51 am

Yeah I think as younger people it can happen quite a bit with older suitors.

Esp very young, you're still relatively young compared to most adults but I'm talking about older teenagers/people in their middle teenage years. This should be kind of obvious if someone has ever been a pre-teen/early teen with a crush on a teacher/celebrity: would be wrong to reciprocate but doesn't mean those feelings don't exist, onus is on the teacher to reject it anyway.

And it can be hard for aspies and other autistic people - we're told so often that we're 'rude' when we express actual needs like the need to have dimmer lights or have 'blander' foods etc that we can learn to mask by ignoring our own feelings/pain and agreeing to everything someone else sets out. And our body language might not necessarily send out the right 'signals'. Even when it comes to these sensory needs which have nothing to do with adult stuff: if you're in physical pain, be blunt about it! Not rude, just blunt. People might not be aware of it & be able to dim the lights etc if you ask.