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FranzOren
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05 Feb 2021, 9:37 pm

Language use of words:

● Some
● Specific
● Rare
● Unusually


I will use a different language approach, because I don’t want innocent people with mental and
developmental disorders to be discriminated against or cause stigma. Most people with mental
and developmental disorders are more likely to be victims than being perpetrators, but I am also
worried that there are some mental health and developmental disorders or co-morbid mental
disorders that may seem to cause some people to commit crimes unusually more than the
general population.


However, even innocent people can have the same or similar mental, conduct and personality related disorders. There should be more research or there needs to be a change or revision on these specific disorders that I am talking about to not cause discrimination or stigma when innocent people can have conduct and other related disorders.


https://psychiatry.org/newsroom/reporting-on-mental-health-conditions


The lines where websites like this that states about mental illness and violence seem not to
use the right language, because the term mental illness sounds broad and they are not
specifying what people with mental health and developmental disorders are actually more likely
to be victims or criminals. Another problem is that there are people who have mental health and
developmental disorders that are not diagnosed.


The third problem is that it can be hard for the general public not to mention mental illness and
developmental disorders and it depends on what type of mental illness and developmental
disorders we are talking about when it comes to people who committed crimes or antisocial
activities, because of the specific mental disorders that I listed that give great attention to
criminality or antisocial situations.


“People with mental illnesses are no more likely to be violent than those without a mental health
disorder. In fact, those with mental illness are 10 times more likely to be the victims of violent crime.”


I will list examples of some mental health and developmental disorders that may seem to cause you to commit crimes unusually more than the general population:

● Developmental disorders that causes symptoms related to Conduct Disorder
● Oppositional Defiant Disorder
● Intermittent Explosive Disorder
● Conduct Disorder
● Antisocial Personality Disorder
● Pyromania
● Kleptomania
● Rare form of psychotic disorder or specific personality disorders with psychotic features
● Narcissistic Personality Disorder
● Mental Disorders that are caused by illegal substances
● Other specific Conduct related or specific other similar personality disorders
● Rare form of Mental Disorders caused by, injury, biological, environmental factors or
wrong brain surgery that might cause symptoms related to Conduct Disorder
● Exhibitionistic Disorder
● Frotteuristic Disorder
● Voyeuristic Disorder
● Sexual Sadism Disorder
● Other specified paraphilic disorders with related symptoms


Symptoms of Oppositional Defiant Disorder:

1. Often loses temper
2. Often touchy or easily annoyed
3. Often angry and resentful
4. Often argue with authority figures or, for children and adolescents, with adults
5. Often actively refuse or defy to comply with requests from authority figures or with rules
6. Often deliberately annoys others
7. Often blames others for his or her mistakes or misbehavior
8. The child has been spiteful or vindictive at least twice within the past 6 months


Symptoms of Intermittent Explosive Disorder:
● Rage
● Irritability
● Increasing sense of tension
● Racing thoughts
● Increased energy
● Tremors
● Palpitations
● Chest tightness
● Temper tantrums
● Shouting
● Being argumentative
● Getting into fights
● Threatening others
● Assaulting people or animals
● Damaging property
Symptoms of Conduct Disorder:
● Breaking rules without clear reason
● Cruel or aggressive behavior toward people or animals (for example: bullying, fighting,
using dangerous weapons, forcing sexual activity, and stealing)
● Not going to school (truancy, beginning before age 13)
● Heavy drinking and/or heavy drug use
● Intentionally setting fires
● Lying to get a favor or avoid things they have to do
● Running away
● Vandalizing or destroying property

Symptoms of Antisocial Personality Disorder:
1. Failure to conform to social norms concerning lawful behaviors, such as
performing acts that are grounds for arrest.
2. Deceitfulness, repeated lying, use of aliases, or conning others for pleasure or
personal profit.
3. Impulsivity or failure to plan.
4. Irritability and aggressiveness, often with physical fights or assaults.
5. Reckless disregard for the safety of self or others.
6. Consistent irresponsibility, failure to sustain consistent work behavior, or honor
monetary obligations.
7. Lack of remorse, being indifferent to or rationalizing having hurt, mistreated, or
stolen from another person.

2. The individual is at least age 18 years.
3. Evidence of conduct disorder typically with onset before age 15 years.
4. The occurrence of antisocial behavior is not exclusively during schizophrenia or bipolar
Disorder."

I don’t agree with the criteria four, It is possible to have Schizophrenia, Bipolar Disorder or both,
etc and have Antisocial Personality Disorder.

Symptoms of Pyromania:
1. Deliberate and purposeful fire setting on more than one occasion.
2. Tension or affective arousal before the act.
3. Fascination with, interest in, curiosity about, or attraction to fire and its situational
contexts (e.g., paraphernalia, uses, consequences).
4. Pleasure, gratification, or relief when setting fires or when witnessing or participating in
their aftermath.
5. The fire setting is not done for monetary gain, as an expression of sociopolitical ideology,
to conceal criminal activity, to express anger or vengeance, to improve one’s living
circumstances, in response to a delusion or hallucination, or as a result of impaired
judgment (e.g., major neurocognitive disorder, intellectual disability, substance
intoxication).
6. The fire setting is not better explained by conduct disorder, a manic episode, or
antisocial personality disorder. (2, pp. 476–477)

I am not sure if I agree with criteria six, because it is possible to have manic episodes and have Pyromania and Pyromania sounds related to Conduct and related disorders.

Symptoms of Kleptomania:
● Inability to resist powerful urges to steal items that you don't need
● Feeling increased tension, anxiety or arousal leading up to the theft
● Feeling pleasure, relief or gratification while stealing
● Feeling terrible guilt, remorse, self-loathing, shame or fear of arrest after the theft
● Return of the urges and a repetition of the kleptomania cycle

Symptoms of Narcissistic Personality Disorder:
● Has a grandiose sense of self-importance (e.g., exaggerates achievements, expects to
be recognized as superior without actually completing the achievements)
● Is preoccupied with fantasies of success, power, brilliance, beauty, or perfect love.
● Believes that they are "special" and can only be understood by or should associate with,
other special people (or institutions).
● Requires excessive admiration.
● Has a sense of entitlement, such as an unreasonable expectation of favorable treatment
or compliance with his or her expectations).
● Is exploitative and takes advantage of others to achieve their own ends.
● Lacks empathy and is unwilling to identify with the needs of others.
● Is often envious of others or believes that others are envious of them.
● Shows arrogant, haughty behaviors and attitudes

Symptoms of Exhibitionistic Disorder:
Over a period of at least 6 months, a person has recurrent, intense sexually arousing fantasies,
sexual urges, or behaviors involving the exposure of one's genitals to an unsuspecting stranger.

Symptoms of Frotteuristic Disorder:
Frotteuristic disorder involves intense fantasies, urges, and keen sexual arousal centering on
the act of touching an unsuspecting and non-consenting person's breasts, legs, buttocks, or
genitals, or rubbing one's own pelvic area or erect penis against that person, generally from
behind.

Symptoms of Voyeuristic Disorder:
● Persistent and intense sexual arousal from observing people perform sexual activities.
● Becoming distressed or unable to function as a result of voyeurism urges and fantasies.
● Engaging in voyeurism with a person who doesn't give their consent.

Symptoms of Sexual Sadism Disorder:
Symptoms of Sexual Sadism Disorder include: over a period of at least 6 months, a person has
had recurrent, intense sexually arousing fantasies, sexual urges, or behaviors from the physical
or psychological suffering of another person.

Symptoms of Pedophillic Disorder:
Over a period of at least 6 months, a person has had recurrent, intense sexually arousing
fantasies, sexual urges, or behaviors involving sexual activity with a prepubescent child (a child
who has not yet gone through puberty) or children.

In some rare cases, a psychotic disorder might cause a person to commit crimes, but it can be better explained as a conduct related or specific personality disorder with psychotic features.

List of mental and developmental disorders that will make you more likely to be a victim than a perpetrator:

● Most Mental Disorders ( There are a lot of mental disorders, I will just make it short )
● Intellectual Disabilities
● Communication Disorders
● Motor Disorders

When it comes to Learning Disorders, criminals can have learning disorders as well.



NaturalEntity
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07 Feb 2021, 3:12 pm

There may be a higher proportion of people with these disorders that commit crimes. However, that should not be used as a way to demean or dismiss them. And you shouldn't make any assumptions about an individual based on such data.


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FranzOren
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07 Feb 2021, 5:12 pm

Thank you!

I understood.

I am sorry for being so confused as well and I was also worried that I was being biased myself.

In this context I was asking a question, even there was no question mark, because I myself though that some specific mental health and developmental disorders may seem more likely to cause you to commit crimes unusually more than the general population, based on how the symptoms of these disorders were written from the diagnostic manuals that treats mental health and developmental disorders.

Most people with mental health and developmental disorders are more likely to be a victim then being a perpetrator.



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08 Feb 2021, 3:32 pm

Agreed. And people without mental disorders can commit crimes too.


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FranzOren
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08 Feb 2021, 3:47 pm

I agree!

I just think that the symptoms of these disorders are just poorly written or they need to put disclaimer on these disorders to further educate to public and make less confusion, because not everyone with these disorders that I was concerned about commit crimes ether.



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09 Feb 2021, 3:26 pm

At the very least explain that in the diagnosis book.


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CollegeGirlAnon
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14 Feb 2021, 10:24 pm

NaturalEntity wrote:
There may be a higher proportion of people with these disorders that commit crimes. However, that should not be used as a way to demean or dismiss them. And you shouldn't make any assumptions about an individual based on such data.


This.

Also, for claims of abuse of any type, especially if it is from someone with some type of personality disorder, I want to hear BOTH sides.

Like...Liane Holliday Willey. An somewhat famous author in the autism/asperger world.

I never connected with her writing...I read it in high school. It always annoyed me.

Basically...she reminds me of the therapist last week I fired. Diagnosed late, had a kid diagnosed with ASD and then became fascinated with it herself.

Also, I directly asked my former therapist about Willey...she said she had no idea about her. I found that odd. Like...you claim to know so much about autism, and you then claim to not know who a expert on it is. And then other factors played into me getting fed up and firing her.

The rest is what I remember reading in high school about Willey. It could be remembered wrongly.

I think from some autism periodical I read she has past drug use and/knew people into drugs. And ended up in dangerous situations because of that. I have no idea what substances played into that...it would be interesting to find out but I don’t think she will tell us what she used ever.

In any case, I choose to deal with people like that carefully, if at all.

I had a friend (aspie dx) in Jr High who kinda reminds me of her and my former therapist. The teachers wanted her to have a friend, and they kinda tried for years to have her be friends with me.

And I told them I could not stand her for years.

And then finally...when I was in a post high school transitional program with her, I told her I did not want to be friends with her for the last time. And there was a lot of drama with the staff she caused about this. But it did stick.

After I graduated I never heard from her again. I don’t want her to contact me, and I will not contact her.

I am sad she has very few friends.

But the school staff kinda pushing her on me was not good for me mentally (because I had few friends...but I remember generally being happy if I was left largely alone).

Now, this person from Jr High I mention does have a lot of diagnoses. I talked with a Doctor I know...and her physical appearance suggests something else in play. I don’t know if I should say what...I don’t want to be yelled at.

What I will say is this...I would be careful of what you put in your body when you are trying to become pregnant. And when you are pregnant.

I hope I am wrong about this person...I really really do hope that.


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hypostasis
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23 Mar 2021, 12:22 am

I want to make some really important points here and I think it can get a bit philosophical so hang in there for the non-philosophers on WP. Pardon me if it seems like I'm going off on a tangent I promise it all ties together.

First of all, recognize that free will is incoherent. The universe is either deterministic or it's not (it's random). For the sake of argument any combination between the two can also be considered random. If the universe is deterministic then everything that happens must happen exactly as it does and no one is *ultimately* responsible for their actions because they literally couldn't have done anything else. In the other case the universe is random/semi-random. Imagine if every "decision" you made you flipped a coin or rolled a die. That wouldn't really count as a free choice either so no one would be ultimately responsible for anything they did in that universe. Either way no one can be ultimately responsible. Still don't believe me? Let's forget all that and assume free will makes sense for a moment. You can choose to do the right thing or the wrong thing. But can you choose to choose? You didn't wire your brain which makes those decisions. You didn't pick your parents or your genetics society you grew up in etc and even if you did it wouldn't matter because you didn't wire your brain which did the choosing. Even if you "wired your brain" that would generate an infinite regress. So that's the first thing we have to understand. No one is responsible in any *ultimate* sense for what they do.

Imagine a person with a brain tumor that causes angry outbursts and they attack someone. They plead temporary insanity in court and win because their attorney shows it's a brain problem and they couldn't help it and the tumor is safely removed. Now imagine a person without a brain tumor that attacks someone. They have exactly as much ultimate responsibility as the tumor person but we feel differently because we can see the tumor. We can't see the negative life influences, the bad patterns of behavior, the ruined childhood, the emotional deprivation or whatever else happened in the non-tumor person's life that led up to them attacking someone. But if we could see those things, if we could see exactly how their brain grew and how every moment of their life causally forced them into doing what they did then we would have equal sympathy.

That isn't to say they shouldn't be treated differently. A tumor can be medicated, removed, dealt with. Mental illnesses are more abstract than a tumor but they can be managed as well. We see the mentally ill person as a victim dealing with a condition at least partially out of their control and the mentally stable person as a truly responsible perpetrator. But as far as responsibility and criminality goes it's an arbitrary distinction to make. The non-mentally ill perpetrator is no more ultimately responsible for who they are and what they did than a mentally ill person. It makes sense to treat the two differently though NOT because the non-mentally ill are more responsible but because they require very *different* rehabilitation than a mentally ill person.

My point is anybody can make up a LABEL and call it a mental illness and then any person *afflicted* by that label commits a crime because of it gets more sympathy just because we have a word for it. Anybody can see how absurd that is. Having a word to call someone can't make them more or less responsible for a crime.

We get way too hung up on labels. Do we have a label for this or that is this a mental illness is it not are they responsible or aren't they? It's best to treat everyone with as much compassion as possible. Don't throw out the labels but don't use them to decide whether someone should be punished or rehabilitated. Just try to rehabilitate everybody because no one is ultimately responsible. I'm not responsible for the fact that I wasn't born an axe murderer. If I were so unlucky I'd want to see compassion from my fellow humans. We must give compassion to even the worst people because we're not responsible for not being them. Just be kind to all people and don't take the labels too seriously. They're just words people made up after all.



FranzOren
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23 Mar 2021, 12:37 am

Thank you! That is an important details to consider.

I agree!



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29 Mar 2021, 2:12 am

hypostasis wrote:
I want to make some really important points here and I think it can get a bit philosophical so hang in there for the non-philosophers on WP. Pardon me if it seems like I'm going off on a tangent I promise it all ties together.

First of all, recognize that free will is incoherent. The universe is either deterministic or it's not (it's random). For the sake of argument any combination between the two can also be considered random. If the universe is deterministic then everything that happens must happen exactly as it does and no one is *ultimately* responsible for their actions because they literally couldn't have done anything else. In the other case the universe is random/semi-random. Imagine if every "decision" you made you flipped a coin or rolled a die. That wouldn't really count as a free choice either so no one would be ultimately responsible for anything they did in that universe. Either way no one can be ultimately responsible. Still don't believe me? Let's forget all that and assume free will makes sense for a moment. You can choose to do the right thing or the wrong thing. But can you choose to choose? You didn't wire your brain which makes those decisions. You didn't pick your parents or your genetics society you grew up in etc and even if you did it wouldn't matter because you didn't wire your brain which did the choosing. Even if you "wired your brain" that would generate an infinite regress. So that's the first thing we have to understand. No one is responsible in any *ultimate* sense for what they do.

Imagine a person with a brain tumor that causes angry outbursts and they attack someone. They plead temporary insanity in court and win because their attorney shows it's a brain problem and they couldn't help it and the tumor is safely removed. Now imagine a person without a brain tumor that attacks someone. They have exactly as much ultimate responsibility as the tumor person but we feel differently because we can see the tumor. We can't see the negative life influences, the bad patterns of behavior, the ruined childhood, the emotional deprivation or whatever else happened in the non-tumor person's life that led up to them attacking someone. But if we could see those things, if we could see exactly how their brain grew and how every moment of their life causally forced them into doing what they did then we would have equal sympathy.

That isn't to say they shouldn't be treated differently. A tumor can be medicated, removed, dealt with. Mental illnesses are more abstract than a tumor but they can be managed as well. We see the mentally ill person as a victim dealing with a condition at least partially out of their control and the mentally stable person as a truly responsible perpetrator. But as far as responsibility and criminality goes it's an arbitrary distinction to make. The non-mentally ill perpetrator is no more ultimately responsible for who they are and what they did than a mentally ill person. It makes sense to treat the two differently though NOT because the non-mentally ill are more responsible but because they require very *different* rehabilitation than a mentally ill person.

My point is anybody can make up a LABEL and call it a mental illness and then any person *afflicted* by that label commits a crime because of it gets more sympathy just because we have a word for it. Anybody can see how absurd that is. Having a word to call someone can't make them more or less responsible for a crime.

We get way too hung up on labels. Do we have a label for this or that is this a mental illness is it not are they responsible or aren't they? It's best to treat everyone with as much compassion as possible. Don't throw out the labels but don't use them to decide whether someone should be punished or rehabilitated. Just try to rehabilitate everybody because no one is ultimately responsible. I'm not responsible for the fact that I wasn't born an axe murderer. If I were so unlucky I'd want to see compassion from my fellow humans. We must give compassion to even the worst people because we're not responsible for not being them. Just be kind to all people and don't take the labels too seriously. They're just words people made up after all.

It's true that we should be nice to one another, as well as rehab is for the best of everyone.

However when we make decisions and act, we are responsible for everything it causes, that's why it's a good idea to apologize for hurting someone even if it wasn't our intention or it was a mistake of judgement. Collateral damage is still damage by the perpetrator. Being wrong and experiencing consequences teaches us lessons that help us grow in the proper directions.


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FranzOren
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29 Mar 2021, 11:40 am

It's true! Even personality disorders can be reduced by 50% if we learn proper empathy and help each other.



FranzOren
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25 Apr 2021, 11:55 am

Is it possible that I might end up committing crimes without meaning to do so if I don't understand what people are trying to tell me or if I am in panic? I have ASD.

Prof. Sam Vaknin explained that people with HFA (like me) can do something stressful or distressful and that people like me with HFA could commit crimes without meaning to do so or are in panic, because people like me don’t have very good social skills.

I feel scared and confused! Because statistics and studies point out that people with mental health and developmental disorders are less likely to commit crimes and are ten times more likely to be victims than the general population.

Source:

http://mentalhealth.gov/basics/mental-h ... yths-facts

Statistics and studies of mental health, development and personalities are similar in almost all over the world.


Prof. Sam Vaknin explained that only people with HFA (High-functioning Autism) can have conduct disorders and I am one of them. I am a High-functioning person with ASD who also has a diagnosis of Conduct Disorder Unspecified.


https://youtu.be/7GjuAdqi1nA