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KittenRN
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30 Apr 2021, 1:06 am

I find myself getting into verbal fights approximately 2 times a month. Sometimes sales reps, sometimes service providers... last bad one was with my vet. Even though I have a high degree of confidence that I’m in the right in each particular scenario, overall it’s a pattern and I am the common denominator.

It’s like when there’s a key point in the discussion and we disagree my mind becomes my enemy. I get flustered and have a lot of trouble expressing myself fully. It’s like the rationale part of my brain locks. I don’t know if this is Aspergers or just a flaw. I’m extremely upset by this. I am working w a therapist but I feel she is looking up resources (to help me) as we are speaking.

So far our plan is this. When I feel this coming on (my mind shutting down and my mouth becoming reactive) I have a script. I’m to say:
“ I hear that we are interpreting things differently. I need to take a few minutes to process, can I call you back.”

I’m really hopeful that this helps but I’m also looking for more tips, suggestions, activities, or resources that can help.

Overall I’m high functioning and I’m ashamed with how I handle things sometimes. I’m trying to keep positive and solution focused.. but honestly it leaves me feeling shattered.

Has anybody else experienced this?



violetdr3amer
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04 May 2021, 7:36 pm

KittenRN wrote:
I find myself getting into verbal fights approximately 2 times a month. Sometimes sales reps, sometimes service providers... last bad one was with my vet. Even though I have a high degree of confidence that I’m in the right in each particular scenario, overall it’s a pattern and I am the common denominator.

It’s like when there’s a key point in the discussion and we disagree my mind becomes my enemy. I get flustered and have a lot of trouble expressing myself fully. It’s like the rationale part of my brain locks. I don’t know if this is Aspergers or just a flaw. I’m extremely upset by this. I am working w a therapist but I feel she is looking up resources (to help me) as we are speaking.

So far our plan is this. When I feel this coming on (my mind shutting down and my mouth becoming reactive) I have a script. I’m to say:
“ I hear that we are interpreting things differently. I need to take a few minutes to process, can I call you back.”

I’m really hopeful that this helps but I’m also looking for more tips, suggestions, activities, or resources that can help.

Overall I’m high functioning and I’m ashamed with how I handle things sometimes. I’m trying to keep positive and solution focused.. but honestly it leaves me feeling shattered.

Has anybody else experienced this?


Yes definitely. I sometimes get really annoyed when people say stupid or illogical things and get myself into arguments, or get wound up. I also have a habit of calling people out, which doesn't end well.

Do you find yourself to be more irritable when you are tired or overstimulated or stressed? I certainly do.



AprilR
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05 May 2021, 5:16 am

I feel like i CAN be this way but i am way too scared of people to ever argue with them.

But i totally get what you mean. Just today one of my friends said that she isn't consider ing taking the vaccine because of side effects that might take place 10 or 20 years after. I was so surprised and sad to hear that she is not able to think what that means for the people around her. I am scared everyday because my parents are elderly.

I just don't understand how can someone think about 10 years later and not the danger we are under right now. I could say a million things about how absolutely selfish this is and how much this stresses me because we regularly meet. But i know she is not open to commucation, like most illogical people are. They are just walls. So it is best not to argue with people especially uneducated or ignorant people who disregard scientific facts.

In actuality, i admire people who are not afraid of confrontation, who are brave enough to argue when it is scientific facts or basic common sense being discussed (???)



violetdr3amer
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05 May 2021, 6:27 am

AprilR wrote:
I feel like i CAN be this way but i am way too scared of people to ever argue with them.

But i totally get what you mean. Just today one of my friends said that she isn't consider ing taking the vaccine because of side effects that might take place 10 or 20 years after. I was so surprised and sad to hear that she is not able to think what that means for the people around her. I am scared everyday because my parents are elderly.

I just don't understand how can someone think about 10 years later and not the danger we are under right now. I could say a million things about how absolutely selfish this is and how much this stresses me because we regularly meet. But i know she is not open to commucation, like most illogical people are. They are just walls. So it is best not to argue with people especially uneducated or ignorant people who disregard scientific facts.

In actuality, i admire people who are not afraid of confrontation, who are brave enough to argue when it is scientific facts or basic common sense being discussed (???)


I fell out with a friend last year who is an anti-vaxxer (not just for covid but in general). I tried to educate her; the friendship ended by her posting a passive aggressive Facebook status about how people should respect other people's points of view and never talking to me again...



AprilR
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05 May 2021, 6:37 am

violetdr3amer wrote:
AprilR wrote:
I feel like i CAN be this way but i am way too scared of people to ever argue with them.

But i totally get what you mean. Just today one of my friends said that she isn't consider ing taking the vaccine because of side effects that might take place 10 or 20 years after. I was so surprised and sad to hear that she is not able to think what that means for the people around her. I am scared everyday because my parents are elderly.

I just don't understand how can someone think about 10 years later and not the danger we are under right now. I could say a million things about how absolutely selfish this is and how much this stresses me because we regularly meet. But i know she is not open to commucation, like most illogical people are. They are just walls. So it is best not to argue with people especially uneducated or ignorant people who disregard scientific facts.

In actuality, i admire people who are not afraid of confrontation, who are brave enough to argue when it is scientific facts or basic common sense being discussed (???)


I fell out with a friend last year who is an anti-vaxxer (not just for covid but in general). I tried to educate her; the friendship ended by her posting a passive aggressive Facebook status about how people should respect other people's points of view and never talking to me again...


I am sorry to hear that. She was probably not a good friend if she didn't communicate with you directly and stopped talking over that.

I think people know in the back of their minds that they are being irrational but they just don't want to change their views because i guess their pride gets hurt. Which is again absolutely strange to me since it seems too childish. If someone tried to educate me on a subject i know little about and provided scientific evidence i would have no problem changing my views. It seems so childish to be so stubborn, and in this case their actions not only effect them but the people around them.

I am not thinking of severing my ties with my friend since she is a very kind and good person over all. She is just out of touch with reality sometimes and is kind of irrational.
I am thinking of meeting in open spaces when the lockdown ends or possibly not meeting for a while.



kraftiekortie
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05 May 2021, 7:01 am

It’s COVID itself which causes the things that happen “10 or 20 years down the road.”

If vaccines actually caused all those things, we would have serious problems. According to this scenario, virtually every person in the world would have potentially debilitating conditions.

Being argumentative has many causes. I doubt very much that it is specifically an “autism” thing. I’ve known many sociable NTs who are argumentative.



AprilR
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05 May 2021, 7:10 am

kraftiekortie wrote:
It’s COVID itself which causes the things that happen “10 or 20 years down the road.”

If vaccines actually caused all those things, we would have serious problems. According to this scenario, virtually every person in the world would have potentially debilitating conditions.

Being argumentative has many causes. I doubt very much that it is specifically an “autism” thing. I’ve known many sociable NTs who are argumentative.


That's exactly what i thought about kraftie. Even if she gets the virus and recovers easily? There is no guarantee that it won't harm the internal organs in long term. And no guarantee that the people who got infected because of her will recover.

I sometimes wish i was a more argumentative person like my father is. Even though it won't change anyone's mind at least it might the plant the idea in their mind that maybe they might be wrong about some things and it is not the end of the world.



violetdr3amer
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05 May 2021, 7:52 am

AprilR wrote:
I think people know in the back of their minds that they are being irrational but they just don't want to change their views because i guess their pride gets hurt. Which is again absolutely strange to me since it seems too childish. If someone tried to educate me on a subject i know little about and provided scientific evidence i would have no problem changing my views. It seems so childish to be so stubborn, and in this case their actions not only effect them but the people around them.


Omg I couldn't agree more. If someone educates me about something I know little about, I also have no problem changing my views! NTs get so defensive though. I think it's their pride.



King Kat 1
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05 May 2021, 8:07 am

I've gotten myself in trouble with this, with a family member years ago. I KNEW I was in the the right but everyone took there side over mine. In more recent years, I've had this come up at work, someone in particular was totally f---ing something up, because there lazy and incompetent. I totally blew up and got pulled into the managers office, the idiot who caused the whole thing to happen of course got off scott free. What sucks is, this twit got promoted later on.

I hung up on someone from the cable company one time, when my internet kept messing up. I got sick of repeating myself and I was about to start screaming and swearing at the guy. He got smart with me and hung up. I had to go lie on the bed for about a half hour to calm down.

As far as the COVID thing goes, if someone starts conspiracy theory nonsense about that or BS about the 2020 election, I refuse to engage them and walk away.


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kraftiekortie
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05 May 2021, 9:45 am

In truth, most people who get COVID don’t have very many symptoms or pathologies afterwards.

About 10% (which is a high number) get post-COVID symptoms, and are known as “long haulers.”

I’m actually in better shape post-COViD than pre-COVID. I’m very fortunate.



Mona Pereth
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05 May 2021, 2:52 pm

KittenRN wrote:
It’s like when there’s a key point in the discussion and we disagree my mind becomes my enemy. I get flustered and have a lot of trouble expressing myself fully. It’s like the rationale part of my brain locks. I don’t know if this is Aspergers or just a flaw.

As far as I can tell, a lot of autistic people do have this problem, to a greater degree than other people, although it's not clear to what extent this is due to our neurology per se, vs. to what extent it results from a history of ill-treatment by other people. Probably a combination of both.

It sometimes happens to me.

KittenRN wrote:
I’m extremely upset by this. I am working w a therapist but I feel she is looking up resources (to help me) as we are speaking.

So far our plan is this. When I feel this coming on (my mind shutting down and my mouth becoming reactive) I have a script. I’m to say:
“ I hear that we are interpreting things differently. I need to take a few minutes to process, can I call you back.”

Sounds like a good plan.

I guess if the person responds by saying something like, "No, let's settle this right now!" it would then be a good idea to say something like, "I'm sorry, I need to take a break. I will call you back as soon as I can, I promise, please don't worry about that."

KittenRN wrote:
I’m really hopeful that this helps but I’m also looking for more tips, suggestions, activities, or resources that can help.

Overall I’m high functioning and I’m ashamed with how I handle things sometimes. I’m trying to keep positive and solution focused.. but honestly it leaves me feeling shattered.

Has anybody else experienced this?

Occasionally, yes.

More often, though, especially when I was younger, I've been in the opposite position of being the person who wanted to get something settled ASAP when the other person was freaking out and needed a break. When in that position, I often worried that the other person's need for a break meant they intended to abandon me forever. Or, at the very least, I felt very frustrated by my inability to get things resolved immediately.

That's why I think it would be a good idea to include some reassurance in your script if possible.


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07 May 2021, 1:36 pm

When you're right and you know it, it can be frustrating when your greater expertise or knowledge is not being respected. Then things can easily escalate.

In addition to the suggestion your therapist offered, you can also use the maxim "pick your battles." Don't argue if (a) there is little likelihood of convincing the other party, or (b) it doesn't much matter, anyway.

If you do decide to pick this particular battle, remember that your opponent is convinced they are right, too. You are more likely to win them over by skillful dialogue than by asserting your rightness and their wrongness. Now if skillful dialog, think Socratic questioning, rhetoric, etc., is something you can't do, then best not to wade in at all.


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