$3k worth free of coke, heroin, and meth handed out in front

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goldfish21
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18 Jul 2021, 11:30 pm

of the Vancouver Police Department:

https://www.vancouverisawesome.com/vanc ... F0iQbAHn6w

Among those helping distribute clean drugs was a Vancouver city councillor. Good for her! ~6 people die from overdoses in BC every single day -> more than 12,000 people have died from OD's in BC since the opiate crisis began. The need for harm reduction via a clean safe drug supply is extreme and I'm glad that this organization is taking action.


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Mr Reynholm
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23 Jul 2021, 11:02 am

This will cause the drug abuse problem to explode to far greater than it is now. When you subsidize something you get more of it.



funeralxempire
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23 Jul 2021, 11:28 am

Nothing ruins a drug dealer's day like finding out all of his customers have already gotten their day's supply.


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goldfish21
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23 Jul 2021, 1:11 pm

Mr Reynholm wrote:
This will cause the drug abuse problem to explode to far greater than it is now. When you subsidize something you get more of it.


False.

Addicts are going to do drugs, anyways, regardless of where they get them from.

More than 12,000 British Columbians have died of overdoses during the opiate crisis. This is why we need a clean supply from government regulated sources vs. the contaminated street drugs that are killing people - as well as straining first responder and medical resources unnecessarily.


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VegetableMan
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23 Jul 2021, 1:52 pm

It's a stop gap approach, probably only saving addicts lives in the short term. But eventually, if they don't get the help they need, death is inevitable.

Is there a phase two in this solution?


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Mr Reynholm
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23 Jul 2021, 2:43 pm

goldfish21 wrote:
Mr Reynholm wrote:
This will cause the drug abuse problem to explode to far greater than it is now. When you subsidize something you get more of it.


False.

Addicts are going to do drugs, anyways, regardless of where they get them from.

More than 12,000 British Columbians have died of overdoses during the opiate crisis. This is why we need a clean supply from government regulated sources vs. the contaminated street drugs that are killing people - as well as straining first responder and medical resources unnecessarily.

I hope you never run for public office.
People can and do get off of drugs but by making it easy to obtain it is just inviting new people to get on drugs. This will spin out of control and leave many destroyed lives in it's wake.
But of course, government never has to account for it's failures.



funeralxempire
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23 Jul 2021, 3:00 pm

Mr Reynholm wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
Mr Reynholm wrote:
This will cause the drug abuse problem to explode to far greater than it is now. When you subsidize something you get more of it.


False.

Addicts are going to do drugs, anyways, regardless of where they get them from.

More than 12,000 British Columbians have died of overdoses during the opiate crisis. This is why we need a clean supply from government regulated sources vs. the contaminated street drugs that are killing people - as well as straining first responder and medical resources unnecessarily.

I hope you never run for public office.
People can and do get off of drugs but by making it easy to obtain it is just inviting new people to get on drugs. This will spin out of control and leave many destroyed lives in it's wake.
But of course, government never has to account for it's failures.


People can and do get off of drugs, but they need to be alive in order to do so. If the only drugs they have access to are laced with fentanyl they'll end up overdosing before getting off is an option, that's why ensuring they have access to drugs that aren't contaminated or adulterated is important.

The plan you propose has a long legacy of failure and has demonstrated it doesn't work. Maybe it's time to have public policy that learns from past mistakes instead of ignorantly repeating them.


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23 Jul 2021, 3:14 pm

Mr Reynholm wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
Mr Reynholm wrote:
This will cause the drug abuse problem to explode to far greater than it is now. When you subsidize something you get more of it.


False.

Addicts are going to do drugs, anyways, regardless of where they get them from.

More than 12,000 British Columbians have died of overdoses during the opiate crisis. This is why we need a clean supply from government regulated sources vs. the contaminated street drugs that are killing people - as well as straining first responder and medical resources unnecessarily.

I hope you never run for public office.
People can and do get off of drugs but by making it easy to obtain it is just inviting new people to get on drugs. This will spin out of control and leave many destroyed lives in it's wake.
But of course, government never has to account for it's failures.


It is probably specifically for addicts, I doubt they are just handing it out to everyone. Also not only can people die from contaminated drugs, but some of those addictions can cause like deadly withdrawl...so some of them literally are at a point it would be more dangerous for them not to have it.


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funeralxempire
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23 Jul 2021, 3:25 pm

Sweetleaf wrote:
Also not only can people die from contaminated drugs, but some of those addictions can cause like deadly withdrawl...so some of them literally are at a point it would be more dangerous for them not to have it.


To be fair they didn't mention giving away alcohol, benzos or barbiturates. Those are the main ones where sudden cessation can kill the person. Opioids might make you sick and miserable but they won't kill you to suddenly withdraw from.


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kraftiekortie
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23 Jul 2021, 3:27 pm

Withdrawal from drugs is almost always a doozie......



Sweetleaf
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23 Jul 2021, 3:28 pm

funeralxempire wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
Also not only can people die from contaminated drugs, but some of those addictions can cause like deadly withdrawl...so some of them literally are at a point it would be more dangerous for them not to have it.


To be fair they didn't mention giving away alcohol, benzos or barbiturates. Those are the main ones where sudden cessation can kill the person. Opioids might make you sick and miserable but they won't kill you to suddenly withdraw from.


Hmm I thought heroin at least could cause that.


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funeralxempire
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23 Jul 2021, 3:35 pm

Sweetleaf wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
Also not only can people die from contaminated drugs, but some of those addictions can cause like deadly withdrawl...so some of them literally are at a point it would be more dangerous for them not to have it.


To be fair they didn't mention giving away alcohol, benzos or barbiturates. Those are the main ones where sudden cessation can kill the person. Opioids might make you sick and miserable but they won't kill you to suddenly withdraw from.


Hmm I thought heroin at least could cause that.


Heroin and other opioids have basically the same withdrawal symptoms, caused by suppressing one's own endorphin production. It's unpleasant enough that it contributes to making opioids hard to quit but it won't kill you.


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goldfish21
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23 Jul 2021, 3:39 pm

VegetableMan wrote:
It's a stop gap approach, probably only saving addicts lives in the short term. But eventually, if they don't get the help they need, death is inevitable.

Is there a phase two in this solution?


All humans are eventually going to die. Not all drug addicts die from drug overdoses or addiction related illnesses.

Phase 1: Address the overdose crisis. Allowing the black market to continue as it is is killing people.

Phase 2: Not sure - but I’d like to see full decriminalization Or legalization of all drugs + education/counselling/rehab services etc like Portugal did over a decade ago.


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goldfish21
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23 Jul 2021, 3:40 pm

Mr Reynholm wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
Mr Reynholm wrote:
This will cause the drug abuse problem to explode to far greater than it is now. When you subsidize something you get more of it.


False.

Addicts are going to do drugs, anyways, regardless of where they get them from.

More than 12,000 British Columbians have died of overdoses during the opiate crisis. This is why we need a clean supply from government regulated sources vs. the contaminated street drugs that are killing people - as well as straining first responder and medical resources unnecessarily.

I hope you never run for public office.
People can and do get off of drugs but by making it easy to obtain it is just inviting new people to get on drugs. This will spin out of control and leave many destroyed lives in it's wake.
But of course, government never has to account for it's failures.


~90 years of prohibition has created this mess. What makes you think more prohibition is the solution?


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goldfish21
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23 Jul 2021, 3:42 pm

funeralxempire wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
Also not only can people die from contaminated drugs, but some of those addictions can cause like deadly withdrawl...so some of them literally are at a point it would be more dangerous for them not to have it.


To be fair they didn't mention giving away alcohol, benzos or barbiturates. Those are the main ones where sudden cessation can kill the person. Opioids might make you sick and miserable but they won't kill you to suddenly withdraw from.


There is an organization that dispenses free alcohol daily to the chronically dependent on the DTES. Has been for years.


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funeralxempire
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23 Jul 2021, 3:49 pm

goldfish21 wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
Also not only can people die from contaminated drugs, but some of those addictions can cause like deadly withdrawl...so some of them literally are at a point it would be more dangerous for them not to have it.


To be fair they didn't mention giving away alcohol, benzos or barbiturates. Those are the main ones where sudden cessation can kill the person. Opioids might make you sick and miserable but they won't kill you to suddenly withdraw from.


There is an organization that dispenses free alcohol daily to the chronically dependent on the DTES. Has been for years.


That's good to know and it's proof that it's already an approach we use with substances other than the three they were giving out.

I was just pointing out that it wasn't quite as grim as Sweetleaf was suggesting, that users of the three substances being given out aren't at risk of dying from withdrawal. That's not a reason to not support a more permanent implementation of this approach though, I support this approach.


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