When men were men...

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Would you please update the "Computers, Math, Science, and Technology" forum description to be less misogynist? It is 2021 after all. Amusing myself: "When women were women and could punch the heck out of a card" --- my (ASD) mom worked for NASA and PCR and programmed with punch cards. I'm a wicked systems analyst myself. Sarcasm: Oh, wait, there is a Women's forum, so is the Computer forum the de facto Men's forum? My bad.

Fact: An ivy league university changed some computer and engineering course names and descriptions and saw the female enrollment more than double. Titles and descriptions matter for inclusivity.

Let's not subconsciously put off near half of us here (the mostly undiagnosed gender).

It is not nice being a man.

That's besides the point though. SharonB's right to point out that women have a place in technical fields and that it's wrong to act like those fields are reserved for men.

Besides, preserving misogyny doesn't make things any better for men.

I don't know what a misgynmy is.

All I know is these days I am under continual attack from society for being a man.

So because I hate being attacked for being a man, I hate women?

I don't get what the thread is on about? It is to attack me because I am a man?

The "Computers, Math, Science and Technology" description that the OP is talking about:


Please stop derailing every thread talking about misogyny or women being in STEM fields with your own personal gripes about being a man, it's off topic and distasteful.

When did you get attacked? SharonB mentioned that one forum had a problem with it's description being misogynistic and that it could be improved to be inclusive. That's not an attack on you or even directly related to you.

You said you didn't know what a misgynmy is so I gave you the definition. That's also not an attack, I didn't make an accusation, I just gave you a definition.

To actually respond to the OP, when I first came on here I thought that description was a little odd. Since Alex isn't around much I don't really think it'll be changed, but I wouldn't mind it if it was.

Assuming MountainGoat is genuinely curious or there is a misunderstanding, I will clarify.

MountainGoat, the Forum description currently has "when men were men..." which subconsciously invites "men" to the forum and not others, plus as you point out, depending on interpretation, it either makes fun of or encourages a gender norm for "manly" men, which can be hurtful to some men also.

Yes, in our society today, it's hard to be who we are: regardless of gender identity. to grossly generalize, when a person is "supposed" to be a certain way, that's a problem. When one group is addressed and others (subconsciously) excluded, that's a problem. People are all ways which goes well beyond gender roles.

You (inadvertently) raise a good point that to say Man or Woman is exclusive of folks who identify as neither. My husband's native culture recognized five genders. I wonder that they addressed groups simply as "People", rather than "Ladies and Gentlemen" and the sort. We could learn a thing or two from our ancestors sometimes.

Some asides from computer history that come to mind: computer, Ada Lovelace, and Admiral Hopper.

^^ Thank you for the links. It's good to see a face which represents a part of herstory I wasn't aware of.

LOL - Teasing: Admiral Hopper has the typical expression of a woman in technology: grim.
Seriously: I am currently in a lot of pain about the overarching topic, but hope to make or witness small positive changes at least.

Well, tech, computers and maths is still dominated by men but let's take into account the practicality of deliberately going out of our way acknowledge women also play a role.

It seems like going out of one's way for the sake of it.

Sometimes when one "goes out of [their] way" it becomes the way.

I retired from IT. I had many female co-workers. And I think I had more female office-mates than males.

However, perhaps fewer of the gals stayed hands-on in IT. Many of them went into management. I probably had more years working for female supervisors then for male supervisors. One gal was my supervisor in three companies--consecutively. (Corporate mergers and acquisitions were involved.)

Who attacked you? I don't see anyone here attacking you for being a man. It sounds like a strawman created by fragile men trying to be victims and you are falling for it.