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Angnix
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17 Jan 2022, 2:10 pm

TW: Severe parental/spiritual abuse
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This is a question for anyone autistic who is spiritual in some way, Christian or Pagan especially... But also agnostic/atheist...

Trigger warning again, this is bad...

As a child, my mother was so convinced I was evil before I was born she tried her own abortion one month before her due date, I lived, but she wasn't allowed to raise me... But at the age of 6 she tried to burn me to death ...

My grandma tried to raise me strict Christian, but I had what seemed to be constant tantrums (meltdowns) so I was always told I was being bad. I refused baptism because I was afraid of the water. But I rebelled and did stuff against my upbringing... Like being drawn to traditionally pagan stuff, forbidden science (evolution) and forbidden video games. I tried to join a Christian group in college but wasn't totally accepted because I studied animals and evolution...

Last Christian church I stepped into they were afraid of me, saying I was demon-possesed so bad they tried and couldn't get them out...

I'm the meantime my grandma said before she died I was eternally doomed and she said she was upset she'd spend eternity without me...

But I over compensate by being extra nice, a people pleaser... Because I don't want this evil fate... In fact I hate evil and I'm tired of people saying these things!! !

I found out that our ancestors, quite recently were Pagan, and much of the younger members of my family are turning especially toward eclectic witchcraft... They like me... But grandma believed witches had bad fates, but I find nowadays the unreligious, atheists and witches treat me better than Christians I know, like the uncle that mistreats me often hates on my Pagan/Atheist family members.

Plus now being diagnosed as neurodiverse, I'm wondering if my different mind lead these people believe I was evil? Like all my meltdowns???

Is there a correlation??? Isn't all this evil spoken against me just abuse??? My therapist keeps telling me it is.


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Mona Pereth
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17 Jan 2022, 9:51 pm

Question: How do you define "evil"?

To most people (other than the more authoritarian Christians), something can be "evil" only if it causes actual harm. Usually, "evil" means intentionally causing actual harm.

To the more authoritarian Christians, on the other hand, "evil" is rebellion against (their concept of) "God" -- regardless of whether there's any actual, concrete harm.


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Angnix
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17 Jan 2022, 11:30 pm

Mona Pereth wrote:
Question: How do you define "evil"?

To most people (other than the more authoritarian Christians), something can be "evil" only if it causes actual harm. Usually, "evil" means intentionally causing actual harm.

To the more authoritarian Christians, on the other hand, "evil" is rebellion against (their concept of) "God" -- regardless of whether there's any actual, concrete harm.


Your second definition of evil, I don't do things on purpose to harm others, I avoid that and if I hurt someone I punish myself, but I'm talking about disobeying rules set by the church that technically hurt nobody, but according to the church are against God (masturbation/sex before marriage, certain video games, studying evolution, believing in "millions of years old" questioning Christianity, etc .. ) but my mom/grandma for some reason believed I was true evil, and we'll actually I don't think they made a destination, gmto then all Sin is equal, so if you masturbate, you might as well as killed someone


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magz
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18 Jan 2022, 3:26 am

Angnix wrote:
Mona Pereth wrote:
Question: How do you define "evil"?

To most people (other than the more authoritarian Christians), something can be "evil" only if it causes actual harm. Usually, "evil" means intentionally causing actual harm.

To the more authoritarian Christians, on the other hand, "evil" is rebellion against (their concept of) "God" -- regardless of whether there's any actual, concrete harm.


Your second definition of evil, I don't do things on purpose to harm others, I avoid that and if I hurt someone I punish myself, but I'm talking about disobeying rules set by the church that technically hurt nobody, but according to the church are against God (masturbation/sex before marriage, certain video games, studying evolution, believing in "millions of years old" questioning Christianity, etc .. ) but my mom/grandma for some reason believed I was true evil, and we'll actually I don't think they made a destination, gmto then all Sin is equal, so if you masturbate, you might as well as killed someone
That's totally messed up theology, actually quite harmful.
Your family doesn't look like mentally healthy.


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Mona Pereth
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18 Jan 2022, 4:34 am

magz wrote:
Angnix wrote:
to then all Sin is equal, so if you masturbate, you might as well as killed someone
That's totally messed up theology, actually quite harmful.

Unfortunately, all too commonplace among Protestant Christian fundamentalists and evangelicals. "Sin is sin" is a commonly-heard saying.

The Catholic Church, on the other hand, does distinguish between "mortal sin" and "venial sin" -- but puts masturbation in the category of "mortal sin," at least if done by a person who is aware of Catholic teaching about sex.


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magz
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18 Jan 2022, 6:37 am

Catholicism also recognizes various weights of different sins. I was taught about two classifications on sins, one about nature and the other about seriousness.

Anyway, beliefs aside, what Angnix describes about her family looks horribly unhealthy and harmful.


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Fnord
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18 Jan 2022, 9:38 am

magz wrote:
Catholicism also recognizes various weights of different sins. I was taught about two classifications on sins, one about nature and the other about seriousness.  Anyway, beliefs aside, what Angnix describes about her family looks horribly unhealthy and harmful.
Angnix and I are both from Michigan, where a LOT of people use the Bible to justify their own prejudices (i.e., racsim, sexism, et cetera), and where anything they do not like is a sin.  None of what she posted surprises me; but only details one of the many reasons why I left Michigan and ended up in California.



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18 Jan 2022, 9:40 am

I know you are definitely not an "evil person," Angnix.

It sounds like you've been through a lot of trauma. Have you spoken about your mother trying to burn you to death when you were 6 to a therapist?

I'm sorry you've had such a rough life. But you still have a long way to go. I truly hope you get one of those bird jobs.



aghogday
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18 Jan 2022, 12:32 pm



Sadly, Your Story of So-Called 'Fated Evil' and
True 'Spiritual Abuse' Is Common Place

in Most All Religions Against

Whoever Is Marginalized

From Tradition As

Tradition By Very
Nature Excludes;

Yes, Tradition By Very
Nature Excludes Those
Who Do Not Go By Traditional Rules;

And Those Who Are Not Born And Behave
By Traditional Expectations, So Difficult Indeed

As Humans Are Ruled By Stories of Common Symbols
That Are Indeed Co-Created Stories From First
Spoon-Fed Life After Birth;

And Indeed Yes, Human
Stories That Bond and
Bind By Core Definition
of Religion, Politics, And
Even Shared Philosophies too

Have the Potential to Create Heaven
Or Purgatory or Yes in Your Case Against
The Marginalized Among Us, HeLL ON EartH Indeed For REAL.

MY My How Brilliant The So-called Founding Fathers And Mothers
of Our Country Were And Still Are That Separate Church From State

And Allow Us To Escape the Ignorance of Our Parents And Even Allow
Programs Like Social Security in a More Perfect Union to Take Care of

The Disabled Marginalized that Way too; And Those Elders Who Finally

May Escape The Slavery That Work for Pay Often Brings too; And

While It's True, i Wasn't Threatened to Be Burned By Any Parent

By Act, There Are Surely Slow Ways of Burning Children
By Tradition of Religion, Yes Politics, Yes Shared

Philosophies, Yes Culture, And Even Science
When It Has Not Been Corrected As

A More Accurate
Story of

The Nature
of Existence

And Human Nature

Potentials Greater too...

For True Homosexuality
Used to Be Considered Mental
Illness By The Arms of Science

And Behavior Still Called Out As Evil in Church
And Even Hurricane Winds That only By Nature
Spread Ocean Warmth for All Life to Flourish in Balance More;

True, i've Had Relatives Turn to Triggers of Guns Loving Their
Parents More Than Wanting to Live Not Accepted For Who They Are

BY RULE OF IGNORANCE OF CHURCH, RELIGION, AND SO-CALLED GOD;

And True, When i Fell Ill to a Synergy of 19 Life Threatening Illnesses From
Wake to Sleep for 66 Months, Including the Worst Pain Known to Humankind
Type Two Trigeminal Neuralgia, My Mother Suggested i Was Getting Paid Back

For my X-Catholic
Irish Priest Grandfather's

Decision to Leave the Church
Making the Reality of My Existence
Even Possible in the First Damned Place...

And What Do i Remember of Childhood, YES,

Pleasure Is Evil Don't Touch Yourself Pleasure is Evil...

And What About Church Always Looking Forward to Death
The Most to Meet And Greet And Live With Someone Called
God And Jesus Who Looks Like A Hippy From the 60's That Folks Spit

on in 'Trump'
Town USA

Back in the
Early 70's then

And Oh Yeah, me too,
By The Christian Onward
Marching Soldiers As Boys
Who Said Boys Are Not Allowed
to Smile In Jesus Town USA, so Sure,

They Spit on me too; and Sure i Had Long Hair too...

Just For F88KinG Smiling in Trump/JeSuS Town USA...

i Say That As Where i Live Once Was in the Record Books
As Having the Most Christian Churches Per Square Mile
Per Locality in the United States, And Recently Was

Still Assessed By Social Science As the Most
Difficult Place for Someone Different to be

Accepted in the United States As Well;

True, Some THINGS Don't Change Much;
And Some Things Do As It's True, i Practically

Had to get Strong as 'Superman' to Do me Free

And Now i Do And NO One F's With me Anymore hehe...
True Now i Public Dance Free Style Martial Arts With Ballet And You

Get to to do that

(16,044 Miles
in 100 Months)

Even in JeSuS/
Trump Town

USA When Ya
Leg Press Up to
1520 Pounds Still at age 61...

i Set my Self F in Free From All the Ignorance

And i Still Arrive Late at Catholic Church Around
the Time the Homily Starts, Just to Sing A Few Songs

In Ascending Transcending Flowing Way of Free Creativity With
Total Strangers As True, Gay Jesuit Priests Made Some Fabulous

Uplifting Loving Songs For the Catholic Church As There is Mystical Religion;
Yes Now That Still Reflects More A Way of Panentheism Within the Small Confines

of the Catholic OverAll Faith too; With Folks Like Franciscan Monk/Priest Richard Rohr...
And True, Yes Real

Freedom

of Nature in
God And God
In Nature With No

Separation Not Even
A Name Required As Whenever

Someone Says "In the Name of God"

You Can Just About Be Assured That is
The Introduction to Subjugate, Control,

And Erase Basic Human Nature Freedoms in Prison

And True in the Confines of Real Purgatory And HeLL ON EartH;
Particularly, For those Who are Born Different, Experience Life Differently

And Behave

Past the
Expectations
of Control Still Now...

Humans Lived Many
Generations With Few Options
to Escape the Ignorance; Now

We Can, We Will, And We Actually
Do, Thanks to those Who Came Before
US And At Least Provided Avenues for A More 'Perfect Union' Now...

And Yeah, i've Personally Quelled a Significant Amount of Ignorance
in Just the Catholic Church i Visit, through Efforts Just Like This Free
Verse Poetic Story Here; Where the Deacons Accosted Hurricanes And
Homosexual Behavior as Evil And Single Women As Not Fit to Be Mothers;

All it took Was One Email
Written Like this

And Bang Bang

The Head Priest

Shut-Up the Deacons
From Doing it Again until

Trump Came Along And All

The Critters Came Out of the Motel in Broad Day-Light With No Shame...

And That's Why i Come Now, No Earlier than the Homily As That And Requiring

No Social Distancing And No Masking During the Truly Deadly Part of the Delta Variant

Lost
Any
Small
Amount of
Respect i Had
Left For the Catholic
Church for at Least
Listening to Constructive
Criticism And Making Changes

That i Instituted From Within that
Were Inspired By The Horrors that
My Relatives And i Experienced at the
Hands of the Catholic Church; Not to Mention

my Mother Who Fell As So Many Older Folks Do
To the Land of Fox News And the Like, Sleeping
in the Pulpit With The Church too, DarK iN Ignorance...

Honestly, It's Just Part of the Human Condition; Albeit
Very Dark; Yet Reflective of the Fact We Together Create
Stories of Life to Bond And Bind Over That Are Both Heaven and
Hell; And All the Grey SHades of the Tween; i Write, Direct, Produce,

Play

my Own Story

Cause i Can, WiLL, And DO NoW.

What You Experienced Was 'Pure
Evil' And Yes Very Much Motivated
By The Twisted Dark Analogies of the Church
That Go As Far As Suggesting 'Literally', An All Loving
Forgiving Merciful God, 'They' Call Jesus By Direction Then

And According to Matthew, Change Human Sheep into
Goats And Burn Them Forever if they Don't Clothe And

Feed the Homeless
Person on the Street;

of Course Not Recognizing

That the Person Who Does Not

Have What it Takes to Help the Homeless

Person is the Poorest Human of All on the Street

Needing Help the Most And Surely Forgiveness the Same...

It's Difficult
For Folks to
Escape What
They've Been
Spoon-Fed From
Birth And Very Scary
When They are Convinced
That Life Doesn't Even Really Start until After Death;

If There Has Ever Been A Biggest Lie to Subjugate,
Control, And Master Human Beings Away from their
Natural Freedoms And Living Human Potentials That Indeed

Trumps
Trump's

Big Lie By Far,
Thousands of Years Far...

Why People Can't See this
Is Surely Beyond What i See
For Damned Sure in Real Heaven Now Free...

-my Story too...



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Archmage Arcane
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19 Jan 2022, 1:18 am

My semi-educated guess is that the fact you are different scares certain people, and since showing fear equals showing weakness to those people, they will claim you're possessed by their invented Devil.

I've read your posts here on and off for a while. You certainly don't seem evil. I think that if you're melting down now and then, you may be reacting to sensory overload of some sort. Abuse would certainly fit that bill.

I've had dealings with traditional Catholics and evangelical Protestants, and while some of them are truly wonderful people, others are just plain evil. When I encounter that type of evil, I know where their Devil came from. They created him in their image. I'm familiar with their theology, and the best guess I have is that some of them misinterpret their own theology to justify being just plain evil. It may have been wholly intentional when the misinterpretation began during the Roman Empire, but now it's become tradition. The Devil isn't real, but the evil certainly is. Now when you point out the evil, you're attacking their traditions and religion. Sorry. The Emperor has no clothes. Tell the fundamentalists who worship a politician instead of their deity to read Matthew 24:24. [Yep, a Witch can quote the Bible and not burst into flames :) ].

Let's put some things to rest here:

Your meltdowns are the reaction of your brain wiring to your surroundings. They are not the result of demonic possession. The fact that you behave differently from 'normal' people [that's in single quotes because it's a utopian ideal rather than a real thing; hence "Normal is a setting on a dryer"] is also due to your brain wiring.

Self-pleasuring is not a sin. It's part of nature. In the Charge of the Goddess, She says 'all acts of love and pleasure are My rituals'. That's expressing it about as literally as possible. It's not a sin. It's sacred.

Your family situation sounds very abusive [at least the way it's described here]. My inclination is to say 'find a way out'. Your therapist is right.

Your fate is up to you to change. I believe you can manifest your own reality. You're 'fated' to anything you desire.

/High Priest hat



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19 Jan 2022, 10:01 pm

Nasty experiences to be sure.

To me, there's no such thing as spiritual, and evil is just a dodgy term that people use to label things they don't like. It helps them to avoid owning up to their role in the matter.

I can understand why you found atheists treated you better. My advice would be to ditch the fairy stories and to try to relate to others who have done the same, though I wouldn't go so far as to say that all religious people are dangerous. Those religionists you encountered sound pretty harmful. And if you can't get away from them, keep a low profile and plan your escape carefully and quietly.