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BILLIONAIRE HEDGE-FUND MANAGER WARNS A “REVOLUTION” IS COMIN

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Nades
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27 Jan 2022, 12:18 pm

Dox47 wrote:
This is one of those areas where I part with the left economically, as it almost feels more like an emotional argument when landlords come up, and I can never get a straight answer about who is going to build and maintain housing if not the private market, as everyone has seen what government housing looks like and doesn't want that.


Yip I always get the same feeling too. Nobody provides a straight answer and instead just go off on a emotional tangent while dodging every question.



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27 Jan 2022, 12:23 pm

goldfish21 wrote:
Dox47 wrote:
This is one of those areas where I part with the left economically, as it almost feels more like an emotional argument when landlords come up, and I can never get a straight answer about who is going to build and maintain housing if not the private market, as everyone has seen what government housing looks like and doesn't want that.


What about some sort of co-op model?

We have some here. Not a ton, but there are some and there could be a lot more.

https://www.chf.bc.ca/faqs/

^There’s a link within that bc specific site to an international co-op association website. Seems there are co-ops following similar guidelines around the world.
Co-ops are very common here, I'd risk a claim that it's the most popular living arrangement in urban Poland.
That includes private investors who buy grounds, design and build blocks and then sell them apartment-by-apartment to function as co-ops.


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27 Jan 2022, 1:03 pm

auntblabby wrote:
circumstances don't allow very many lower-working class to "upskill." the only thing that enabled it for me was being forced to join the military. not everybody can take that route.


It's very tricky. Once in that situation it's very hard to get out and I'm perplexed as to how to reliably get out of that hole.

The biggest cause for ending up living paycheck to paycheck seems to be leaving the parents home at a young age while not ready. It happened to my sister and took her years to get out of that rut. It's usually a lot easier and simpler to make sure a sizable surplus of money is left over before leaving the parents home than scaping together enough to move out and then having to upskill or look for a better job afterwards when all that flexibility is gone.



magz
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27 Jan 2022, 1:27 pm

Nades wrote:
auntblabby wrote:
circumstances don't allow very many lower-working class to "upskill." the only thing that enabled it for me was being forced to join the military. not everybody can take that route.


It's very tricky. Once in that situation it's very hard to get out and I'm perplexed as to how to reliably get out of that hole.

The biggest cause for ending up living paycheck to paycheck seems to be leaving the parents home at a young age while not ready. It happened to my sister and took her years to get out of that rut. It's usually a lot easier and simpler to make sure a sizable surplus of money is left over before leaving the parents home than scaping together enough to move out and then having to upskill or look for a better job afterwards when all that flexibility is gone.

Some have parents living paycheck-to-paycheck or worse...


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27 Jan 2022, 1:47 pm

magz wrote:
Nades wrote:
auntblabby wrote:
circumstances don't allow very many lower-working class to "upskill." the only thing that enabled it for me was being forced to join the military. not everybody can take that route.


It's very tricky. Once in that situation it's very hard to get out and I'm perplexed as to how to reliably get out of that hole.

The biggest cause for ending up living paycheck to paycheck seems to be leaving the parents home at a young age while not ready. It happened to my sister and took her years to get out of that rut. It's usually a lot easier and simpler to make sure a sizable surplus of money is left over before leaving the parents home than scaping together enough to move out and then having to upskill or look for a better job afterwards when all that flexibility is gone.

Some have parents living paycheck-to-paycheck or worse...


Moving out often makes it worse. It's usually far cheaper to spread the bills out over many living in one household than to separate out into two or three.



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27 Jan 2022, 2:15 pm

^ when you have reasonable, non-abusive parents, it may be.
Otherwise, I've encountered really horrible fights over money, living, control, etc.
Addictions make it even worse.
Sometimes the only escape available is a physical one.


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27 Jan 2022, 2:29 pm

I've seen people say they couldn't afford to live with their parents because they couldn't afford to have them at home. I was like what? This is so foreign to me. I mean the kids would have jobs right to support themselves. Buy their own food and clothing and help pitch in with the bills like water and electric.

As someone who grew up in a normal household, it's better to stay living with your parents and some money is better than no money. This was my mom's saying to my ex when he was refusing to get a $10 job because he didn't want to flip burgers and bike two miles each way. This was also someone who even refused to get his license and he had a car at his parents. You can see why he is my ex. I felt bad for his parents as well because he was living with them and wasn't working.


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27 Jan 2022, 2:42 pm

League_Girl wrote:
I've seen people say they couldn't afford to live with their parents because they couldn't afford to have them at home. I was like what? This is so foreign to me. I mean the kids would have jobs right to support themselves. Buy their own food and clothing and help pitch in with the bills like water and electric.

As someone who grew up in a normal household, it's better to stay living with your parents and some money is better than no money. This was my mom's saying to my ex when he was refusing to get a $10 job because he didn't want to flip burgers and bike two miles each way. This was also someone who even refused to get his license and he had a car at his parents. You can see why he is my ex. I felt bad for his parents as well because he was living with them and wasn't working.


Have older adult children of people like that living on both sides of me . But children have indulged in their own addictions and it seems the parents have been enabling these adult children all their lives,With the few exceptions thst they have found a woman to s upport them for months at a time . So they never learned to make a way in the real world . And either they have lost their license or whatever . And both of them and their sister have dead vehicles sitting in their driveways. None of them seem to have ever held any jobs either for the hours I see them there. And both of their parents belong in rest homes by now.


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Last edited by Jakki on 27 Jan 2022, 5:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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27 Jan 2022, 4:28 pm

magz wrote:
^ when you have reasonable, non-abusive parents, it may be.
Otherwise, I've encountered really horrible fights over money, living, control, etc.
Addictions make it even worse.
Sometimes the only escape available is a physical one.


It depends entirely on how well everyone gets along under the same roof but I noticed that the usual point where everything starts going wrong is when kids move out of their parents house. Many just move out in excitement without realising that having just enough to pay the bills and nothing more gets tiring quickly.

Being able to stay at home, the cost savings it brings and the flexibility to jump on the correct track in life is a lot easier than hopping on any track only to have to somehow get on another later.



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27 Jan 2022, 4:58 pm

Nades wrote:
It depends entirely on how well everyone gets along under the same roof but I noticed that the usual point where everything starts going wrong is when kids move out of their parents house. Many just move out in excitement without realising that having just enough to pay the bills and nothing more gets tiring quickly.

Being able to stay at home, the cost savings it brings and the flexibility to jump on the correct track in life is a lot easier than hopping on any track only to have to somehow get on another later.
Staying with the parents after 18 is fine if your family's culture encourages it.  My parents informed me that after I turned 18 and graduated high school, I was to either move out or pay rent.  I moved out a week after graduation, moved into a dorm room on campus, paid my own tuition by working multiple jobs, and was treated as if I had run out on them in their time of need!



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27 Jan 2022, 5:02 pm

I rent from my parents and live with them - it’s mutually beneficial w/ my dad’s cancer treatments etc.

I Could afford to rent elsewhere, but why waste money? It’s EXTREMELY expensive to buy/rent here, so adult children living with their parents or entire married with kids families back at mom and dad’s is very, very, common. We have the highest rate of adult children at home in the country. It’s so common it isn’t even weird/socially unacceptable - it’s just understood that housing is so expensive families tend to stick together under one roof more than ever.

There are also more than 100k Indian immigrants in my suburb city and they come from a collectivist culture where multiple generations live together. It’s not uncommon for them to have 6-10k+ square foot homes to accommodate their growing families. So that culture helps normalize the practice here big time.


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27 Jan 2022, 5:22 pm

Fnord wrote:
Nades wrote:
It depends entirely on how well everyone gets along under the same roof but I noticed that the usual point where everything starts going wrong is when kids move out of their parents house. Many just move out in excitement without realising that having just enough to pay the bills and nothing more gets tiring quickly.

Being able to stay at home, the cost savings it brings and the flexibility to jump on the correct track in life is a lot easier than hopping on any track only to have to somehow get on another later.
Staying with the parents after 18 is fine if your family's culture encourages it.  My parents informed me that after I turned 18 and graduated high school, I was to either move out or pay rent.  I moved out a week after graduation, moved into a dorm room on campus, paid my own tuition by working multiple jobs, and was treated as if I had run out on them in their time of need!


I never understood parents like that. I pay my mother "rent" which is basically all the bills for the house split 50/50 with my mother. It works out well for us both.

Empty nest syndrome is all to real. Parents might dream of getting rid of the kids but it usually hits them hard.

My sister moved out at a very young age and it took her a very long time for her to get back on her feet. Looking at my friends, it's usually obvious in hindsight who was going to sink and swim once leaving their parents home. They either had a stable job to pay their bills with and have money left over or they didn't. It was as simple as that.



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27 Jan 2022, 5:48 pm

It’s that period of time inbetween, when a child before adulthood is still at home, and is time to learn a trade or
Get on track for a profession . So they can support a family of their own ? In a ideal world? Or use that learning time to get enough knowledge to be able to contribute to the parents household. But that’s just not how it always goes
It seems . But no one always tells a person , aspie or NT that’s what is expected , at that time in their lives. Or possibly their situation may not allow for that. Personally as weird as it was, I learned that from a Rock and Roll song by Pink Floyd . And it took me a very long time to learn to be able to interact socially with others . And had very tolerant parents of my being able to be able to fully leave the nest. And sometime to recover from trauma induced by siblings and one parent .


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