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Pteranomom
Deinonychus
Deinonychus

Joined: 21 Apr 2022
Age: 41
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26 Apr 2022, 12:19 pm

I have 4 kids--14 (m), 12 (m), and 10 (f) years old, plus the baby. We'll ignore him. My 12 yr old is more or less "high functioning autistic." He's a sweet kid but obviously has some weaknesses--for example, clumsiness. His siblings are pretty understanding overall but I know things are hard on his sister, who is simultaneously younger and more mature than he is. I don't want her to feel like we're being unfair by asking more of her than we ask of her brother, but frankly she is capable of things he isn't.

Like any siblings, they sometimes tease each other, but my daughter (who has her own difficulties with socializing) often thinks her brother is making fun of her when I think he isn't. He will imitate her or her or their elder brother, which I think is just him trying to be funny or open a conversation, but she gets very offended (especially when he imitates the tone of voice the eldest uses when talking to the baby). She has asked him repeatedly to stop doing this, but he keeps doing it, so now she's progressed to screaming when he talks to her.

I can't tell which of them is "In the right" and worry that they are mutually bullying each other. Obviously I have tried talking to both of them, explaining to her that her brother probably isn't trying to be mean and explaining to him that his sister doesn't like this, but they're still at loggerheads.

What would you do?



timf
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27 Apr 2022, 7:02 am

The judicial aspects of parenting can seem unending.

You might set both parties down and in the process of adjudication review the steps that led to the confrontation.

One of the initiating events was the mimicry of voice. Your son can be asked if he did this. If he answers that he did, he can be asked to present a defense of why he did it in view of the fact that his sister had asked him not to.

The judicial ruling in this aspect of the case might be that your son receives a negative consequence (a swat on the hand or time on a chair) for what might be determined to be intentional or negligent provocation.

As you move on to the next aspect of the case involving your daughter, you may rule that her screaming was a public nuisance and as an alternative she should have appealed to you for a ruling. Striking out in word or deed when one is frustrated is indicative of a lack of self-control (which she needs to develop more).

The key is to get them to see their responsibility for their own actions and to learn self-control. Beyond that a concern for each other is a longer term objective. To that end one can include in the judicial process a step calling to an account a lack of concern such as asking an offender to explain why he felt the need to provoke his sister, was it his intention to hurt her? This bit of self-reflection can begin to plant seeds of actual concern.



Pteranomom
Deinonychus
Deinonychus

Joined: 21 Apr 2022
Age: 41
Gender: Female
Posts: 345

28 Apr 2022, 1:06 am

Thanks for the ideas. I'll try that.



HiccupHaddock
Yellow-bellied Woodpecker
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28 Apr 2022, 6:30 am

My own brother and myself used to irritate each other and squabble quite a bit, and I'm not sure it was that helpful when one of our parents tried to figure out whose fault it was.
Someone told me that nowadays there is a school of thought that instead of the parent doing this, that instead the parents should refuse to adjudicate in disputes, and should try to work on building a team spirit among the siblings, and developing positive relations between them. I've seen books on this topic, but didn't actually read one..
I think though the idea is that developing positive relationships between the siblings can be done by encouraging them to work together on things they like doing together, on bringing them on trips they enjoy together (e.g. perhaps something they decided together) etc. Giving rewards and praise when they are peaceful together and work together well?
I guess in this case perhaps you could try to break up arguments but just trying to help the sibilings calm down e.g. 'everyone take 10 deep breaths and keep calm. We are all getting a bit stressed. Let's all go to our rooms and take some time for ourselves for a few minutes'. And perhaps even 'if you can make peace, we can all have some chocolate icecream tonight, or together choose a film we can see in the cinema on the weekend'?
Don't know, maybe a crazy idea, but could be worth a try?
That said, I only have one child myself, so I imagine that it's much much harder in practice than in theory!
I imagine that keeping peace with 4 children is actually very difficult, and if you have peace even for a little while, you are doing amazingly well!
A friend told me also that he often squabbled with his siblings as a child, and thought that was actually good for them all, to work out their differences, and understand how to deal with differences of opinion, annoyance, conflicts. All good learning experiences. So perhaps a little squabbling isn't too bad, and helps their development? (Although not good for your nerves I imagine)
Good luck!



Pteranomom
Deinonychus
Deinonychus

Joined: 21 Apr 2022
Age: 41
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28 Apr 2022, 1:20 pm

Overall my kids are great together. My eldest is very kind and cheerful toward all of his siblings, which helps a lot since he is the "leader" of the bunch (the younger ones naturally look up to him). I grew up without siblings (I have siblings, but didn't meet them until I was an adult,) and my husband only had one much older sibling, so we're kind of flying by the seats of our pants here.

The closest model I have, therefore, for "siblings close in age" are my mother and her brother--and she hates her brother and resents her parents for not doing enough, as she sees it, to correct his bad behavior and stop him from hurting her.

My uncle really was a jerk; my son is not, but I still try to be understanding of what it's like to be younger and smaller than someone else who is behaving in ways that you don't like.



HiccupHaddock
Yellow-bellied Woodpecker
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29 Apr 2022, 6:48 am

It sounds like your kids are lovely.
I think it's quite normal for siblings to squabble a bit, even if they mostly get on well. This is what I've observed from other families that I know. I used to squabble with my brother a lot, but get on well now we're adults.
That said, I think perhaps ASD children can have a little difficulty picking up when they are bothering someone, because they might not pick up on subtle body language or tone of voice etc. and sometimes find it difficult to imagine the effect of what they're doing on someone else. I think these things particularly happen when an ASD child is tired or a bit overexcited.
When we play with my ASD son (age 7), he doesn't always pick up those subtle signals that we are becoming bothered by something he's doing, and I've realised that if I tell him he often stops it. I try to say it in a gentle but firm voice, e.g. 'no pushing, Daddy doesn't like that', 'no shouting, please use your indoor voice', 'that is not kind to bang cushions on someone's head, please stop that, I know you have a kind heart'. Sometimes I say 'you wouldn't like if someone banged cushions on your head, would you?' and then he has a little think and decides he wouldn't.
If my son doesn't stop what he's doing to bother us, sometimes I make it clear that we're are going to becoming very annoyed, e.g. 'Mummy is very tired and you are making me cross, please stop' or 'Please be kind to Mummy, I am feeling very tired and I am getting grumpy and cross'. I think my son actually finds it helpful that I spell out these things to him when I am just a little irritated and before I lose my temper, so that he can stop doing whatever it is and I won't lose my temper. It is nicer for me too.
I always try to make sure though that my son knows I know he has a kind heart, and I am always saying this to him. I know that he wants to be a kind person. It's just that sometimes he doesn't realise that he's bothering someone because he's not picking up subtle signals or thinking about how they could be feeling.
I hope this might help you to help your son too. I am sure he also has a kind heart.



Pteranomom
Deinonychus
Deinonychus

Joined: 21 Apr 2022
Age: 41
Gender: Female
Posts: 345

30 Apr 2022, 7:14 pm

HiccupHaddock wrote:
It sounds like your kids are lovely. ...

I always try to make sure though that my son knows I know he has a kind heart, and I am always saying this to him.

Aww, thank you.
I say the same thing to my son, that he has a kind heart. It's so easy for aspie kids to get misunderstood by people who interpret their behavior as malicious when they just don't understand some social grace.