FINA bans trans atheletes from women's swimming

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Mikah
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19 Jun 2022, 5:28 pm

Looks like common sense has prevailed for the time being in the International Swimming Federation.

https://www.fina.org/news/2649715/press ... -inclusion

The vote, which was 71.5 percent in favour of the new policy, took place after Congress heard speeches from representatives of a working group that was set up in November 2021. This working group consisted of three specialist groups - an athlete group, a science and medicine group, and a legal and human rights group.

After analysing the conclusions of these groups, FINA developed a new policy that will apply at all FINA events. The policy will also be followed for world record ratification, wherever the competition took place.

The full FINA gender inclusion policy can be found here. (Full policy document)

Included in the policy are proposals for an open competition category. FINA will establish a new working group that will spend the next six months looking at the most effective ways to set up this new category.

Commenting on the policy, FINA President Husain Al-Musallam said; “We have to protect the rights of our athletes to compete, but we also have to protect competitive fairness at our events, especially the women’s category at FINA competitions.”

The FINA President added: “FINA will always welcome every athlete. The creation of an open category will mean that everybody has the opportunity to compete at an elite level. This has not been done before, so FINA will need to lead the way. I want all athletes to feel included in being able to develop ideas during this process.”

The new FINA gender inclusion policy comes into effect on 20 June 2022.


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Mikah
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19 Jun 2022, 5:43 pm

Excerpts from the policy document, looks like they left a reasonable provision for those who have not experienced male puberty at all, though not many will qualify:

According to the Science Group, if gender-affirming male-to-female transition consistent with the medical standard of care is initiated after the onset of puberty, it will blunt some, but not all, of the effects of testosterone on body structure, muscle function, and other determinants of performance, but there will be persistent legacy effects that will give male-to-female transgender athletes (transgender women) a relative performance advantage over biological females. A biological female athlete cannot overcome that advantage through training or nutrition. Nor can they take additional testosterone to obtain the same advantage, because testosterone is a prohibited substance under the World Anti-Doping Code.

The Legal and Human Rights Group was comprised of legal experts in sex discrimination, human rights, and international sports law, including the jurisprudence of the Court of Arbitration for Sport (CAS). This group accepted the lawfulness of FINA’s mission, authority and responsibility, and FINA’s core commitment to equality of opportunity for both male and female athletes, all as summarised above. It was informed of the views of the Athlete Group and the scientific evidence produced by, and conclusions of, the Science Group. Thus, its task was to reflect FINA’s commitment to a sex-based women’s category as necessary to ensure that FINA does not discriminate against—and is able to empower—female athletes, and that Aquatics is able to promote male and female athletes and male and female sport equally. It is also understood that, as with any form of affirmative action, FINA’s effort not to discriminate against female athletes and thus to ensure a sex-based women’s category itself has exclusionary effects. In this instance, those effects are on male-to-female transgender athletes (transgender women) and athletes with 46 XY DSD whose gender identity is female. The Legal Group has tailored FINA’s eligibility rule narrowly, so that (a) it is neither under- nor over-inclusive, and (b) it includes provisions throughout that are designed to ensure that the requirements and restrictions for transgender women and 46 XY DSD athletes with a female gender identity to compete in the women’s competition category are limited to what is necessary and proportionate to achieve FINA’s overarching objectives.


...

Male-to-female transgender athletes (transgender women) and athletes with 46 XY DSD whose legal gender and/or gender identity is female are eligible to compete in the women’s category in FINA competitions and to set FINA World Records in the women’s category in FINA competitions and in other events recognised by FINA if they can establish to FINA’s comfortable satisfaction that they have not experienced any part of male puberty beyond Tanner Stage 2 or before age 12, whichever is later. Specifically, the athlete must produce evidence establishing that:

i. They have complete androgen insensitivity and therefore could not experience male puberty; or

ii. They are androgen sensitive but had male puberty suppressed beginning at Tanner Stage 2 or before age 12, whichever is later, and they have since continuously maintained their testosterone levels in serum (or plasma) below 2.5 nmol/L

iii. An unintentional deviation from the below 2.5 nmol/L requirement may result in retrospective disqualification of results and/or a prospective period of ineligibility.

iv. An intentional deviation from the below 2.5 nmol/L requirement may result in retrospective disqualification of results and a prospective period of ineligibility equal or commensurate in length to periods imposed under the FINA DRC for intentional anti-doping rule violations involving anabolic steroids.


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Matrix Glitch
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19 Jun 2022, 9:56 pm

Reality still has a foothold in some areas.



The_Walrus
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20 Jun 2022, 3:02 am

A black day for women’s swimming, irrevocably harmed by the decision to arbitrarily exclude a group of women.

Hopefully Fina are forced to reverse this extremely stupid decision before we start seeing teenage girls (or adult women for that matter) subject to “gender tests”.



Mikah
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20 Jun 2022, 3:15 am

The_Walrus wrote:
A black day for women’s swimming, irrevocably harmed by the decision to arbitrarily exclude a group of women.

Hopefully Fina are forced to reverse this extremely stupid decision before we start seeing teenage girls (or adult women for that matter) subject to “gender tests”.


Without firing silly studies at each other, let's say for the sake of argument, that the FINA science team is right, that transwomen have an immutable advantage over "regular" women if they have gone through male puberty. Is this decision still arbitrary and incorrect?


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Matrix Glitch
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20 Jun 2022, 5:09 am

The_Walrus wrote:
A black day for women’s swimming, irrevocably harmed by the decision to arbitrarily exclude a group of women.

Hopefully Fina are forced to reverse this extremely stupid decision before we start seeing teenage girls (or adult women for that matter) subject to “gender tests”.


I read women swimmers and representatives of women's swimming, saying a trans swimmer outperforming all of them and easily shattering all of their hard earned records was a black day for women's swimming.



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20 Jun 2022, 5:34 am

The_Walrus wrote:
A black day for women’s swimming, irrevocably harmed by the decision to arbitrarily exclude a group of women.

Hopefully Fina are forced to reverse this extremely stupid decision before we start seeing teenage girls (or adult women for that matter) subject to “gender tests”.

8O

Oh, right, it's the moderators from the wrong planet. :lol:

Matrix Glitch wrote:
I read women swimmers and representatives of women's swimming, saying a trans swimmer outperforming all of them and easily shattering all of their hard earned records was a black day for women's swimming.

:star:

We were told that won't happen, that this day would never come. :lol:


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Last edited by r00tb33r on 20 Jun 2022, 5:42 am, edited 1 time in total.

cyberdad
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20 Jun 2022, 5:40 am

I wonder if they should create a trans tournament?



r00tb33r
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20 Jun 2022, 5:47 am

cyberdad wrote:
I wonder if they should create a trans tournament?

Top athletes, especially when young, make a lot of sacrifices to achieve their success. In some way they all suppress their gender identity, having so little time and so few opportunities for normal activities associated with that age. Success takes a lot of sacrifices.


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cyberdad
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20 Jun 2022, 5:52 am

r00tb33r wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
I wonder if they should create a trans tournament?

In some way they all suppress their gender identity, .


Huh?



r00tb33r
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20 Jun 2022, 5:56 am

cyberdad wrote:
r00tb33r wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
I wonder if they should create a trans tournament?

In some way they all suppress their gender identity, .


Huh?

They don't get to live a life full of activities that reinforce their gender role.


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cyberdad
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20 Jun 2022, 5:58 am

r00tb33r wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
r00tb33r wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
I wonder if they should create a trans tournament?

In some way they all suppress their gender identity, .


Huh?

They don't get to live a life full of activities that reinforce their gender role.


That's why a trans tournament might be the way to go.



r00tb33r
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20 Jun 2022, 6:05 am

cyberdad wrote:
r00tb33r wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
r00tb33r wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
I wonder if they should create a trans tournament?

In some way they all suppress their gender identity, .


Huh?

They don't get to live a life full of activities that reinforce their gender role.


That's why a trans tournament might be the way to go.

Sure, but then we'd be battling over what it means to be "trans". Can any dude just label himself such and pick up the trophies? It's gonna be less competitive than men's sports. (Or whichever gender traditionally performs better at the sport.)


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Mikah
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20 Jun 2022, 6:12 am

cyberdad wrote:
I wonder if they should create a trans tournament?


They are planning to make an "open" division, but this won't make the trans mafia happy and I doubt many will even want to participate. The problem is they want to be seen as women in every way, and not allowing them to compete (unfairly) against biological women is the world reminding them they aren't real women.


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kraftiekortie
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20 Jun 2022, 6:14 am

I hope there comes a day (and I believe this is possible) when women who stay women become competitive with men. Then this issue will become moot.



Mikah
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20 Jun 2022, 6:42 am

kraftiekortie wrote:
I hope there comes a day (and I believe this is possible) when women who stay women become competitive with men. Then this issue will become moot.


That's nice but there is no reason to think this will ever be the case. We're a dimorphic species with rather large physical (and mental, but that's another topic) differences between the sexes. The only way your scenario comes true is with sci-fi genetic engineering or we all compete in robotic exoskeletons - but this would defeat the point of Olympic sports - which is to explore the limits of natural humans, unmodified by steroids or other unnatural advantages.


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I will not say the Day is done,
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