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KitLily
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24 Jul 2022, 4:28 am

Fnord wrote:
Joe90 wrote:
Wow, how did you count all the words?
Simple. I copy-pasted all of his posts into an Open Office text document, put a space after every period, changed all double spaces to single spaces, the replaced every space with a space. The Find-Replace function always returns the number of replacements, as well.

It is how I perform word counts on articles I write.



I love doing that with words too! I like words and documents.


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Cornflake
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24 Jul 2022, 5:50 am

Fnord wrote:
It is how I perform word counts on articles I write.
:scratch: I just look at the status bar at the foot of the document, where it shows a running count of words and characters. :nerdy:


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Noamx
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24 Jul 2022, 11:13 am

Sorry mates, didnt know the links part was so important to you. I'll share a few links which describe traits of Gemini's and Virgo's. Multiple Astrology related sites describe the same kind of traits, however, the relationship between that and Asperger Syndrome is what I have personally concluded, not something explicitly stated in the sites. Its just something I'm quite sure about, because if the traits are accurate, the traits have a clear, direct influence on the symptoms of the syndrome if the person have it. If you disagree - can you explain why there wouldnt be any influence on the syndrome's symptoms, or maybe, share evidence of that, just like you asked me to? Well, evidence that a person's astrology sign traits doesnt influence the severity of asperger syndrome symptoms.

Links to Gemini traits:(Almost all sites state the same traits, just using different words to describe them)

https://www.cosmopolitan.com/uk/horosco ... ni-traits/

https://www.today.com/life/astrology/ge ... -rcna27515

https://www.elle.com/uk/horoscopes/a30794/gemini/

https://www.purewow.com/wellness/gemini-personality

As you can see, most sites state the same social related traits Geminis have. These traits arent as much present in Virgo, on the other hand, which is a generally less socially driven sign. This would likely cause a clear difference in severity of symptoms of Asperger Syndrome, specifically the social related symptoms.

Virgo:

https://www.cosmopolitan.com/uk/horosco ... go-traits/

https://www.instyle.com/lifestyle/virgo-zodiac-sign

https://www.astrology-zodiac-signs.com/ ... gns/virgo/

https://parade.com/1016252/astro-twins/virgo-traits/


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Fnord
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24 Jul 2022, 11:15 am

Cornflake wrote:
Fnord wrote:
It is how I perform word counts on articles I write.
I just look at the status bar at the foot of the document, where it shows a running count of words and characters.
Now, where is the fun in that? It is like driving a thirty-foot long mobile home to a Yosemite parking lot and calling it "camping", as opposed to hiking across Yosemite, and calling it a "walk in the woods". I have even written a few short programs to do non-commercialized things with text, just for fun!.

Just as anyone can claim to have "special knowledge" just by imagining it in their head, so too can anyone can look at a number and repeat what it says, but how many can understand how that number was derived and develop their own algorithms?



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24 Jul 2022, 11:16 am

Quote:
Links to Gemini traits:(Almost all sites state the same traits, just using different words to describe them)

https://www.cosmopolitan.com/uk/horosco ... ni-traits/

https://www.today.com/life/astrology/ge ... -rcna27515

https://www.elle.com/uk/horoscopes/a30794/gemini/

https://www.purewow.com/wellness/gemini-personality

As you can see, most sites state the same social related traits Geminis have. These traits arent as much present in Virgo, on the other hand, which is a generally less socially driven sign. This would likely cause a clear difference in severity of symptoms of Asperger Syndrome, specifically the social related symptoms.

Virgo:

https://www.cosmopolitan.com/uk/horosco ... go-traits/

https://www.instyle.com/lifestyle/virgo-zodiac-sign

https://www.astrology-zodiac-signs.com/ ... gns/virgo/

https://parade.com/1016252/astro-twins/virgo-traits/




8O

None of those are valid resources. None of them contain valid research.

They could be making similar claims about specific star signs because they are influenced by each other.

Correlation does not equal causation.


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Fnord
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24 Jul 2022, 11:19 am

@Noam: How very cute!

:lol:

Now try backing up your claims with real data derived from scientific sources, and not some hand-picked articles that agree with your claims only because you selected them post hoc.


:roll:



Noamx
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24 Jul 2022, 11:37 am

I thought you would react like this. The sources are very reliable but you would always try to somehow make it appear wrong, because you dont believe in Astrology from the very beginning. Like talking to a tree, but worse.

I'm only ashamed of my stupid decision to actually continuing to reply to you. Thanks for confirming to me you're a complete waste of time, effort, emotions, words. This is the last reply I write to you about this subject in this thread, have fun talking to yourself. (but not necessarily my last reply in this thread, if I noticed you are discussing something interesting enough for me to make it worth it for me to step in the discussion).

The other threads I created are more successful, so I'll definitely keep an eye on them.


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24 Jul 2022, 11:40 am

Quote:
Numerous scientific studies have disproven that astronomical bodies affect people's lives according to their birth date. For instance, Peter Hartmann and his collaborators studied over 4000 individuals and found no correlation between birth date and personality or intelligence. In one of the most famous experiments, Shawn Carlson had 28 astrologers make predictions and then tested the accuracy of their predictions. Before conducting the experiment, he fine-tuned the method so that various independent scientists agreed the method was scientifically sound, and also so that all of the astrologers agreed the test was fair. As published in Nature, he found that the astrologers could do no better at predicting the future than random chance. These results agree with fundamental science.


https://www.wtamu.edu/~cbaird/sq/mobile ... logy-work/


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Twilightprincess
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24 Jul 2022, 11:43 am

Noamx wrote:
I thought you would react like this. The sources are very reliable but you would always try to somehow make it appear wrong, because you dont believe in Astrology from the very beginning.


The problem is that your sources contain no data whatsoever. Valid research about this topic would require large-scale studies and peer-reviewed articles published in serious academic journals.


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Last edited by Twilightprincess on 24 Jul 2022, 12:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Twilightprincess
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24 Jul 2022, 12:01 pm

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If you disagree - can you explain why there wouldnt be any influence on the syndrome's symptoms, or maybe, share evidence of that, just like you asked me to?


Astrology doesn’t impact a person’s symptoms because it’s not real. The following source is pretty good because it actually contains quantifiable evidence.

Quote:
in a 1985 study published in the journal Nature, Dr. Shawn Carlson of University of California, Berkeley’s Physics department found that seasoned astrologers were unable to match individual’s star chart with the results of a personality test any better than random chance; in a second test, individuals were unable to choose their own star charts, detailing their astrologically divined personality and character traits, any better than chance.

A smaller 1990 study conducted by John McGrew and Richard McFall of Indiana University’s Psychology department and designed with a group of astrologers, found that astrologers were no better at matching star charts to the corresponding comprehensive case file of a volunteer than a non-astrologer control subject or random chance, and moreover, didn’t even agree with each other. A study out in 2003, conducted by former astrologer Dr. Geoffrey Dean and psychologist Dr. Ivan Kelly, tracked the lives of 2,000 subjects who were all born within minutes of one another over several decades. The theory was that if astrological claims about star position and birthdates were true, then the individuals would have shared similar traits; they did not.


https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/ ... 180957701/

Magazines like Cosmopolitan are good for entertainment purposes, theoretically speaking, but they aren’t great for people who are looking for factual, academic information.

( :lol: at the idea of using an article from Cosmopolitan as a source in a research paper.)


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Fnord
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24 Jul 2022, 4:17 pm

Noamx wrote:
I thought you would react like this. The sources are very reliable but you would always try to somehow make it appear wrong, because you dont believe in Astrology from the very beginning.
Those sources - which I have read before - are reliable only to people with little or no science background.

It also seems you may not know the difference between fake science and real science.  Here is an explanation:

How Fake Science Does Fake Research

1. Form an opinion (e.g., "The positions of the planets related to the fixed stars cause autism").
• Must require unknown forces and/or unknown principles of nature.
• Must require esoteric understanding.
• Does not require mathematics.

2. Share the opinion with others.
• Ignore opposing opinions.
• Embrace agreeing opinions.

3. Declare the opinion valid.

4. Publish your theory where it will be read by Conspiracy Theorists, New-Agers, "Psychics", et cetera.

5. Gain "Social Credit" for publishing a popular idea.

6. Return to Step 1.

How Real Science Does Real Research.

1. Envision a new idea (e.g., "Mutation in SETD2 genome contributes to one form of autism in children").

2. Determine the idea's testability.
• If the idea cannot be tested, then return to Step 1.
• If the idea can be tested, then develop at least one physical experiment.

3. Experiment; observe the test, measure the results, record the results.  Repeat often.

4. Did the results of the physical experiment support the idea?
• If no, then revise the idea and return to Step 2.
• If yes, then submit Steps 1, 2, and 3 for review by professionals with accredited degrees relevant fields.

5. Did the reviewers achieve the same results by following your procedure?
• If no, then revise the idea and return to Step 2.
• If yes, then publish your new theory in a scientific journal.

6. Return to Step 1.

Do you see the difference?  Not many people do, which is why we hear about so many conspiracy theories (e.g., stolen elections), quack medical treatments (e.g., Ivermectin), superstitious beliefs (astrology explains anything), and urban legends (e.g., pedophile cult fronting as a restaurant).

Maybe a university degree in astrophysics, biology, and/or medicine would help you get outside your own head.



Last edited by Fnord on 24 Jul 2022, 5:30 pm, edited 5 times in total.

firemonkey
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24 Jul 2022, 5:26 pm

My mother was 21 and my father was 26 when I was born

I'm a Capricorn

First born

My parents are/were very intelligent

They argued quite a lot. Often blaming me for doing so.. That didn't stop my mother telling me when I was 9 that I'd never be as good as my father.

My father could be very domineering but mellowed considerably when he remarried. My mother was an alcoholic/problem drinker. Neither are/were very affectionate parents.

There's no known family history of autism, but my (s) daughter has said my father and I share several traits. He had a fairly successful career working for the Foreign office retiring as the FO equivalent of a 2 star general. My mother also worked at the FO, but stopped when she married my father.


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Twilightprincess
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24 Jul 2022, 6:01 pm

Fnord wrote:
Noamx wrote:
I thought you would react like this. The sources are very reliable but you would always try to somehow make it appear wrong, because you dont believe in Astrology from the very beginning.
Those sources - which I have read before - are reliable only to people with little or no science background.

It also seems you may not know the difference between fake science and real science.  Here is an explanation:

How Fake Science Does Fake Research

1. Form an opinion (e.g., "The positions of the planets related to the fixed stars cause autism").
• Must require unknown forces and/or unknown principles of nature.
• Must require esoteric understanding.
• Does not require mathematics.

2. Share the opinion with others.
• Ignore opposing opinions.
• Embrace agreeing opinions.

3. Declare the opinion valid.

4. Publish your theory where it will be read by Conspiracy Theorists, New-Agers, "Psychics", et cetera.

5. Gain "Social Credit" for publishing a popular idea.

6. Return to Step 1.

How Real Science Does Real Research.

1. Envision a new idea (e.g., "Mutation in SETD2 genome contributes to one form of autism in children").

2. Determine the idea's testability.
• If the idea cannot be tested, then return to Step 1.
• If the idea can be tested, then develop at least one physical experiment.

3. Experiment; observe the test, measure the results, record the results.  Repeat often.

4. Did the results of the physical experiment support the idea?
• If no, then revise the idea and return to Step 2.
• If yes, then submit Steps 1, 2, and 3 for review by professionals with accredited degrees relevant fields.

5. Did the reviewers achieve the same results by following your procedure?
• If no, then revise the idea and return to Step 2.
• If yes, then publish your new theory in a scientific journal.

6. Return to Step 1.

Do you see the difference?  Not many people do, which is why we hear about so many conspiracy theories (e.g., stolen elections), quack medical treatments (e.g., Ivermectin), superstitious beliefs (astrology explains anything), and urban legends (e.g., pedophile cult fronting as a restaurant).

Maybe a university degree in astrophysics, biology, and/or medicine would help you get outside your own head.


Maybe this, or something like it, should be posted in your Skeptics Resources since so many people do not know what good evidence is.


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Fnord
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24 Jul 2022, 10:39 pm

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5. Did the reviewers achieve the same results by following your procedure?
• If no, then revise the idea and return to Step 2.
• If yes, then publish your new theory in a scientific journal.

5½. Get one-upped by Prof. Brown who published his paper on the same topic in a more prestigious journal.



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25 Jul 2022, 6:08 am

As my mother was giving birth to me, I did have the umbilical cord tangled around my neck believing this slightly starved a small amount of oxygen from my brain, not greatly, only knock out my neuro-biologics. This is all what I think it was.

The same thing happened to my Cousin after the mid-wives neglected my Aunt for three days while in labour and now he has Cerebral Palsy.


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