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TwilightPrincess
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19 Aug 2022, 8:16 am

kraftiekortie wrote:
Colloquially, though, throughout the world, "America" is an acceptable term for the US.

Actually, it’s not acceptable everywhere. I’ve listened to some Spanish podcasts on this topic. I think it’s reflective of Trump’s general stance towards Latin America…

Also, if I had a political slogan, I would want to be accurate, not colloquial.


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kraftiekortie
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19 Aug 2022, 8:21 am

I've been to a few countries in Europe and the Caribbean, and I've watched YouTube videos which take place in many countries. The "average" person (say, a street vendor or store clerk) in these countries usually refer to the US as "America" (and, somewhat less frequently, the U.S.)

Most likely, a South American would not refer to the US as America.



Last edited by kraftiekortie on 19 Aug 2022, 8:24 am, edited 1 time in total.

TwilightPrincess
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19 Aug 2022, 8:24 am

kraftiekortie wrote:
I've been to quite a few countries in Europe and the Caribbean. The "average" person (say, a street vendor or store clerk) in these countries usually refer to the US as "America" (and, somewhat less frequently, the U.S.)


Okay, so you think that your (still limited) experience gives you a complete picture?


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magz
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19 Aug 2022, 8:25 am

Twilightprincess wrote:
Also, if I had a political slogan, I would want to be accurate, not colloquial.

The reality of political slogans I can think of - from various countries and different parties - happens to be different. They are a kind of marketing slogans. They have to be catchy, not precise.


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kraftiekortie
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19 Aug 2022, 8:26 am

Nobody has been to EVERY country in the world. So no one has a "complete picture."

I do know that "America" is a common colloquial term for the US, especially away from the Western Hemisphere. I would testify to that in court.

I said, previously, that it's not correct to refer to only the US as "America."



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19 Aug 2022, 8:27 am

I happen to believe that MAGA is wrong on many levels. There is the implication that the US has "declined" in recent years----which is just dead wrong.



TwilightPrincess
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19 Aug 2022, 8:29 am

magz wrote:
Twilightprincess wrote:
Also, if I had a political slogan, I would want to be accurate, not colloquial.

The reality of political slogans I can think of - from various countries and different parties - happens to be different. They are a kind of marketing slogans. They have to be catchy, not precise.


That’s true.

I find Trump’s slogan downright objectionable, though. It seems like an obvious appeal to the US nationalist crowd.


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TwilightPrincess
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19 Aug 2022, 8:31 am

Quote:
Most likely, a South American would not refer to the US as America.

I know a person in Spain who feels the same way.


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kraftiekortie
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19 Aug 2022, 8:35 am

Like I said, it's "colloquial." Meaning it's a common term amongst "regular people." There was a Greek vendor who had a great knowledge of history----but he told me he was desperate to "get to America" because of the economic situation in Greece.

Most likely, an intellectual in any country would be cognizant of the fact that America encompasses the entire Western Hemisphere.

This also harkens back to history. In West Side Story, even though Puerto Rico happens to be a part of the United States, New York is referred to as being in "America" by the Puerto Rican protagonist.



kraftiekortie
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19 Aug 2022, 8:38 am

But all this doesn't matter. I don't like the MAGA slogan myself. I'm not arguing FOR it.



TwilightPrincess
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19 Aug 2022, 8:38 am

kraftiekortie wrote:
Like I said, it's "colloquial." Meaning it's a common term amongst "regular people." There was a Greek vendor who had a great knowledge of history----but he told me he was desperate to "get to America" because of the economic situation in Greece.

Most likely, an intellectual in any country would be cognizant of the fact that America encompasses the entire Western Hemisphere.

This also harkens back to history. In West Side Story, even though Puerto Rico happens to be a part of the United States, New York is referred to as being in "America" by the Puerto Rican protagonist.


That’s fine, but not ALL people feel that way. I certainly don’t.

Like I said, I think that the slogan is indicative of Trump’s US nationalist stance.


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19 Aug 2022, 8:39 am

Make America great again is a stock political term that has been used by multiple presidents in the past. Trump was just the first one to make it a movement and stick on merchandise.


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TwilightPrincess
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19 Aug 2022, 8:44 am

How does West Side Story relate to this? It’s a work of fiction that was written by a US citizen.


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kraftiekortie
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19 Aug 2022, 8:46 am

MAGA is indicative of Trump's Isolationist stance. It goes beyond mere nationalism.



TwilightPrincess
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19 Aug 2022, 8:49 am

kraftiekortie wrote:
MAGA is indicative of Trump's Isolationist stance. It goes beyond mere nationalism.


Quote:
Nationalism

1. loyalty and devotion to a nation
especially : a sense of national consciousness (see CONSCIOUSNESS sense 1c) exalting one nation above all others and placing primary emphasis on promotion of its culture and interests as opposed to those of other nations or supranational groups


https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/nationalism

Nationalism would often lead to isolationism.


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kraftiekortie
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19 Aug 2022, 9:00 am

Nationalism is "love of nation." It, on its own, does not preclude cooperation with other nations, or even the "love" of another nation other than one's own.

However, nationalism does frequently manifest itself as isolationism, and as a feeling that one's own nation is superior to others.

Just like communism is fine in theory, but usually disastrous in practice.