autistic gals vs autistic guys

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Mitchell M.
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03 Oct 2022, 5:18 pm

magz wrote:
Understanding and sympathy are a different thing than attraction and, well, availability.

I learned the hard way that sometimes it's safer not to show sympathy to lonely guys - they too often misinterpret it and there are only more hearts broken.
Sorry.


I also agree with this, some women may not want to be sympathetic since they are opening up more problems for themselves, especially since many guys will chase you down relentlessly if they dont have many options.



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03 Oct 2022, 6:25 pm

Joe90 wrote:
In general autistic men find it hard to date than autistic women, but autistic women find it harder to make friends than autistic men.

This does not apply to everybody on the spectrum but it does seem quite common.

I dunno about that one.

I think a lot of us guys who struggle with dating also struggle with making friends too, but we're preoccupied with our dating struggles because having a romantic connection is a great deal more important to us than having platonic ones.

Men seem to have a harder time finding women who would date them in general than vice versa, whether we're talking NT or aspie. All one needs to do is try online dating to see that dynamic play out.

I haven't seen any evidence to suggest that aspie women tend to have more difficulty making friends than aspie men.

I would say that it seems aspie men are generally more bothered by an inability to find a partner than aspie women who can't find a partner, and I find it conceivable that aspie women may generally be more bothered by an inability to make friends than aspie men who can't make friends. If this is true, it wouldn't surprise me if it was also true for NTs.



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03 Oct 2022, 6:45 pm

magz wrote:
Understanding and sympathy are a different thing than attraction and, well, availability.

I learned the hard way that sometimes it's safer not to show sympathy to lonely guys - they too often misinterpret it and there are only more hearts broken.
Sorry.


I'm not necessarily talking about in-person sympathy. Even on this forum, some of the female members are lacking in the sympathy department (when it comes to the struggles autistic men face romantically)



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03 Oct 2022, 6:49 pm

Mitchell M. wrote:
AprilR wrote:
I live in a society where violence against women is very common. Just yesterday a random guy at a bus stop asked for my social media. It was scary, but now that i think of it he might have low social skills and have no intention of harming me. But i have no way of knowing that, especially since i have loe social skills myself.

What i mean is, women have no way of knowing whether someone is a stalker/abuser or just have poor social skills/have trouble with Boundaries.
So we have to be careful and not take risks.


Yeah I agree with you. Might sound weird cause I'm a guy, but I argue that anyone who is the "bottom" who is fairly attractive gets this kind of harassment on some level. I posted some NSFW pics of myself on discord servers and since Im skilled with photography they looked fairly professional. I had SO MANY guys literally begging me for online sexual favors and stuff. Its weird cause I understand both sides, but being treated like an object will make many women non sympathetic towards male struggles (not you, in general). Harassment sucks.


A lot of the struggles autistic men face (in the dating department) come from our lack of social awareness. We don't even realize we're harassing the woman. In fact, due to misread social cues, we might even think she's enjoying the attention from us.

Since anyone on the spectrum (straight, gay, male, female) has a hard time with social awareness/social cues, that's why I'd expect sympathy from fellow spectrum people.



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03 Oct 2022, 9:18 pm

SkinnyElephant wrote:
magz wrote:
Understanding and sympathy are a different thing than attraction and, well, availability.

I learned the hard way that sometimes it's safer not to show sympathy to lonely guys - they too often misinterpret it and there are only more hearts broken.
Sorry.


I'm not necessarily talking about in-person sympathy. Even on this forum, some of the female members are lacking in the sympathy department (when it comes to the struggles autistic men face romantically)


I've seen plenty of sympathy or at least attempts at support from female members.
Most of us ended up being gaslit or otherwise abused if we tried to support specific members.
Some people take advantage of those who try to help, without being reciprocal in return.

I could write the same complaint that many men here don't show sympathy about women's posts.
Some men don't seem remotely sympathetic when women share their own struggles.
I've seen women post about relationship abuse, domestic violence, and assault, without men responding.
Sometimes they are even challenged or heckled about it.
In that respect I wonder why the men who want girlfriends so badly don't really care about women.

This isn't a slight against all of the men who aren't dating.
It's just an observation that I can confirm as being true, in some instances from some members.
There are many lovely, caring men here, but many don't care about anyone but themselves.

Anyway ... We aren't supposed to use Love & Dating to debate which gender has it worse.
This rule was made clear a few months ago.
I just thought I should set the record straight.



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04 Oct 2022, 12:06 am

I think that autistic people have problems with dating and relationships, whether they're male or female.


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04 Oct 2022, 2:58 am

IsabellaLinton wrote:
SkinnyElephant wrote:
magz wrote:
Understanding and sympathy are a different thing than attraction and, well, availability.

I learned the hard way that sometimes it's safer not to show sympathy to lonely guys - they too often misinterpret it and there are only more hearts broken.
Sorry.


I'm not necessarily talking about in-person sympathy. Even on this forum, some of the female members are lacking in the sympathy department (when it comes to the struggles autistic men face romantically)


I've seen plenty of sympathy or at least attempts at support from female members.
Most of us ended up being gaslit or otherwise abused if we tried to support specific members.
Some people take advantage of those who try to help, without being reciprocal in return.

I could write the same complaint that many men here don't show sympathy about women's posts.
Some men don't seem remotely sympathetic when women share their own struggles.
I've seen women post about relationship abuse, domestic violence, and assault, without men responding.
Sometimes they are even challenged or heckled about it.
In that respect I wonder why the men who want girlfriends so badly don't really care about women.

This isn't a slight against all of the men who aren't dating.
It's just an observation that I can confirm as being true, in some instances from some members.
There are many lovely, caring men here, but many don't care about anyone but themselves.

Anyway ... We aren't supposed to use Love & Dating to debate which gender has it worse.
This rule was made clear a few months ago.
I just thought I should set the record straight.

Thanks for this post, Isabella.


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04 Oct 2022, 4:23 am

Let’s arrange a PUPG game gals vs guys here.


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04 Oct 2022, 6:51 am

Quote:
Most of us ended up being gaslit or otherwise abused if we tried to support specific members


I hope that's not the case, I don't remember seeing anything like that.



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04 Oct 2022, 1:48 pm

klanka wrote:
Quote:
Most of us ended up being gaslit or otherwise abused if we tried to support specific members


I hope that's not the case, I don't remember seeing anything like that.


You likely aren't aware of it because it typically happens on PM. Some of these men reach out for friendship or support but they become extremely needy and demanding, to the point of harassment or stalking. Some women have been bullied and used for providing free therapy, receiving none in return. Gaslighting and emotional abuse happens when these men start writing multiple times a day with messages like: "I'm going to kill myself if you don't help me", "You can go f--k yourself if you don't have time for me", or the classic "You don't care about me", which is paired with condescending rationale about why the woman's concerns don't matter, and she has no right to block him or stop communicating. Some of these bullies follow women from forum to forum doxxing or gaslighting them with more sob stories or personal attacks, if they don't continue the friendship. It can get ridiculous.

The sad thing is that even when women give this advice or support, typically on PM but also on the forum, it's usually dismissed. The men say that we're wrong or our suggestions won't help because apparently we don't understand, even though many of us have autistic boyfriends, husbands, sons, brothers, and male friends, so we have a great deal of empathy for men's mental health. We know very well what the struggles are for autistic men and we do try to empathise. In response these members sometimes grandstand and say that their struggles are worse than women's or they start threads like this one, insinuating it's some kind of contest. I also find it shocking when these men act as if the world is only comprised of men and women. They ignore the emotional needs of trans and NB posters as if they don't even exist. At times they even display homophobic or transphobic ideology.

Just recently I was called "mean" by a member I don't even know, with whom I've never interacted on the forum, because he messaged me out of the blue and I didn't reply straight away. I've been posting about having a migraine for five days now, and saying that I'm not doing well. I suppose none of that matters. I'm mean because I didn't jump through hoops for someone I don't even know, within their chosen time frame.

I have a lot of empathy for all members of all genders whether it's dating issues or day to day stressors. Like Magz said, the problem is that sometimes our good nature can be exploited with very little thanks.

*Please note this is not directed at all male members. It's a few frequent flyers, and for the most part they've been dealt with by moderators. I just needed to have a good rant and let people know just because they don't see harassment, it doesn't mean it's not happening.



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04 Oct 2022, 2:12 pm

IsabellaLinton wrote:
klanka wrote:
Quote:
Most of us ended up being gaslit or otherwise abused if we tried to support specific members


I hope that's not the case, I don't remember seeing anything like that.


You likely aren't aware of it because it typically happens on PM. Some of these men reach out for friendship or support but they become extremely needy and demanding, to the point of harassment or stalking. Some women have been bullied and used for providing free therapy, receiving none in return. Gaslighting and emotional abuse happens when these men start writing multiple times a day with messages like: "I'm going to kill myself if you don't help me", "You can go f--k yourself if you don't have time for me", or the classic "You don't care about me", which is paired with condescending rationale about why the woman's concerns don't matter, and she has no right to block him or stop communicating. Some of these bullies follow women from forum to forum doxxing or gaslighting them with more sob stories or personal attacks, if they don't continue the friendship. It can get ridiculous.

The sad thing is that even when women give this advice or support, typically on PM but also on the forum, it's usually dismissed. The men say that we're wrong or our suggestions won't help because apparently we don't understand, even though many of us have autistic boyfriends, husbands, sons, brothers, and male friends, so we have a great deal of empathy for men's mental health. We know very well what the struggles are for autistic men and we do try to empathise. In response these members sometimes grandstand and say that their struggles are worse than women's or they start threads like this one, insinuating it's some kind of contest. I also find it shocking when these men act as if the world is only comprised of men and women. They ignore the emotional needs of trans and NB posters as if they don't even exist. At times they even display homophobic or transphobic ideology.

Just recently I was called "mean" by a member I don't even know, with whom I've never interacted on the forum, because he messaged me out of the blue and I didn't reply. I've been posting about having a migraine for five days now, and saying that I'm not doing well. I suppose none of that matters. I'm mean because I didn't jump through hoops for someone I don't even know, within their chosen time frame.

I have a lot of empathy for all members of all genders whether it's dating issues or day to day stressors. Like Magz said, the problem is that sometimes our good nature can be exploited with very little thanks.

*Please note this is not directed at all male members. It's a few frequent flyers, and for the most part they've been dealt with by moderators. I just needed to have a good rant and let people know just because they don't see harassment, it doesn't mean it's not happening.


I'm the thread starter.

The thread was never meant as a contest. The thread was started due to a simple observation I've made (autistic gals having little to no sympathy, in my experience, toward autistic guys on the topic of dating)

That being said, obviously not every autistic gal is lacking sympathy.

And I'm not saying a certain gender has it better or worse. However, the struggles of autistic guys might be more noticeable (at least when it comes to pursuing a romantic interest) because, as a poster pointed out, guys are expected to do the chasing.

Low social skills+expected to do the chasing=recipe for disaster

I acknowledge there's more to dating than the pursual process though.



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04 Oct 2022, 3:41 pm

Oh I see Isabella yeah I didnt realise anything like that was going on.
Sorry to hear that.

Dont feel like there is any pressure for you to provide those types of support in PM



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05 Oct 2022, 9:24 pm

IsabellaLinton wrote:
klanka wrote:
Quote:
Most of us ended up being gaslit or otherwise abused if we tried to support specific members


I hope that's not the case, I don't remember seeing anything like that.


You likely aren't aware of it because it typically happens on PM. Some of these men reach out for friendship or support but they become extremely needy and demanding, to the point of harassment or stalking. Some women have been bullied and used for providing free therapy, receiving none in return. Gaslighting and emotional abuse happens when these men start writing multiple times a day with messages like: "I'm going to kill myself if you don't help me", "You can go f--k yourself if you don't have time for me", or the classic "You don't care about me", which is paired with condescending rationale about why the woman's concerns don't matter, and she has no right to block him or stop communicating. Some of these bullies follow women from forum to forum doxxing or gaslighting them with more sob stories or personal attacks, if they don't continue the friendship. It can get ridiculous.

The sad thing is that even when women give this advice or support, typically on PM but also on the forum, it's usually dismissed. The men say that we're wrong or our suggestions won't help because apparently we don't understand, even though many of us have autistic boyfriends, husbands, sons, brothers, and male friends, so we have a great deal of empathy for men's mental health. We know very well what the struggles are for autistic men and we do try to empathise. In response these members sometimes grandstand and say that their struggles are worse than women's or they start threads like this one, insinuating it's some kind of contest. I also find it shocking when these men act as if the world is only comprised of men and women. They ignore the emotional needs of trans and NB posters as if they don't even exist. At times they even display homophobic or transphobic ideology.

Just recently I was called "mean" by a member I don't even know, with whom I've never interacted on the forum, because he messaged me out of the blue and I didn't reply straight away. I've been posting about having a migraine for five days now, and saying that I'm not doing well. I suppose none of that matters. I'm mean because I didn't jump through hoops for someone I don't even know, within their chosen time frame.

I have a lot of empathy for all members of all genders whether it's dating issues or day to day stressors. Like Magz said, the problem is that sometimes our good nature can be exploited with very little thanks.

*Please note this is not directed at all male members. It's a few frequent flyers, and for the most part they've been dealt with by moderators. I just needed to have a good rant and let people know just because they don't see harassment, it doesn't mean it's not happening.

You should feel absolutely no obligation to provide anyone support, no matter what they threaten to do to themselves. I don't blame you for feeling used by people who will only ever want to talk about their own issues.

If one is asking for support from a peer, one ought to be willing to reciprocate in that peer's time of need.

Unfortunately, I think some guys on the spectrum who can't get girlfriends probably struggle because they have difficulty relating to or caring about the needs of others. Perhaps they are so consumed by their own despair that they can't see past it and acknowledge that it just isn't reasonable to expect endless sympathy and support from others when they're not willing to give any back.

The fact that I've developed a keen eye for recognising and acknowledging the needs of others, and the importance of reciprocity in any kind of relationship, makes me feel like I should have a better chance of breaking free from perpetual singledom than those who can apparently only talk about and think about themselves.



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07 Oct 2022, 3:17 pm

Autistic women do get unwanted male attention at times, so no one really has it easier.


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07 Oct 2022, 7:05 pm

CockneyRebel wrote:
Autistic women do get unwanted male attention at times, so no one really has it easier.


A lot of autistic guys would be flattered to get unwanted attention.

Edit: Furthermore, when the guy is expected to make the first move, isn't it inevitable a woman will get unwanted attention? Possibly lots of it?



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07 Oct 2022, 9:53 pm

SkinnyElephant wrote:
CockneyRebel wrote:
Autistic women do get unwanted male attention at times, so no one really has it easier.


A lot of autistic guys would be flattered to get unwanted attention.

Edit: Furthermore, when the guy is expected to make the first move, isn't it inevitable a woman will get unwanted attention? Possibly lots of it?


Depends on the type of attention. If I’m walking around my neighborhood playing Pokémon GO as I often do and someone around my age sees me taking over a gym and asks for my friend code, I’d happily engage with them, but the opposite would be true if some Karen gave me snark for “being weird” when I’m stimming in public.


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