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ASPartOfMe
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19 Nov 2022, 5:11 pm

Why Autistic People Can Struggle in the Workplace
Claire Jack, Ph.D., is a therapist and training provider who specialises in working with women with autism spectrum disorder (ASD). Claire obtained her Ph.D. in anthropology from the University of the Highlands and Islands, having spent three glorious years in the tiny island of Shetland, Scotland. In addition to one-to-one client work by Skype, Claire provides a range of training and personal development courses covering issues such as narcissistic abuse, inner child therapy and hypnotherapy.

Quote:
1. Difficulty following rules.
Autistic people tend to respond well to set ways of working and routines. This would appear to be a bonus in the workplace—and it can be, but the rules have to make sense.

When an autistic person develops a routine that they strictly adhere to, it makes sense to them at some level. When they have to fit into a routine that someone else has developed, and the rules seem arbitrary, it can be especially hard for an autistic person to accept, likely due to the cognitive inflexibility that is a characteristic of autism.

My client Diane once told me, “If something doesn’t make sense to me, I can’t follow through. The thought of sticking to rules that I think are stupid makes me physically ill and gives me huge anxiety. My parents have tried to explain that I just have to follow the rules, even if they don’t make sense, but I find it almost impossible.”

2. Difficulty dealing with change.

3. Interpersonal problems.
My client Angela described herself as very blunt. "When there’s a job to be done, I see no point in wasting time with niceties or taking ages to explain a concept," she explained. "I find it very hard when other people don’t understand me and I like to get the point as quickly and succinctly as possible. I’ve been pulled up about it in every job I’ve had. And it’s not helped by the fact that I have no desire to socialise with colleagues after work.”

4. Wrong career choice.
If someone is lucky, there will be an alignment between their career goals, opportunities that allow them to pursue those goals, and the reality of their careers. However, without knowing exactly what a career entails, an individual may not know whether he or she is truly suited to the chosen career.

This is potentially true of everyone—but autistic people may be at a particular disadvantage because they may have little idea of the types of things that are likely to cause extreme problems. And when someone is autistic, simply learning more about the job and getting used to the career they've chosen isn’t necessarily going to make parts of the job more manageable.

5. Fatigue and masking.

6. Difficulty progressing.
Autistic people have brains that tend to like to get deeply into a subject. When they’re at a level in their career where it’s difficult to progress, they can end up becoming frustrated and disengaged. What's more, some autistic people may be held back from progressing because of interpersonal problems.

Deena told me, “I’ve always had this problem at work where I get stuck in a middle management, project management type of role. I’m really good at my job, and great at project management, but I don’t think I relate well enough to people to be promoted to a higher management role that involves people management skills. I also don’t network enough. So I’m stuck in these roles which are not intellectually challenging enough for me, and which don’t allow me to really use my brain, and I get bored and move on.”

How Autistic People Can Better Navigate Their Careers
Although the level of support available will depend on the industry in which you work and where you’re based, many larger companies will have a duty of care regarding staff mental health needs. You may feel awkward about asking for the right type of support—but if employers and colleagues don’t know you’re struggling, they’re not going to be able to offer you any support.

It might also be important to look back on your past employment history; what’s the implication of staying silent? Many autistic people love aspects of their job and, with the right help and support in other aspects, they can continue to pursue a career path that is right for them. Some others might find, as they learn about autism, that it’s time to think about pursuing a different path.


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DSM 5: Autism Spectrum Disorder, DSM IV: Aspergers Moderate Severity

“My autism is not a superpower. It also isn’t some kind of god-forsaken, endless fountain of suffering inflicted on my family. It’s just part of who I am as a person”. - Sara Luterman


peaceheartco
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14 Dec 2022, 12:51 pm

This is really helpful and a nice, detailed overview of why it can go so wrong for people in autism in the workplace. I've been bullied and fired from almost every job I have due to issues relating to autism, despite being "high-functioning". In college, my professors loved me and would treat me with a lot of respect and kindness, but in the working world, it is quite a different story. To employers, you are a means to an end, and they want you to learn the job as fast as possible and with very few questions. In fact, asking questions is interpreted as something negative rather than something positive. People would treat asking questions as a sign that you are unintelligent or unsuited for that job, rather than a sign that you are interested in what you are learning and want to keep your job. When I learn how to do the job, I learn it in my own way, but the person training me or the employer wants me to learn it their way, and this makes it almost impossible for me to understand what I am doing. The lack of understanding is then interpreted as another sign of being unsuited for the job. There are so many things stacked against people with autism and other disabilities or differences in the workplace from the get-go. Employers basically have a legal freedom in America to fire people at-will, and there is very little recourse outside of a lawsuit for people who were fired or lost their jobs for reasons relating to their disabilities. It's no wonder almost 80% of people with autism are unemployed. Employers have no idea how to treat people or create work environments that are not toxic.


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ASPartOfMe
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14 Dec 2022, 1:33 pm

The bad thing is it was not always this way. Employees and employers expected you would spend your entire life with one company. There were apprenticeships and paid training periods. Employers expected you screw up at first. It was accepted that the first few months the employee was trying the company and visa versa. Nowadays you need to be fully ready to do the job and fit in the company culture on day 1.


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Professionally Identified and joined WP August 26, 2013
DSM 5: Autism Spectrum Disorder, DSM IV: Aspergers Moderate Severity

“My autism is not a superpower. It also isn’t some kind of god-forsaken, endless fountain of suffering inflicted on my family. It’s just part of who I am as a person”. - Sara Luterman


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14 Dec 2022, 6:59 pm

My communication skills aren't that bad. In fact I've been offered a job as a supervisor at my work because they say I'm a better communicator than the last two (NT) supervisors we've had. But I had to turn it down because I know how much pressure supervisors can get under and how organised you need to be, etc, and due to ADHD I just wouldn't be able to handle that.

While I do put in the effort to do my work well, I do get easily distracted at work and find myself wandering off from my project without really realising it, and chatting to co-workers too much. But despite all that I still manage to get all my tasks done properly by the time my shift ends.


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AprilR
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18 Dec 2022, 4:09 am

My main problem at work is processing info slowly, not being able to multitask and not understanding unsaid common knowledge. I am too scared to ask some things since i am expected to already know them at my age.

My relationship with other coworkers isn't bad since i can mask up to a certain extent.



Aces High
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23 Dec 2022, 11:28 am

ASPartOfMe wrote:
The bad thing is it was not always this way. Employees and employers expected you would spend your entire life with one company. There were apprenticeships and paid training periods. Employers expected you screw up at first. It was accepted that the first few months the employee was trying the company and visa versa. Nowadays you need to be fully ready to do the job and fit in the company culture on day 1.


I don't have a whole lot to add to that but between the job market and the housing market carry on -- the world has lost its goddamn mind. There has to be a reckoning someday. There just has to be or society is toast.



SkinnyElephant
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25 Dec 2022, 10:46 am

ASPartOfMe wrote:
The bad thing is it was not always this way. Employees and employers expected you would spend your entire life with one company. There were apprenticeships and paid training periods. Employers expected you screw up at first. It was accepted that the first few months the employee was trying the company and visa versa. Nowadays you need to be fully ready to do the job and fit in the company culture on day 1.


You can say that again.

At a past job, after a screw-up I made 2 months into the job, my boss forced me to either admit I'm on the spectrum or get fired.

I eventually ended up doing well at the job. That being said, my boss had a policy of "If you've made it 6 months without quitting or getting fired, you get a slight promotion." I was there for a year and never got the promotion.

It reached the point where employees newer than me had gotten the promotion. The embarrassment (of getting singled out like that) caused me to quit.

When I quit, my boss begged me to stay. Then a few months later, he begged me to come back (I never came back). Go figure. He learned a lesson the hard way. He shouldn't have treated me differently just because I'm on the spectrum.



SkinnyElephant
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25 Dec 2022, 10:54 am

ASPartOfMe wrote:
Why Autistic People Can Struggle in the Workplace
Claire Jack, Ph.D., is a therapist and training provider who specialises in working with women with autism spectrum disorder (ASD). Claire obtained her Ph.D. in anthropology from the University of the Highlands and Islands, having spent three glorious years in the tiny island of Shetland, Scotland. In addition to one-to-one client work by Skype, Claire provides a range of training and personal development courses covering issues such as narcissistic abuse, inner child therapy and hypnotherapy.
Quote:
1. Difficulty following rules.
Autistic people tend to respond well to set ways of working and routines. This would appear to be a bonus in the workplace—and it can be, but the rules have to make sense.

When an autistic person develops a routine that they strictly adhere to, it makes sense to them at some level. When they have to fit into a routine that someone else has developed, and the rules seem arbitrary, it can be especially hard for an autistic person to accept, likely due to the cognitive inflexibility that is a characteristic of autism.

My client Diane once told me, “If something doesn’t make sense to me, I can’t follow through. The thought of sticking to rules that I think are stupid makes me physically ill and gives me huge anxiety. My parents have tried to explain that I just have to follow the rules, even if they don’t make sense, but I find it almost impossible.”

2. Difficulty dealing with change.

3. Interpersonal problems.
My client Angela described herself as very blunt. "When there’s a job to be done, I see no point in wasting time with niceties or taking ages to explain a concept," she explained. "I find it very hard when other people don’t understand me and I like to get the point as quickly and succinctly as possible. I’ve been pulled up about it in every job I’ve had. And it’s not helped by the fact that I have no desire to socialise with colleagues after work.”

4. Wrong career choice.
If someone is lucky, there will be an alignment between their career goals, opportunities that allow them to pursue those goals, and the reality of their careers. However, without knowing exactly what a career entails, an individual may not know whether he or she is truly suited to the chosen career.

This is potentially true of everyone—but autistic people may be at a particular disadvantage because they may have little idea of the types of things that are likely to cause extreme problems. And when someone is autistic, simply learning more about the job and getting used to the career they've chosen isn’t necessarily going to make parts of the job more manageable.

5. Fatigue and masking.

6. Difficulty progressing.
Autistic people have brains that tend to like to get deeply into a subject. When they’re at a level in their career where it’s difficult to progress, they can end up becoming frustrated and disengaged. What's more, some autistic people may be held back from progressing because of interpersonal problems.

Deena told me, “I’ve always had this problem at work where I get stuck in a middle management, project management type of role. I’m really good at my job, and great at project management, but I don’t think I relate well enough to people to be promoted to a higher management role that involves people management skills. I also don’t network enough. So I’m stuck in these roles which are not intellectually challenging enough for me, and which don’t allow me to really use my brain, and I get bored and move on.”

How Autistic People Can Better Navigate Their Careers
Although the level of support available will depend on the industry in which you work and where you’re based, many larger companies will have a duty of care regarding staff mental health needs. You may feel awkward about asking for the right type of support—but if employers and colleagues don’t know you’re struggling, they’re not going to be able to offer you any support.

It might also be important to look back on your past employment history; what’s the implication of staying silent? Many autistic people love aspects of their job and, with the right help and support in other aspects, they can continue to pursue a career path that is right for them. Some others might find, as they learn about autism, that it’s time to think about pursuing a different path.


As for the difficulty following rules thing, that's luckily not a problem for me.

Many people say I go too far in the other direction. I'm terrified of getting fired. As a result, I follow workplace rules to a tee, no matter how stupid I personally feel the rule is.

Neurotypicals don't seem to understand: It's not that I'm anal. Nor is it that I personally care about (or even agree with) the rule. It all boils down to my phobia of getting fired.

My phobia of getting fired ties into the point about being afraid of change. The thought of having to adjust to another job is terrifying to me. I have quit jobs in the past (never been fired though). However, every time I've quit a job, I had another job lined up that I was confident I'd be able to adjust to (there aren't a whole lot of jobs I could see myself adjusting to, however)



ezbzbfcg2
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25 Dec 2022, 10:57 am

peaceheartco wrote:
This is really helpful and a nice, detailed overview of why it can go so wrong for people in autism in the workplace. I've been bullied and fired from almost every job I have due to issues relating to autism, despite being "high-functioning". In college, my professors loved me and would treat me with a lot of respect and kindness, but in the working world, it is quite a different story. To employers, you are a means to an end, and they want you to learn the job as fast as possible and with very few questions. In fact, asking questions is interpreted as something negative rather than something positive. People would treat asking questions as a sign that you are unintelligent or unsuited for that job, rather than a sign that you are interested in what you are learning and want to keep your job. When I learn how to do the job, I learn it in my own way, but the person training me or the employer wants me to learn it their way, and this makes it almost impossible for me to understand what I am doing. The lack of understanding is then interpreted as another sign of being unsuited for the job. There are so many things stacked against people with autism and other disabilities or differences in the workplace from the get-go. Employers basically have a legal freedom in America to fire people at-will, and there is very little recourse outside of a lawsuit for people who were fired or lost their jobs for reasons relating to their disabilities. It's no wonder almost 80% of people with autism are unemployed. Employers have no idea how to treat people or create work environments that are not toxic.


Well said!



ASPartOfMe
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25 Dec 2022, 12:44 pm

ezbzbfcg2 wrote:
peaceheartco wrote:
This is really helpful and a nice, detailed overview of why it can go so wrong for people in autism in the workplace. I've been bullied and fired from almost every job I have due to issues relating to autism, despite being "high-functioning". In college, my professors loved me and would treat me with a lot of respect and kindness, but in the working world, it is quite a different story. To employers, you are a means to an end, and they want you to learn the job as fast as possible and with very few questions. In fact, asking questions is interpreted as something negative rather than something positive. People would treat asking questions as a sign that you are unintelligent or unsuited for that job, rather than a sign that you are interested in what you are learning and want to keep your job. When I learn how to do the job, I learn it in my own way, but the person training me or the employer wants me to learn it their way, and this makes it almost impossible for me to understand what I am doing. The lack of understanding is then interpreted as another sign of being unsuited for the job. There are so many things stacked against people with autism and other disabilities or differences in the workplace from the get-go. Employers basically have a legal freedom in America to fire people at-will, and there is very little recourse outside of a lawsuit for people who were fired or lost their jobs for reasons relating to their disabilities. It's no wonder almost 80% of people with autism are unemployed. Employers have no idea how to treat people or create work environments that are not toxic.


Well said!


I was told a number of times in no way do you tell potential employers you worked a lot of overtime. I thought I was communicating dedication, when I was communicating incompetence.


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Professionally Identified and joined WP August 26, 2013
DSM 5: Autism Spectrum Disorder, DSM IV: Aspergers Moderate Severity

“My autism is not a superpower. It also isn’t some kind of god-forsaken, endless fountain of suffering inflicted on my family. It’s just part of who I am as a person”. - Sara Luterman