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munecadeleonrio
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13 Jan 2023, 6:12 pm

Hi Everyone,

I’m an autistic woman who is in her early 20s, and I find it hard to make and maintain friendships. I live in a big city (ie: New York City, Los Angeles, Houston) , and I find that in big cities, well the ones on the East Coast that people tend to be more rude, and standoffish, which sometimes causes me to shy away from talking to people. I have a deep desire to make friends, and am a great person, I think.

For those of us that struggle to make friends, what do you think this is ? Do you think that what people know of autism contributes to the lack of being able to make friends? How do you think people can help you when it comes to making friends, and maintaining friendships??



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13 Jan 2023, 6:17 pm

I believe that making friends is not the issue. It is keeping friends that can be the issue BUT I do realize that if you are like me, then one relies on others to meet people as one may not do it naturally... Unless one is masking?

Be brave! :D


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autisticelders
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14 Jan 2023, 7:27 am

Previous discussions about the difficulty in making and keeping friends, both here and on other forums set me to close examination of my own good friends and "how it happened" . I do believe good and close lasting friendships are rare for everybody and we should count ourselves lucky if we have more than one or two. I think for many people in general, this may never happen at all. Close intimate lasting friendships over a lifetime are pretty rare! Social media would have us believe otherwise, but looking around at everybody I have known , what media portrays and what is "real" are definitely different things. Media seems to raise a lot of self examination and comparisons as well as longings that may be unrealistic in "real life".

It is helpful to understand there are different kinds of friendships, too. There are friends of circumstance (work friends, neighbors, friends from church or other social activities where people gather)

There are friends of the heart, who bond over shared experiences and interests and who are interested in our personal lives and welcome us into theirs as well. ( the very rare ones)

Looking at my own long term friendships, I asked myself what they had in common. First stages in forming friendships, we lived close to each other, within easy traveling distance. We are from the same economic and social background , and of the same generation (15 years older or younger max) We found that we shared similar values and most importantly were interested in the same things with the same intensity. We formed a bond over those interests and shared time doing related things together . Over time the shared interests and activities expanded to include interests in each other's families and interest in our differences as well.

When I retired I moved away from friends and needed to find new ones. I ended up joining Facebook groups around my most intense interests and found that interacting online with others about those interests was a good way to feel comfortable with some of the group. Eventually some members of these small groups met to do interest related activities. I got invitations to meet up for interest related activities from some members who had interacted online, and were passing through or coming to my home area. When we gathered I stood on the outside or edge and looked for others who looked a bit "lost" too, and made a comment or two to them. Most seemed relieved that I had spoken to them and happily interacted.
Many of us "clicked" and of course over time many of us didn't!


Over the years I have found just a handful of others in this area to share my interests and related activities with. I can send these individuals a PM or give a call and ask to set up a get together for doing something around our interest. We are learning about each other as we spend time doing things together. It is building slowly but surely with meetups 3 or 4 times a year maybe but lots of internet sharing of info about our favorite subjects.

I don't require a lot of social activity but it is nice to be able to interact with others off and on and as we do more together, there are a couple of us who have grown into real friendship.

Sharing interests has been the key for developing new friendships for me. hope this might be of help.


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14 Jan 2023, 8:27 am

When it comes to making friends I instinctively prefer fellow aspies because we operate at the same wavelength. With everybody else I have to mask and it is exhausting. Another neurodiverse group of people with whom I seem to have a certain amount of chemistry is people with Borderline Personality Disorder, initially at least. Eventually it falls apart as it happens with people with BPD. I sympathise with them though.

Personally I would advise against masking and instead find your own kind of people to socialise with. Now that I know I have ASD it's easier for me to navigate socially. I know what are my shortcomings and I try to minimise them, while trying to emphasize my strenghths. I'm also more down to earth with what I should expect from myself in the social sphere.



Last edited by Dengashinobi on 14 Jan 2023, 9:09 am, edited 1 time in total.

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14 Jan 2023, 8:40 am

I think people are less tolerant than they used to be. I had lots of friends in my teens and twenties, I was just seen as 'that funny, quirky girl.' Now in my fifties I'm seen as 'that weird old woman.'

I also think over the decades, people have become less and less tolerant, and so has the world IMO. Due to social media there is an endless source of friends everywhere so no one has to tolerate someone they have the slightest difference of opinion with, for a single second.

This does not help those of us with autism because we come across 'slightly off' at the best of times so people rush away to those who don't seem 'off.' By 'off' I mean socially awkward or we make the wrong expression at the wrong time, or say something blunt. I know I do all of those.

I think the best way to find friends is to join a hobby group which might be something autists like and find some like-minded people. A fellow autist told me that, he said he and his wife are in a group (can't remember what it was though) and they met people with the same interest who were probably also autistic and made a group of friends. That sounds heavenly to me!


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Silence23
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14 Jan 2023, 9:52 am

I found it's easier to maintain friendships with people who aren't exactly normal. Not sure why. Most of the close offline friends I had weren't "normal". And basically all online friends I had were not normal.

Maybe you can try to find friends online? Not necessarily autists. But that could also work in some cases. E.g. an autist from my country I met online a few years ago and had regular social interactions with wanted to meet me (though I rejected, as the older I got, the more distance to people I needed).

I'd recommend you try to make female friends only for now. Making male friends as a woman would be easier, but it may only rarely be "just friendship".


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KitLily
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16 Jan 2023, 11:58 am

Silence23 wrote:
I found it's easier to maintain friendships with people who aren't exactly normal. Not sure why. Most of the close offline friends I had weren't "normal". And basically all online friends I had were not normal.


Can you define what you mean by 'normal'? Just interested.


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KitLily
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16 Jan 2023, 12:15 pm

What I do in January and February is go to those online Health and Wellness Summits and I literally just listened to one of their interviews about Friendship.

The best advice I picked up was:

1. Always make the other person feel better after they left you than they did before.

2. It's important to communicate to people that we like them for who they are and we aren’t judging them.

I'll try those. I'm not sure how (especially no. 1) but I'll try.


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16 Jan 2023, 11:03 pm

they could help me make and keep friends, by lowering their standards, behaving less impulsively, and being good role models and being polite and all that.

but i gave up with "friends" a longfuck time ago. too much failure, social rejection, and other forms of BS.

they might act all "buddy buddy", but the second they think i did something wrong, it's like "incite a riot". and i am not perfect or awesome in any way, shape or form. but when they do something wrong, nothing happens. zero apology, zero reparations, zero closure.

flow chart
(1) did i do it?
(2) did i do it on purpose
(3) is it good or bad (that is not always obvious)
(4) what is the correct punishment or reward (correct punishment often grotesquely exaggerated for me, while precious lil "people" get away with doing anything they want).


besides i'm exhausted a lot and do not feel like talking. when i do talk:
(1) "huh" and "what" instead of "excuse me"
(2) they do not believe me
(3) they do not remember what i said

while almost everyone i have ever interacted with, talks too f*****g much and too loud. and they act like every thought and emotion that goes through their heads, are the latest greatest scientific inventions.

_____________________________________________________________________________________

anyways, i have not done enough travelling to notice patterns between making friends in big cities versus rural areas. (fine). however, if you feel certain areas are more friendly, you could relocate over there (as long as logistics such as $$ are fine).



Silence23
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17 Jan 2023, 9:38 am

KitLily wrote:
2. It's important to communicate to people that we like them for who they are and we aren’t judging them.

I'll try those. I'm not sure how (especially no. 1) but I'll try.


#2 shouldn't be that hard. Basically you recognize that you like a trait of that person. And instead of just thinking it you say something like "Hey, I think it's great that you like to help people. I also often do that". Or one woman I rarely had (onlione) contact with over the past years wrote that she's a "fair-weather friend" (in German), because she didn't reply to a message I wrote a few weeks earlier. So I told her I'm a "fair-weather friend" too, because I am.

So they understand you like them as they are (or you like them because they are like that) and don't judge them because of it.

At least that would make sense with people you don't know yet.


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18 Jan 2023, 7:06 am

shortfatbalduglyman wrote:
they might act all "buddy buddy", but the second they think i did something wrong, it's like "incite a riot". and i am not perfect or awesome in any way, shape or form. but when they do something wrong, nothing happens. zero apology, zero reparations, zero closure.


I hear you loud and clear there. I've had lots of 'friendships' which seem to be going well then suddenly BOOM they disappear. I've even asked people why they've disappeared and they've told me that I 'said something awful' and they can't forgive or speak to me ever again. What the 'something awful' was, I never find out.

Ridiculous behaviour.


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18 Jan 2023, 7:11 am

Silence23 wrote:
KitLily wrote:
2. It's important to communicate to people that we like them for who they are and we aren’t judging them.

I'll try those. I'm not sure how (especially no. 1) but I'll try.


#2 shouldn't be that hard. Basically you recognize that you like a trait of that person. And instead of just thinking it you say something like "Hey, I think it's great that you like to help people. I also often do that". Or one woman I rarely had (onlione) contact with over the past years wrote that she's a "fair-weather friend" (in German), because she didn't reply to a message I wrote a few weeks earlier. So I told her I'm a "fair-weather friend" too, because I am.

So they understand you like them as they are (or you like them because they are like that) and don't judge them because of it.

At least that would make sense with people you don't know yet.


I find it hard. Apparently I have a 'snooty, judgemental face' and people think I'm judging them. WTF. I've practiced smiling in front of a mirror but it always looks fake and weird. I actually can't smile unless I'm genuinely happy or find something funny, which isn't often.

I also think English people are pretty odd, when I try and give a compliment, they take offence and/or question me. Maybe it's the way I say it? Or my 'snooty, judgemental face'? Either way, I steer clear of giving compliments, I've been burnt too often by that. Or it might be that English people communicate in sarcasm, so most things we say sound sarcastic.

I am English btw. I generally find Americans much more straightforward.


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Silence23
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18 Jan 2023, 8:14 am

KitLily wrote:
I find it hard. Apparently I have a 'snooty, judgemental face' and people think I'm judging them. WTF. I've practiced smiling in front of a mirror but it always looks fake and weird. I actually can't smile unless I'm genuinely happy or find something funny, which isn't often.


Same here. My smiles look totally fake. Can't really help you there, as I gave up trying to appear "normal" a long time ago. Are you forcing yourself to look people into the eyes while they're talking? Maybe it would help if you don't look at them for too long. Though then you may appear disinterested or mentally absent, which also confuses the neurotypical.

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I also think English people are pretty odd, when I try and give a compliment, they take offence and/or question me. Maybe it's the way I say it? Or my 'snooty, judgemental face'? Either way, I steer clear of giving compliments, I've been burnt too often by that. Or it might be that English people communicate in sarcasm, so most things we say sound sarcastic.


Maybe your compliments are too direct? E.g. you say something like "you're a great person". Instead say something like "great job" or something. Once I told a woman she's intelligent, because of how she recommended to deal with a certain situation. Only later I noticed that this could be interpreted as flirting. I mean she liked it (or pretended she did). But I'm not intending to flirt with anyone. Instead I could have said "that's a smart way to deal with it".



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18 Jan 2023, 1:19 pm

munecadeleonrio wrote:
Hi Everyone,

I’m an autistic woman who is in her early 20s, and I find it hard to make and maintain friendships. I live in a big city (ie: New York City, Los Angeles, Houston) , and I find that in big cities, well the ones on the East Coast that people tend to be more rude, and standoffish, which sometimes causes me to shy away from talking to people. I have a deep desire to make friends, and am a great person, I think.

How have you gone about trying to make friends?

For example, do you seek out groups of people who share specific interests of yours, and/or who share important beliefs and values of yours, or other significant commonalities? Or do you try to make friends mostly by just being friendly to random people?


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19 Jan 2023, 8:19 am

Silence23 wrote:
Same here. My smiles look totally fake. Can't really help you there, as I gave up trying to appear "normal" a long time ago. Are you forcing yourself to look people into the eyes while they're talking? Maybe it would help if you don't look at them for too long. Though then you may appear disinterested or mentally absent, which also confuses the neurotypical.

Maybe your compliments are too direct? E.g. you say something like "you're a great person". Instead say something like "great job" or something. Once I told a woman she's intelligent, because of how she recommended to deal with a certain situation. Only later I noticed that this could be interpreted as flirting. I mean she liked it (or pretended she did). But I'm not intending to flirt with anyone. Instead I could have said "that's a smart way to deal with it".


That is some good advice. I tend to look at people a lot, mainly to see what they are going to do. Are they going to attack me or want something from me? Have I annoyed or angered them? So I tend to watch them carefully just to check. I've learned not to do that, it makes them nervous so I look away more.

I was kind of on the way to learning not to be so direct, and compliment the action rather than the person. e.g. the classic example I'm always talking about when I said to this woman I knew that she looked lovely in a certain jacket. She took offence and said it was her husband's old jacket and what did I mean? etc. I should have just complimented the jacket I suppose...


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