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Following a sports team is pointless really

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TwilightPrincess
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02 Jun 2023, 3:55 am

cyberdad wrote:
Twilightprincess wrote:
The picture isn't the problem.


And yet there is a problem
https://www.collectiveshout.org/sexploi ... n_in_sport
https://www.npr.org/2021/07/23/10193434 ... ms-problem

Notice that I didn't say that there wasn't a problem. :|

Athletes should be able to wear as much or as little as they want to. They shouldn't feel pressured to wear clothes that make them uncomfortable.

Trolls need to stop being trolls. We can't blame women for what they were wearing or weren't. That's victim-blaming.


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TwilightPrincess
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02 Jun 2023, 3:56 am

cyberdad wrote:
Women's tennis there's something called the Anna Kournikova effect
https://bleacherreport.com/articles/167 ... ens-tennis

Basically Kornikova got millions in sponsorship deals to play tennis in hot little outfits. Meanwhile players who were actually good like Serena and Venus WIlliams were only making a fraction of the money that "marketable" but less talented female players could attract from sponsors.

The Williams sisters still made out pretty well. Money in sports is frequently unfair. Female athletes often make less than males which is a bigger problem IMO.


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IsabellaLinton
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02 Jun 2023, 3:57 am

cyberdad wrote:
Women's tennis there's something called the Anna Kournikova effect
https://bleacherreport.com/articles/167 ... ens-tennis

Basically Kornikova got millions in sponsorship deals to play tennis in hot little outfits. Meanwhile players who were actually good like Serena and Venus WIlliams were only making a fraction of the money that "marketable" but less talented female players could attract from sponsors.



Right, but it's still not a good thing.
Men have always treated women as commercial products.
Some women will take the opportunity to take men's money.
Others will call it out.
We're just like men in that regard.
Everyone is different.
That doesn't mean the practice should continue.


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cyberdad
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02 Jun 2023, 4:03 am

Twilightprincess wrote:
Trolls need to stop being trolls. We can't blame women for what they were wearing or weren't. That's victim-blaming.


I think it does impact on female sports though. But yes, they learn to tune out and not read the social media. I imagine Jackie Robinson's coach told him the same thing when dealing with racist baseball fans in the stadium.



IsabellaLinton
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02 Jun 2023, 4:04 am

Do men wear the same shorts?

The solution imo would be to change their uniforms, if they agree it's a problem.

Ignoring it all isn't going to solve anything.


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cyberdad
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02 Jun 2023, 4:05 am

Twilightprincess wrote:
The Williams sisters still made out pretty well. Money in sports is frequently unfair. Female athletes often make less than males which is a bigger problem IMO.


Actually if you read the article, some female players make money than the male number one player Jokovic. The issue you are referring to is prize money which is only a fraction of what each of the top players make from other deals like sponsorships and endorsments.



cyberdad
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02 Jun 2023, 4:07 am

IsabellaLinton wrote:
Do men wear the same shorts?

The solution imo would be to change their uniforms, if they agree it's a problem.

Ignoring it all isn't going to solve anything.


Actually they do

Image



IsabellaLinton
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02 Jun 2023, 4:09 am

OK cool. So men never do those kicks?
I think it would be more revealing for men than women.
Nothing was even showing for that woman.
It's like people couldn't handle the fact she had skin.


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TwilightPrincess
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02 Jun 2023, 4:14 am

cyberdad wrote:
Twilightprincess wrote:
The Williams sisters still made out pretty well. Money in sports is frequently unfair. Female athletes often make less than males which is a bigger problem IMO.


Actually if you read the article, some female players make money than the male number one player Jokovic. The issue you are referring to is prize money which is only a fraction of what each of the top players make from other deals like sponsorships and endorsments.


Which article?
It's extremely common for men to make more money than women in sports. Whether it's from prize money or a salary is inconsequential.
https://online.adelphi.edu/articles/mal ... ts-salary/


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TwilightPrincess
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02 Jun 2023, 4:15 am

IsabellaLinton wrote:
OK cool. So men never do those kicks?
I think it would be more revealing for men than women.
Nothing was even showing for that woman.
It's like people couldn't handle the fact she had skin.

Yeah, it's just really sad.


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cyberdad
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02 Jun 2023, 4:17 am

Twilightprincess wrote:
Which article?


This one
https://bleacherreport.com/articles/167 ... ens-tennis

A Chinese female player Li Na generates more money > world number 1 Novak Jokovic



TwilightPrincess
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02 Jun 2023, 4:18 am

cyberdad wrote:
Twilightprincess wrote:
Which article?


This one
https://bleacherreport.com/articles/167 ... ens-tennis

A Chinese female player Li Na generates more money > world number 1 Novak Jokovic

Okay...

Did you read my link which talks about other sports besides tennis?

One example doesn't say anything about female sports as a whole.


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cyberdad
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02 Jun 2023, 4:41 am

Twilightprincess wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
Twilightprincess wrote:
Which article?


This one
https://bleacherreport.com/articles/167 ... ens-tennis

A Chinese female player Li Na generates more money > world number 1 Novak Jokovic

Okay...

Did you read my link which talks about other sports besides tennis?

One example doesn't say anything about female sports as a whole.


I did read it, but what I am showing you is operant conditioning, Female sports players know there are salary and prize money ceilings for women's sports so the more they market themselves as commodities the more $$ they make
Otherwise they have to risk their life like Britney Griener and play basketball in Russia to make money and risk getting thrown in jail or worse.



TwilightPrincess
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02 Jun 2023, 6:57 am

^ What I am telling you is that that needs to change and is starting to to some extent in some sports. Female players need to continue to fight the system.

https://www.pbs.org/newshour/economy/u- ... agreements


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cyberdad
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02 Jun 2023, 10:48 pm

Twilightprincess wrote:
^ What I am telling you is that that needs to change and is starting to to some extent in some sports. Female players need to continue to fight the system.

https://www.pbs.org/newshour/economy/u- ... agreements


I agree with equal pay but another underlying problem is women's sport is not profitable. For women's sport to exist it ultimately needs government subsidies or philanthropic donations (for example Australian women's netball was entirely funded by a single donation from a female mining magnate GIna Rinhart). I am not aware of a single women's sport that has sufficient profitability in the US for teams to pay their players the same salaries as men's NBA, baseball leagues or football leagues. Remember that women make up 50% of the US population so when you see empty sports stadiums for women's sporting events I would ask where are the female supporters??



funeralxempire
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02 Jun 2023, 11:08 pm

cyberdad wrote:
Twilightprincess wrote:
^ What I am telling you is that that needs to change and is starting to to some extent in some sports. Female players need to continue to fight the system.

https://www.pbs.org/newshour/economy/u- ... agreements


I agree with equal pay but another underlying problem is women's sport is not profitable. For women's sport to exist it ultimately needs government subsidies or philanthropic donations (for example Australian women's netball was entirely funded by a single donation from a female mining magnate GIna Rinhart). I am not aware of a single women's sport that has sufficient profitability in the US for teams to pay their players the same salaries as men's NBA, baseball leagues or football leagues. Remember that women make up 50% of the US population so when you see empty sports stadiums for women's sporting events I would ask where are the female supporters??



Market pressures are relevant for pro sports, but not for funding for amateur teams.


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