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jjstar
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23 Oct 2007, 11:41 am

What happens when you follow your leaders blindly and put faith in the men in white. Oh boy.. :cry:

Nigeria: No Regret Over Drug Test - Pfizer
Leadership (Abuja)
Posted to the web 23 October 2007


Pfizer, the pharmaceutical company in the centre of a clinical test scandal, has shown that it has no regret for allegedly administering an untested and unregistered drug on about 200 children in Kano State in 1996, leading to their death.

Also the federal government has, in a motion ex-parte, got the leave of a Federal High Court in Abuja to amend its writ of summons.


Mr. Ezedi Udom, head, media relations speciality to Pfizer, said in a press release in Abuja yesterday that Pfizer stands by the results of the clinical trial of the drug Trovaflosacin and will vigorously defend it in court.

According to him, the company conducted the study in the midst of the ravaging epidemic, believing that Trovan would prove to be a safe and effective alternative to conventional methods of treating the meningitis epidemic .

Pfizer has already filed a statement of defence in the Kano State civil case.

The company maintains that in conducting the Trovan clinical trial in 1996, its long-term goal was to test a life-saving antibiotic that could be used effectively in a meningitis epidemic in developing countries.

Pfizer states that before conducting the study, it had obtained all necessary approvals from relevant federal and Kano State government agencies in Nigeria.

Mr. Udom added that at the time of the 1996 clinical trials in Kano, Trovan was in the late-stage development and had been tested on more than 5,000 patients on both oral and intravenous forms.

He explained that those studies demonstrated Trovan to be effective against several types of bacteria known to cause meningitis, to have excellent activity against all meningitis pathogens and to penetrate very well into the cerebrospinal fluid to effectively treat meningitis.

Pfizer contends that many of the allegations in all of the federal and civil cases are rooted in a never officially released government report that Pfizer contends is unconstitutional.

At yesterday's sitting, after hearing submissions, counsel to the federal government, Mr. Babantude Irukere, Justice Babs Kuemi granted a motion ex-parte to the federal government to amend its writ of summon by including Neimeth International Pharmaceutical Plc to replace Pfizer Nigeria.

The matter has been adjourned to December 4, 2007 for mention.

The federal government is asking the court to award $700 billion damages against the pharmaceutical firm.Relevant Links


At the previous sitting, the court gave the federal government the nod to issue writ of summons on Pfizer Incorporated and four other companies outside Nigeria by courier.

But Pfizer, according to Udom, contends that the investigative committee that produced the report "acted in excess of its powers"and denied the company the opportunity to hear the testimony of witnesses or to cross-examine them.

Last July, Pfizer filed a motion at a Federal High Court in Abuja seeking to quash the government's report.

Copyright © 2007 Leadership. All rights reserved.
http://allafrica.com/stories/200710230255.html



Don't follow leaders, watch your parking meters


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Goche21
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23 Oct 2007, 11:42 am

jjstar wrote:
Now now, if you can't play nicely with the others GOCHE21, you're going to have to sit in the corner for a *time out*. Then I'm going to call your mommy and tell her what a bad, bad boy you've been. You wouldn't like that would you now?

Right.

Where were we before that rude interruption?





Goche21 wrote:
jjstar wrote:
I guess I am a sheep, which is better than being a goat at least, cos they really smell. :wink:


I guess I'd rather smell like a battering ram than be led like a lamb to the slaughter.


You've been led to the slaughter. You're so desperate to find these conspiracies that you trust nothing the government says or does. We've all admited that medine and government aren't perfect, but that it's the best we've got. You insist that they're always wrong, and always evil. Nothing in always wrong and evil! Now I've asked you again and again, what would you do to protect children for disease without medine?
[/quote]

That's not answering my question.

How old are you?



jjstar
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23 Oct 2007, 11:48 am

There seems to be unrest amongst the throngs of drug takers world-wide and darnit they won't stand for being poisoned, guinea-pigged and tortured with pharmaceuticals any longer. Sheesh - just look at these lawsuits against Pfizer. It's a revolution I tell ya!

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&clie ... tnG=Search


Long live the revolution!


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Goche21
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23 Oct 2007, 11:52 am

jjstar wrote:
What happens when you follow your leaders blindly and put faith in the men in white. Oh boy.. :cry:

Nigeria: No Regret Over Drug Test - Pfizer
Leadership (Abuja)
Posted to the web 23 October 2007


Pfizer, the pharmaceutical company in the centre of a clinical test scandal, has shown that it has no regret for allegedly administering an untested and unregistered drug on about 200 children in Kano State in 1996, leading to their death.

Also the federal government has, in a motion ex-parte, got the leave of a Federal High Court in Abuja to amend its writ of summons.


Mr. Ezedi Udom, head, media relations speciality to Pfizer, said in a press release in Abuja yesterday that Pfizer stands by the results of the clinical trial of the drug Trovaflosacin and will vigorously defend it in court.

According to him, the company conducted the study in the midst of the ravaging epidemic, believing that Trovan would prove to be a safe and effective alternative to conventional methods of treating the meningitis epidemic .

Pfizer has already filed a statement of defence in the Kano State civil case.

The company maintains that in conducting the Trovan clinical trial in 1996, its long-term goal was to test a life-saving antibiotic that could be used effectively in a meningitis epidemic in developing countries.

Pfizer states that before conducting the study, it had obtained all necessary approvals from relevant federal and Kano State government agencies in Nigeria.

Mr. Udom added that at the time of the 1996 clinical trials in Kano, Trovan was in the late-stage development and had been tested on more than 5,000 patients on both oral and intravenous forms.

He explained that those studies demonstrated Trovan to be effective against several types of bacteria known to cause meningitis, to have excellent activity against all meningitis pathogens and to penetrate very well into the cerebrospinal fluid to effectively treat meningitis.

Pfizer contends that many of the allegations in all of the federal and civil cases are rooted in a never officially released government report that Pfizer contends is unconstitutional.

At yesterday's sitting, after hearing submissions, counsel to the federal government, Mr. Babantude Irukere, Justice Babs Kuemi granted a motion ex-parte to the federal government to amend its writ of summon by including Neimeth International Pharmaceutical Plc to replace Pfizer Nigeria.

The matter has been adjourned to December 4, 2007 for mention.

The federal government is asking the court to award $700 billion damages against the pharmaceutical firm.Relevant Links


At the previous sitting, the court gave the federal government the nod to issue writ of summons on Pfizer Incorporated and four other companies outside Nigeria by courier.

But Pfizer, according to Udom, contends that the investigative committee that produced the report "acted in excess of its powers"and denied the company the opportunity to hear the testimony of witnesses or to cross-examine them.

Last July, Pfizer filed a motion at a Federal High Court in Abuja seeking to quash the government's report.

Copyright © 2007 Leadership. All rights reserved.
http://allafrica.com/stories/200710230255.html



Don't follow leaders, watch your parking meters


Nigeria. I suppose next you'll bring up the Nazi testing on the Jewish? Or the human testing in the 1800's?



jjstar
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23 Oct 2007, 11:57 am

This happened -
200 Children Killed in 96' and just now is hitting the headlines big time..So according to that calculation...let's see here...the people who are being used as guinea pigs by pharmaceutical companies to *CURE* epidemics <cough> will prolly be seeing some kind of *justice* in 2018! Couldn't they speed things up a little? I mean given the end of the world in 2012 and all?


http://www.bloggingstocks.com/2007/10/0 ... n-nigeria/


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Last edited by jjstar on 23 Oct 2007, 12:03 pm, edited 2 times in total.

jjstar
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23 Oct 2007, 11:59 am

Goche21 wrote:
Nigeria. I suppose next you'll bring up the Nazi testing on the Jewish? Or the human testing in the 1800's?


So what if it's Nigeria. Are you saying it's irrelevant because they're African? What are you some kind of racist? I mean in addition to being the troll that you are ;) Oh c'mere. You just need a hug is all. <squeeze>


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Goche21
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23 Oct 2007, 12:03 pm

jjstar wrote:
Goche21 wrote:
Nigeria. I suppose next you'll bring up the Nazi testing on the Jewish? Or the human testing in the 1800's?


So what if it's Nigeria. Are you saying it's irrelevant because they're African? What are you some kind of racist? I mean in addition to being the troll that you are ;) Oh c'mere. You just need a hug is all. <squeeze>


It's Nigeria, that's hardly an example of our medical and legal system. That country is underdeveloped, with civil war and a barely functioning government, why not use the US, Canada, England, or any country that actually has regulations?



jjstar
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23 Oct 2007, 12:12 pm

The pharmaceuticals are carrying out their *trial experimentations* on the people in 3rd world countries - Read. Get informed - http://www.alternet.org/environment/37024



Goche21 wrote:
jjstar wrote:
Goche21 wrote:
Nigeria. I suppose next you'll bring up the Nazi testing on the Jewish? Or the human testing in the 1800's?


So what if it's Nigeria. Are you saying it's irrelevant because they're African? What are you some kind of racist? I mean in addition to being the troll that you are ;) Oh c'mere. You just need a hug is all. <squeeze>


It's Nigeria, that's hardly an example of our medical and legal system. That country is underdeveloped, with civil war and a barely functioning government, why not use the US, Canada, England, or any country that actually has regulations?


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Goche21
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23 Oct 2007, 12:20 pm

jjstar wrote:
The pharmaceuticals are carrying out their *trial experimentations* on the people in 3rd world countries - Read. Get informed - http://www.alternet.org/environment/37024



Goche21 wrote:
jjstar wrote:
Goche21 wrote:
Nigeria. I suppose next you'll bring up the Nazi testing on the Jewish? Or the human testing in the 1800's?


So what if it's Nigeria. Are you saying it's irrelevant because they're African? What are you some kind of racist? I mean in addition to being the troll that you are ;) Oh c'mere. You just need a hug is all. <squeeze>


It's Nigeria, that's hardly an example of our medical and legal system. That country is underdeveloped, with civil war and a barely functioning government, why not use the US, Canada, England, or any country that actually has regulations?


These tests were preformed without government athorization, and are illegal and underground. Once discovered they were terminated and the people prosecuted, the families are even filing lawsuits. The government is trying to stop these corrupt companies. Once again I say, the world isn't perfect, but we're doing our best. So now you have two choices, you can continue to gripe and cry over how bad things are but do basicly nothing, or work to stop it. Learn all the facts, all points of view and become a worker who stops it. In order to do that you need to learn to listen and understand our views, and not just your own.



Macbeth
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23 Oct 2007, 12:49 pm

jjstar wrote:
The pharmaceuticals are carrying out their *trial experimentations* on the people in 3rd world countries - Read. Get informed - http://www.alternet.org/environment/37024



Goche21 wrote:
jjstar wrote:
Goche21 wrote:
Nigeria. I suppose next you'll bring up the Nazi testing on the Jewish? Or the human testing in the 1800's?


So what if it's Nigeria. Are you saying it's irrelevant because they're African? What are you some kind of racist? I mean in addition to being the troll that you are ;) Oh c'mere. You just need a hug is all. <squeeze>


It's Nigeria, that's hardly an example of our medical and legal system. That country is underdeveloped, with civil war and a barely functioning government, why not use the US, Canada, England, or any country that actually has regulations?


One: third world nations are a mess. Its utterly unsurprising that people take advantage of them, and using one as an example of how all medicine is bad is frankly laughable. The road network in nigeria is pretty bad. Does that mae it an example of how all road networks worldwide are s**t? The Nigerian console gaming industry is a non-starter. Does that mean that all console gaming enterprises worldwide have failed?
Two: The key words are "trial" and "experimentation". Just because a given batch of pharmaceutical A does something nasty, or fails in some fashion, does not mean that others dont work perfectly well. If these trials had worked, we would be lauding the success of the saviours of the third world. It is NOT an example of how all drugs are rubbish in any way. Its an example of illegal and cynical manipulation by a company, which backfired badly. Its also notable that regardless of HOW a medical result is achieved, it is still a medical result. Look towards the testing done by the Nazis, and note how the aerospace industry these days still uses those results.
Three: Youre still wrong. Very wrong.
Four: You're probably not going to read all of this post anyway, which is singularly ignorant of you. For someone who claims to examine all sources before you make a decision about the truth of something, that seems like an odd attitude.
Five: You have STILL failed to come up with viable alternatives to most music, and most medicine. Its all very well telling us all we shouldnt do what doctors say, but thats not going to help us get any better, healthwise. Its wonderful to suggest that mass-marketed media sucks, but I dont see many suggestions as to what to replace it with coming from you.
Six: You're still wrong.


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Ana54
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23 Oct 2007, 1:53 pm

5. I said .5 for most of them. I sort of half-believe newspapers, half-listen to doctors, etc.



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23 Oct 2007, 2:48 pm

Macbeth wrote:
You have STILL failed to come up with viable alternatives to most music, and most medicine. Its all very well telling us all we shouldnt do what doctors say, but thats not going to help us get any better, healthwise. Its wonderful to suggest that mass-marketed media sucks, but I dont see many suggestions as to what to replace it with coming from you.


I might hazard a guess that jjstar's favorite music is the sound of drumming in her own head (any Doctor Who fans out there?):

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYnAlkk7_KA[/youtube]



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23 Oct 2007, 3:57 pm

Do you believe everything you're told? No
Did you drink Kool-Aide when you were a child? Yes
Do you live your life vicariously through TV shows? No
Do you believe what the FDA tells you? Some of the FDAs intentions are evil, but they haven't told me to do anything. I don't know whether or not I believe them or not.
Do you follow authority figures blindly? No
Do you read newspapers? No
Do you believe in Democracy? Yes
Do you put your faith in doctors? Most of the time, but I know that not all of them know everything.
Do you follow fashion? Definitely not.
Do you *follow the crowd* because it seems right even if it feels wrong? No
Do you hum commercial tunes? Not really, but they do get stuck in my head sometimes
Do you buy cheap food because it's on sale, even though it's unhealthy? I haven't got to the point of buying food for myself yet.
Do you believe that innoculations are a great necessity? Not necessarily
Do you listen to *pop* music? Not mainstream pop anyway

I try not to be a sheeple.


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23 Oct 2007, 9:58 pm

Do you believe everything you're told? That would be impossible. I've never been good at holding several contradictory notions in my mind simultaneously. Those close to me might disagree. :)

Did you drink Kool-Aid when you were a child? Yes, and Tang as well, but usually only at other kids' houses. My parents wouldn't buy it. I didn't feel deprived or anything; milk, OJ and water were perfectly good thirst-quenchers.

Do you live your life vicariously through TV shows? I live my life (whether vicariously or not, I can't say) through the input of my senses and through my cognitive processes. If I fail to find much to identify with in any cultural products (TV shows, movie characters, song lyrics) it's probably just as well.

Do you believe what the FDA tells you? What, the best scientists that agribusiness/pharma dollars can buy? :D The trouble with scientists is that they are prone to forget who is paying for their soup and beer, and thus they occasionally come up with findings contrary to the interests of their employers. Not all of these findings can be swept under the rug.

Do you follow authority figures blindly? I'm barely able to keep from stumbling and falling, even with my eyes wide open. Sometimes I notice who is near me on the path. If I like them, we might walk together for a while.

Do you read newspapers? Which ones, the boring broadsheets or the trashy tabloids? Yes, I read them, because it's useful to know what the b*stards in charge think we should be thinking about. If some bombasto-pundit writes something that causes my blood to boil, I skip over the rest of it, and do the Sudoku puzzle.

Do you believe in democracy? I believe that democracy has never been adequately tested, anywhere in the world, ever.

Do you put your faith in doctors? I follow medical advice about half the time, and ignore it the rest of the time, and in the long run it doesn't seem to have made much difference either way.

Do you follow fashion? Oh, this is an interesting one. In order to follow fashion, at least two preconditions have to be met. First, you have to be paying sufficient attention to your cultural milieu to know what is stylish and what isn't. Second, you must be prepared to go against personal inclination (if you have any such) to adopt what is stylish. Third, I suppose, you have to have the means to obtain the consumer goods involved.

Do you *follow the crowd* because it seems right even if it feels wrong? See Question 5 above.

Do you hum commercial tunes? By "commercial", do you mean music that is included with advertising? Or music that is played on radio stations that run ads? Or music that is put on disks and sold in shops? Or music that you can purchase for download online? Or music that you hear when you've bought a concert ticket? Yes, I suppose I do.

Do you buy cheap food because it's on sale, even though it's unhealthy? Where to begin in unpacking this? I buy food, because the alternatives are begging, stealing and dumpster diving, none of which appeals to me. I buy cheap food most of the time, and the occasional expensive item just for the sake of variety. "On sale"? A bargain is a state of mind. "Unhealthy"? Nutrition is a hotly-debated topic, and probably has been controversial since the beginning of time ("Eat the brown trilobites! The black ones are no good for you!").

Do you believe that immunisation is a great necessity? That depends on whether one thinks that epidemics of preventable disease should be allowed to happen, or not.

Do you listen to *pop* music? See Question 11 above.



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24 Oct 2007, 2:50 am

LostInSpace wrote:
Macbeth wrote:
You have STILL failed to come up with viable alternatives to most music, and most medicine. Its all very well telling us all we shouldnt do what doctors say, but thats not going to help us get any better, healthwise. Its wonderful to suggest that mass-marketed media sucks, but I dont see many suggestions as to what to replace it with coming from you.


I might hazard a guess that jjstar's favorite music is the sound of drumming in her own head (any Doctor Who fans out there?):

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYnAlkk7_KA[/youtube]


Of course.

Here come the drums....

Here come the drums....

HERE!

COME!

THE DRUMS
! !! !


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