Church Bars Family of Autistic Child from Church

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catspurr
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20 May 2008, 5:49 am

Mage wrote:
Seems to me that keeping the boy from church is the best thing for the boy, who cares what his mother thinks.

My son would probably go nuts at church if I brought him there. The huge crowd of people, the strange smells and sounds, the loud bells, the long quiet sermons, I would be insane to make my son sit through all that. Hell, I don't even like church myself for many of the same reasons, and once passed out from overstimulation.

Some autistics can handle church, but I'm guessing most can't, especially ones with lower functioning. There's no reason to make the poor boy go to church except the mom needs to complain about something.


Exactly! Do his parents still not understand what autism is that they would subject their son to that and then get pissed off and claim discrimination?

If he responds well, great but other children are also there and do his parents honestly value religion over their own son's comfort and other children's comfort that they can't understand that maybe he's better off not going?

If they are that religious, they can make time on the weekends to read from the bible. I do get tired of one sided entitlement issues.



hyper_alien
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20 May 2008, 6:23 am

This is not good


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LiendaBalla
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20 May 2008, 7:51 am

It would just be better if they went somewhere else. Church sessions, obviously, only stress him out and he doesn't get anything out of it. About the mother thinking she has to attend. Yeah, my mother does think it's vital to attend to. I don't, but she was raised to think that way. The mother in question could or could not be one of those sorts who thinks attendance is "soul saving" or vitaly important for the after life. So that's why I don't think she was going for attention or purposely forceing him to endure anything.

Churches can be loaded with scensory things, though. Many churches have bright lights, very loud speakers for elders, loud singing, sitting still, the rough fabric of the seats, ect. I wear ear plugs to my mom's church for that reason, and I don't go sometimes becuse I don't care for the 'kindly' personlities. You know, the 'niceness', verbal sort of thing that NTs need to feel welcomed or something. It just annoys me a little, and they know it. I still get an annoying soft pat sometimes. 'sigh' I hate soft patting, touching and pokeing!

There might be a sensory issue, and that wasn't adressed properly by anyone (so the article claims). All I read was that they tried to calm him down after he reacted, and the church people just kick them out after time. Shows what they all know doesn't it? :? :|



adverb
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20 May 2008, 9:08 am

i agree with everyone who said the kid is better off not having to go to church, but a restraining order to keep him out is awful. the church says that his behaviors are dangerous, but the only documented behaviors are almost causing someone to lose their balance when he ran out of church after the service (i always thought the crowded aisles blocked up by groups of people exchanging small talk were pretty overwhelming too. after the incident the family started leaving before the end of the service, to avoid a repeat.), pulling a girl onto his lap (the girl was his age or older, and lived with him. if he pulled her onto his lap, then he was sitting and she was right in front of him. no matter what the churchlady in the pew next to them thought about it, the girl's gotta know and expect and accept this kind of behavior, what with living with him and all.), and revving a car engine (someone left a car empty and running? i've known 13 year olds that would have gone joyriding and probably wrecked.).

it's really interesting that they want to protect their members from these behaviors, but the same diocese didn't bother to protect it's members from a molesting priest and hid/ignored the evidence for years while allowing him to continue to serve (and molest):
http://www.poynter.org/search/results_a ... hScope=all

there's a lot i don't know about catholicism, so it would be nice if someone could set me straight, but in that belief system isn't it considered essential to receive communion from a priest, and to participate in confession, and probably some other stuff? so isn't the church basically saying that the disabled kid upsets people and therefore deserves to go to hell? or at least, if he (or his parents) don't want him to go to hell, then they better find someone else to help them with that? that's pretty awful, no matter what others' opinions of that belief system might be.


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Danielismyname
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20 May 2008, 10:44 am

According to South Park, the disabled go to hell.



dawndeleon
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20 May 2008, 10:49 am

Tough call... Its a shame that the parishioners took it upon themselves to make the priest the bad guy in this issue. Heaven forbid anyone actually talk directly to her and take a proactive approach. If the mother wants her son to go to church, she may have a better selection now that their story is in print. Who knows, there may be a church more than willing to educate their congregation about autism. I thought church was supposed to be a sanctuary. Of course, if you have a 6ft tall over 200lb person having a meltdown it may be different. I like the idea of the stronger men stepping up to usher him and assist. But then it may be too much to ask. Many people in the churches dont like to be interrupted in their spiritual time. Of course compassion is as spiritual as anything else one could learn from a church. Having a staff that is educated on how to deal with these types of issues would be beneficial to any church. It could have been handled differently, without the sheriff being involved.



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20 May 2008, 11:12 am

Quote:
If they are that religious, they can make time on the weekends to read from the bible. I do get tired of one sided entitlement issues.


One-sided entitlement issues?!

You f**king hypocrite. :evil:



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20 May 2008, 11:13 am

Danielismyname wrote:
According to South Park, the disabled go to hell.


That's right, Danny Boy. All us poor cripples go to hell. :roll:



Danielismyname
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20 May 2008, 11:24 am

As I always say, if I go to hell, you're going to hell.

A god that sends me to hell for I have problems with group activities, social activities (church is a social thingy after all), even though I don't harm those who don't harm me directly, or those I care for, isn't a god I wish to exist with.



slowmutant
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20 May 2008, 11:34 am

If Danny can't go to Heaven, no one can?

I think I understand.



GreatCeleryStalk
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20 May 2008, 11:45 am

As a former priest I can understand the position of the parish and the diocese. One of the articles I read about the case indicated that the child was, at times, physically abusive and would occasionally urinate in church.

People with disabilities do have limits. If you're disabled in such a way that you're disruptive to an environment and are preventing people from doing what they're in that environment to do, then perhaps you shouldn't be in that environment. Accommodation only goes so far.

If he had tripped the priest while the priest had a censer full of smoldering incense or tripped one of the altar servers while carrying a lit candle or heavy processional cross, injury could have been the result. It's unfortunate that he couldn't be accommodated, but sometimes there's nothing that can be accommodated.

Adverb, in this case the individual isn't obligated to take communion because developmental disorders prevent him from doing that safely. I don't really feel like digging up the relevant parts of the Catechism or digging out Aquinas's Summa (IIRC he deals with ability to reason, handicap, and salvation somewhere in the ginormous text).

I don't particularly care for religion, and I think he'll be better served in the long run if he isn't exposed to it, but if he really wants to go to church he can find another.



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20 May 2008, 11:57 am

You used to be a priest and yet you don't care for religion?

A very curious statement.

I'm glad that someone on WP aggrees with me on this issue.



SamAckary
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20 May 2008, 4:20 pm

I'd rather go down to the burning pits of Christian Hell than heaven, though it would be fun to use the Stone Paradox to make god become completely destroyed ;)


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20 May 2008, 5:19 pm

spudnik wrote:
AnonymousAnonymous wrote:
Well then...why didn't the family go to another church?

The mother is just looking for attention, and thinks its her right to cause this commotion,
anyone else would have tried to make an effort to find another church, or have made
better arrangements accommodate them, the poor kid doesn't need or want this attention


Your joking....right? 8O



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20 May 2008, 7:08 pm

I have a sister who is severely autistic, and my mother wouldn't have dreamed of taking her to church. One of us kids always took turns staying home with her on Sundays. IMO, parents who take a child to church who has no idea of what it is all about, has sensory issues, and is prone to behavior that is violent, is putting their own values above the safety and well being of both the child and others. I am sure that boy wouldn't miss attending mass if deprived of it. I might be a wee bit biased, because of being forced to attend mass every Sunday when I hated it. I still have nightmares of being trapped inside a massive Cathedral, with no way out.


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20 May 2008, 7:31 pm

rottenlittleboys wrote:
spudnik wrote:
AnonymousAnonymous wrote:
Well then...why didn't the family go to another church?

The mother is just looking for attention, and thinks its her right to cause this commotion,
anyone else would have tried to make an effort to find another church, or have made
better arrangements accommodate them, the poor kid doesn't need or want this attention


Your joking....right? 8O

No I am not, , that mother is dragging this out ignoring the ban on bringing her son, and forcing this young man to go to church, when he is not capable of understanding exactly what is going on, this is just wrong. The kid is also very large and is potently dangerous, and he is only going to get worse. How do you think it would be for him if he really hurt someone and the police were called, they love to use Tasers, that I wouldn't want to see happen, you are ignoring what is good for this kid.



Last edited by spudnik on 20 May 2008, 9:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.