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greenblue
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20 Aug 2008, 4:54 pm

Fnord wrote:
Kilroy wrote:
how much evidence is there of heaven?

None.

There is an abundance of testimony (anecdotes, rumors, myths, legends, and stories), but no evidence.

You don't accept the Bible as evidence? :P


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Malsane
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20 Aug 2008, 4:55 pm

Personally, I believe in reincarnation. Although, this concept of 'higher' and 'lower' lifeforms based on how good you are I think is bogus. I don't see lifeforms as superior or inferior to one another, just adapted to their various niches.



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20 Aug 2008, 5:04 pm

greenblue wrote:
You don't accept the Bible as evidence?

The Bible is a written testimony of people long dead. However, I'm open to examining material evidence that would support and provide credibility for Biblical testimony as evidence for the existance of Heaven. So...

Evidence, Please?


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Since there is no singular, absolute definition of human nature,
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Last edited by Fnord on 20 Aug 2008, 5:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Fnord
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20 Aug 2008, 5:05 pm

Malsane wrote:
Personally, I believe in reincarnation.

Upon what evidence is your belief based?


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Since there is no singular, absolute definition of human nature,
nor any ultimate evaluation of human nature beyond that which we project onto others,
individuals should be judged or defined only by their actions and choices,
and not by what we only imagine their intentions and motivations to be.


greenblue
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20 Aug 2008, 5:23 pm

Fnord wrote:
Malsane wrote:
Personally, I believe in reincarnation.

Upon what evidence is your belief based?

Faith?


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benjimanbreeg
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20 Aug 2008, 5:43 pm

iamnotaparakeet wrote:
Fnord wrote:
benjimanbreeg wrote:
not trying to start a war, just wanna hear some views about it.

I'm open to examining material evidence that would support and provide credibility for the idea of reincarnation. So...

Evidence, Please?


Log of 1


this is where the discussion turned into double dutch



Malsane
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20 Aug 2008, 5:51 pm

greenblue wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Malsane wrote:
Personally, I believe in reincarnation.

Upon what evidence is your belief based?

Faith?
No, stories of reincarnation. I think you guys are jumping the gun a bit. I believe in reincarnation, but that's more a hypothesis than anything. Not a hard belief. It's just an idea I have about the world. Obviously, there's no hard evidence for it, so it's not something I stand by hard and fast, or something I would try to get others to believe.

Eh, maybe I shouldn't have come on this thread, since I don't have unchangeable, relentless views.



greenblue
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20 Aug 2008, 5:56 pm

Malsane wrote:
No, stories of reincarnation. I think you guys are jumping the gun a bit. I believe in reincarnation, but that's more a hypothesis than anything. Not a hard belief. It's just an idea I have about the world. Obviously, there's no hard evidence for it, so it's not something I stand by hard and fast, or something I would try to get others to believe.

Eh, maybe I shouldn't have come on this thread, since I don't have unchangeable, relentless views.

Well, in your defense, you claimed "I personally believe" rather than stating "Hey guys, reincarnation is real", so I believe asking for evidence from the post you made was not the best thing to do, and, thinking of as being just a hypothesis, conjecture or a mere idea is not that bad as some would make it sound, I suppose.


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Kilroy
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20 Aug 2008, 6:46 pm

Fnord wrote:
greenblue wrote:
You don't accept the Bible as evidence?

The Bible is a written testimony of people long dead. However, I'm open to examining material evidence that would support and provide credibility for Biblical testimony as evidence for the existance of Heaven. So...

Evidence, Please?


the Bible is a book
like Lord of the Rings


okay so Mordor was a real place?



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20 Aug 2008, 6:54 pm

Kilroy wrote:
okay so Mordor was a real place?

Sometimes, I wish it were so ... :(


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Since there is no singular, absolute definition of human nature,
nor any ultimate evaluation of human nature beyond that which we project onto others,
individuals should be judged or defined only by their actions and choices,
and not by what we only imagine their intentions and motivations to be.


Kilroy
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20 Aug 2008, 6:58 pm

I don't take orders from a filthy Morgul rat!!


:)



Fnord
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20 Aug 2008, 7:01 pm

Malsane wrote:
... I think you guys are jumping the gun a bit. I believe in reincarnation, but that's more a hypothesis than anything. Not a hard belief. It's just an idea I have about the world. Obviously, there's no hard evidence for it, so it's not something I stand by hard and fast, or something I would try to get others to believe.

That's cool. We're not at odds. Then again, assurance of life after death would be nice.

Malsane wrote:
Eh, maybe I shouldn't have come on this thread, since I don't have unchangeable, relentless views.

No worries. Some of us are open to the possibility, even though we play the hardline with what others might call "evidence" or "proof." Stick around - this may get interesting.


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Since there is no singular, absolute definition of human nature,
nor any ultimate evaluation of human nature beyond that which we project onto others,
individuals should be judged or defined only by their actions and choices,
and not by what we only imagine their intentions and motivations to be.


Fnord
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20 Aug 2008, 7:02 pm

benjimanbreeg wrote:
iamnotaparakeet wrote:
Fnord wrote:
benjimanbreeg wrote:
not trying to start a war, just wanna hear some views about it.

I'm open to examining material evidence that would support and provide credibility for the idea of reincarnation. So...

Evidence, Please?

Log of 1

this is where the discussion turned into double dutch

Double Dutch? I don't understand the concept.


_________________
 
Since there is no singular, absolute definition of human nature,
nor any ultimate evaluation of human nature beyond that which we project onto others,
individuals should be judged or defined only by their actions and choices,
and not by what we only imagine their intentions and motivations to be.


Fnord
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20 Aug 2008, 7:06 pm

Kilroy wrote:
I don't take orders from a filthy Morgul rat!!

I was referring to after the end of the third age, when Aragorn is crowned King of Gondor.


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Since there is no singular, absolute definition of human nature,
nor any ultimate evaluation of human nature beyond that which we project onto others,
individuals should be judged or defined only by their actions and choices,
and not by what we only imagine their intentions and motivations to be.


DentArthurDent
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20 Aug 2008, 7:07 pm

I get really mixed up with what I believe. I belive the probability of god is miniscule, but I think I believe in ghosts ( I have experienced what is generally reffered to as a ghost). So if there are ghosts does that mean that there is some kind of afterlife, if there is an after life is it possible to reincarnate. Or are ghosts some kind of electrical shadow or whatever, we presume that appartions are the souls of dead people because that idea fits within our current lack of scientific logic. Then as Malsane alluded to their are some incredible reincarnation stories out there which defy rational thought. So I will leave my mind open on this one.


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patternist
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20 Aug 2008, 7:13 pm

Fnord wrote:
benjimanbreeg wrote:
iamnotaparakeet wrote:
Fnord wrote:
benjimanbreeg wrote:
not trying to start a war, just wanna hear some views about it.

I'm open to examining material evidence that would support and provide credibility for the idea of reincarnation. So...

Evidence, Please?

Log of 1

this is where the discussion turned into double dutch

Double Dutch? I don't understand the concept.


Double Dutch. I think he means where it started truly going around in circles. Like the jumprope game.