McCain Campaign: Palin's 17-Year-Old Daughter Is Pregnant

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Apatura
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02 Sep 2008, 9:28 am

One of the main conflicts pro-lifers have is accepting teen pregnancy, because it is in part the moralistic condemnation of teenagers getting pregnant that makes them seek out abortions.

I will say though, that in my experience with pro-life activists (I am not one but growing up, my best friend came from a pro-life activist family) is that they are very kind and non-judgmental to teenage girls who are pregnant-- because they know they HAVE to be lest they scare or shame her into an abortion.



release_the_bats
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02 Sep 2008, 10:09 am

Wiggles wrote:
You may have noticed the phenomenon of hugely complex conspiracy theories emerging about a person almost immediately after they enter public view. Which seems more likely: being a public figure is somehow correlated to having a shady past, or that people are desperately looking for anything they can find to make the person look bad and will resort to anything to find it?


My thoughts exactly. This is why I classify public figures along with all the other "random people I don't know". I'm in no better position to make assumptions about a public figure than I am about some neighbor in the building across the street who I've never spoken to.

That is unless I happen to be personally acquainted with the public figure, in which case they're grouped with the other "random people I do know".



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02 Sep 2008, 12:27 pm

sinsboldly wrote:
Good women, all, who had a ring on their finger before anyone got the 'goods'.

Society needs to get back to the traditional family values.


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iamnotaparakeet
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02 Sep 2008, 12:31 pm

greenblue wrote:
sinsboldly wrote:
Good women, all, who had a ring on their finger before anyone got the 'goods'.

Society needs to get back to the traditional family values.

Society is redefining, "family", "tradition", and "values". :P



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02 Sep 2008, 12:32 pm

Coadunate wrote:
When children have children, it’s largely because nobody is taking care of them; they’re lonely and lost.

Yes, I think that's true, however, being horny might have something to do with it? I mean, very often teenagers hardly think of the consequences of their actions, whatever they do. Peer pressure, might be one reason.


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DW_a_mom
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02 Sep 2008, 2:16 pm

Mage wrote:
Because part of Palin's policy is very pro-life, even in cases of rape or incest, and she is a firm believer in abstinence-only sex ed, the way she handles her own family is very important when she intends to instill the same policies on the rest of the US.

As for third-hand information, this site: http://www.ktuu.com/global/story.asp?s=8194634 is an Alaskan news site that reported Trig's birth before all this came news. Yes, she did deliver a speech in Texas after her water broke. Yes, she did decide to fly back to Alaska afterwards, instead of rushing to an NICU hospital in Texas despite that her baby was 1 month premature. Yes, she did deliver at a regional hospital in Alaska with no NICU unit, despite the fact that other hospitals WITH NICU units would be closer to the airport she was flying into. (mapquest it).

So it's pretty hard for me to believe that she really wanted to see Trig live through the delivery.


My husband was born a full week after his mother's water broke. It was just a shrug in those days. Baby might come, baby might not.

Water break has not always meant "deliver NOW." I would assume she researched this issue before making a final decision. Shoot, my doctor and I talked about months before I was due. When to worry, when not to.


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DW_a_mom
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02 Sep 2008, 2:28 pm

Coadunate wrote:
Here's an excerpt from a famous Republican:

With parents not around to connect with kids because of busy careers or divorce, or because they’re shacking up or never got married, having a baby of one’s own seems like an obvious way for a kid to get attention, bond to someone, and have some “hands-on” love. Unfortunately, it doesn’t play out that way as the child-mothers discover that children are seriously dependent beings.

I remember when actresses like Ingrid Bergman (who left her husband and child to go to Europe to have an affair with one of her directors) were shunned from Hollywood for such behavior, Now, having affairs, abandoning children, and giving birth out-of-wedlock are met with magazine covers and more job offers based on increased visibility.

When children have children, it’s largely because nobody is taking care of them; they’re lonely and lost. But we should never point a finger or suggest fault - after all, someone’s feelings might be hurt! And we all know that “feelings” are the most important value - right? Dead wrong.

http://www.drlaurablog.com/category/pregnancy/


I think the above is really the point: the "do what I say, not what I do" attitude that seems to eminating from the Republican party as a whole. The preaching, the telling us it's liberal attitudes that are messing everything up, when the truth is that Republican families make all the same mistakes liberal ones do. So do they hold the right to preach about it, that they hold the only moral compass? Many of us would say no. If they could just admit that, they wouldn't get railed for it. But they don't admit it. Since they don't, every little imperfection gets held up. Not so much to say, "how horrible," but to say, "come on, admit you guys don't have all the answers, either."

On a personal level, woman to woman, I would not hold a daughter's actions against a mother, and I think the statement the Palin's issued was well done. And I am proud that the daughter will marry and raise the child, instead of choosing an abortion (although I would also be proud if she gave the baby for adoption).

But I was still stunned to see a Republican candidate with such a political ball and chain. And it IS a political ball and chain, because we're talking about the "family values" party.


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Mage
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02 Sep 2008, 3:14 pm

DW_a_mom wrote:
Mage wrote:
Because part of Palin's policy is very pro-life, even in cases of rape or incest, and she is a firm believer in abstinence-only sex ed, the way she handles her own family is very important when she intends to instill the same policies on the rest of the US.

As for third-hand information, this site: http://www.ktuu.com/global/story.asp?s=8194634 is an Alaskan news site that reported Trig's birth before all this came news. Yes, she did deliver a speech in Texas after her water broke. Yes, she did decide to fly back to Alaska afterwards, instead of rushing to an NICU hospital in Texas despite that her baby was 1 month premature. Yes, she did deliver at a regional hospital in Alaska with no NICU unit, despite the fact that other hospitals WITH NICU units would be closer to the airport she was flying into. (mapquest it).

So it's pretty hard for me to believe that she really wanted to see Trig live through the delivery.


My husband was born a full week after his mother's water broke. It was just a shrug in those days. Baby might come, baby might not.

Water break has not always meant "deliver NOW." I would assume she researched this issue before making a final decision. Shoot, my doctor and I talked about months before I was due. When to worry, when not to.


Ask your doctor what you're supposed to do when your water breaks when:
1. You are 44 years old.
2. Your baby is 1 month premature.
3. Your baby has Down's Syndrome.
4. It's your 5th child.

If you doctor says anything but "Come in to get checked" I would seriously question your doctor's judgement.

If your doctor says "Hey, just get on a plane for 8 hours and deliver at any old hospital, certainly not one with an NICU unit in it" then your doctor might just be as stupid or reckless as Sarah Palin.



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02 Sep 2008, 3:47 pm

Obama said that this isn't an issue because it's not relevant, and that he thinks that a candidate's children shouldn't be attacked.


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02 Sep 2008, 9:13 pm

Apatura wrote:
One of the main conflicts pro-lifers have is accepting teen pregnancy, because it is in part the moralistic condemnation of teenagers getting pregnant that makes them seek out abortions.

I will say though, that in my experience with pro-life activists (I am not one but growing up, my best friend came from a pro-life activist family) is that they are very kind and non-judgmental to teenage girls who are pregnant-- because they know they HAVE to be lest they scare or shame her into an abortion.


thank you, Apatura,
I didn't know that had changed, of course, my own experience was long before abortion was legal. Back in the wire hanger days. I didn't know anyone with a wire hanger, nor did I know about it. . I mostly just ran down the street and slammed into the railing. .that was preferable to being around my parents.

Merle


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02 Sep 2008, 10:18 pm

Mage wrote:

Ask your doctor what you're supposed to do when your water breaks when:
1. You are 44 years old.
2. Your baby is 1 month premature.
3. Your baby has Down's Syndrome.
4. It's your 5th child.

If you doctor says anything but "Come in to get checked" I would seriously question your doctor's judgement.

If your doctor says "Hey, just get on a plane for 8 hours and deliver at any old hospital, certainly not one with an NICU unit in it" then your doctor might just be as stupid or reckless as Sarah Palin.


How do you know that that isn't exactly what happened? I can think of a very good reason she would choose to fly after her water broke, and that would be to go see the one doctor she knew and trusted, and to be near her loved ones.

This "stupid and reckless woman," as you describe her, managed to run a winning campaign to become Governor of a US State, while still performing the duties of a mother of 4 children.

What have you done in your lifetime that compares with that? What qualifies you to question her judgement?



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02 Sep 2008, 10:45 pm

jrknothead wrote:

Quote:
How do you know that that isn't exactly what happened? I can think of a very good reason she would choose to fly after her water broke, and that would be to go see the one doctor she knew and trusted, and to be near her loved ones.


Finding a doctor you know and trust is for ordinary people like you and me. When you are the governor of a state and loaded the doctors you know and trust come to you, you don’t go to them. In fact they come running.

Quote:
This "stupid and reckless woman," as you describe her, managed to run a winning campaign to become Governor of a US State, while still performing the duties of a mother of 4 children.


As an Aspie you should know as well as I do that being able to sell yourself has NOTHING to do with intelligence. Have you forgotten those airhead jocks and cheerleaders in your school?

Quote:
What have you done in your lifetime that compares with that? What qualifies you to question her judgement?


I don’t know about Mage but I am a successful self-employed business owner. Albeit a small business but I did it with a handicap. The only handicap Palin seems to have is being an airhead.



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02 Sep 2008, 11:18 pm

Looking at her biography, I can see that she is the daughter of a high school science teacher and a school administrator... She earned her BS at the University of Idaho, and her children are homeschooled. Her husband is a commercial fisherman.

There's nothing there to suggest she's 'loaded', and I see no reason to refer to her as an 'airhead'...

What are you basing this assessment upon?



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03 Sep 2008, 12:46 am

Coadunate wrote:
Personally, if I ever lose my intelligence to the level of a Down syndrome I would hope and pray that someone would put me out of my misery, let alone be born that way. Heck, I’m unhappy that I’m not as intelligent as Einstein. My guess is almost everyone feels the way I do.


actually, if you had the intelligence and nature of someone with Down's Syndrome, you likely you would be happy with the fact you exist.


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Coadunate
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03 Sep 2008, 1:47 am

Bush graduated from Yale; what does that prove? When you have connections and money you can get a BS with BS. As for Palin here's her 2007 financial disclosure statement:

http://projects.publicintegrity.org/doc ... 000068.pdf

More than enough to get a doctor to come running when you have to "protect human life from conception"



jrknothead
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03 Sep 2008, 2:19 am

Coadunate wrote:
Bush graduated from Yale; what does that prove? When you have connections and money you can get a BS with BS. As for Palin here's her 2007 financial disclosure statement:

http://projects.publicintegrity.org/doc ... 000068.pdf

More than enough to get a doctor to come running when you have to "protect human life from conception"


University of Idaho is not a school that would come to mind when one mentions wealthy people...

As for the financial disclosure statement, it lists some shares in an IRA account (inaccessible until the owner reaches the age of 55), a cash balance of zero, and a home mortgage and credit card accounts.

These are not wealthy people.

I have to wonder, do you scrutinize the private affairs of a candidate to this degree when their political views are in tune with your own?

Rarely does one find a candidate with a record as clean as this one.

Besides, all of your points are moot. The child did not suffer due to her actions, so why condemn her for them?

It seems that you are not only holding her responsible for her own actions, but for the actions and statements of everyone who shares a party affiliation with her.

Do all of your decisions and actions reflect the values espoused by your candidates' political party? Do you think you should be held accountable when they don't?

If not, then why should she?