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lotusblossom
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07 Dec 2008, 5:58 am

yes greentea, a great example :D

This is just the sort of thing that gets me grief from people when they watch me with my kids. People have often critisized me or been puzzled with me for not doing the "right" thing that was automatic to them to do in a situation.

This is definately because I respond in a concrete or logical way. Ive recently started correcting people who indirectly "message" at me. For example my mum was moaning about a man who was visiting her maybe needing the toilet, I finaly figured out that she wanted me to vacume the landing! I told her not to 'message' me but just say "can you vacume the landing".

Its very hard to work out what other people want and I have to use all my brain to solve it like a puzzle.



sinsboldly
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07 Dec 2008, 12:54 pm

violet_yoshi wrote:

Of course it doesn't help that they act like raging monsters when I try to explain my situation, instead going into a infantile rage as if they're shouting "My baby! My baby! MY BABY!" like an hysteric. Is this really how parents want to be seen by people who have a invisible disability like this? Is it so hard for them to understand that there's a world outside the baby bubble, where people simply don't perfer to be near children and that doesn't mean they're a child hating monster, which requires them to go into lioness mode?


violet_yoshi,
You have probably learned by now that 99.9% of people don't give a hoot about an 'invisible disability,' even if they stopped to think of what that is. Also parents, especially new parents (mothers) have this hormone that causes them to go into lioness mode, and they usually don't know their own strength with it, either. You are also realizing that after you grow to beyond being a child yourself, less and less care and respect for your own well being is given by other people.
At some point, you gotta tell the receptionist you are in the hall if your name is called . . .

Merle


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violet_yoshi
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07 Dec 2008, 1:39 pm

sinsboldly wrote:
violet_yoshi wrote:

Of course it doesn't help that they act like raging monsters when I try to explain my situation, instead going into a infantile rage as if they're shouting "My baby! My baby! MY BABY!" like an hysteric. Is this really how parents want to be seen by people who have a invisible disability like this? Is it so hard for them to understand that there's a world outside the baby bubble, where people simply don't perfer to be near children and that doesn't mean they're a child hating monster, which requires them to go into lioness mode?


violet_yoshi,
You have probably learned by now that 99.9% of people don't give a hoot about an 'invisible disability,' even if they stopped to think of what that is. Also parents, especially new parents (mothers) have this hormone that causes them to go into lioness mode, and they usually don't know their own strength with it, either. You are also realizing that after you grow to beyond being a child yourself, less and less care and respect for your own well being is given by other people.
At some point, you gotta tell the receptionist you are in the hall if your name is called . . .

Merle


I know what's even worse is the parents don't seem to care about the kids. I found a great Foamy the Squirrel rant about this (contains bad language):

http://www.illwillpress.com/door22.html

You need Flash or Shockwave to see it, I don't know which but if you don't have it I'm sure it will tell you lol.

It's like fine I could see getting upset if they thought I'd be mean to the kids, but the parents don't seem to even care about that, all that matters is THEY were inconvenienced. That's what upsets me, and you know very well if I had a meltdown in front of their kids which usually involves in me ranting on about how brats don't belong in a resturant, they'd have no problem screaming at me when I tried to inform them so they could avoid that situation. I've been called a child hater so many times by these parents, I wonder if perhaps the only way they'd leave me alone and free from their kids is to act like one. I don't want to, really I don't, but it's like you have to hit some of these parents over the head with a 2 x 4 in order to get them to understand the world isn't a freaking daycare.



ephemerella
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07 Dec 2008, 2:34 pm

This is a great Asperger topic. On a cross-country road trip listening to Steven Johnson's "Social intelligence", he described a similar scenario as an example of how dealing with these kinds of situations helps shape a child's social intelligence. I was interested, back then, in developing cognitive models for how social empathy develops as a neuroplastic function, and his books "Emotional intelligence" and "Social intelligence" describe the neuroscience of affect and social empathy.

I can post more info, if anyone is interested, but the jist of his passage on this kind of problem is to stop the child from doing that which is harmful or forbidden, with his unintentionally offensive behavior, and instead of punishing the child or trying to control his emotions or mindset, immediately engage him in something positive and engaging. So you clearly stop the unwanted behavior but direct his energy into something else that is more healthy and constructive. What you want to avoid is getting into a ego battle or a battle over control of each other. And then you want to engage the energy in something else otherwise it will start up again with something else.

I think that the advice others have posted, to give him something else to play with is along those lines.

I am of course assuming that this is your child. Otherwise, you can pick up the kid and start hitting the mother with him (just kidding).



Greentea
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07 Dec 2008, 2:44 pm

This example is taken from a couple days ago at the hospital, when I was in the waiting room. My operation will be in the children's department, so I like to observe the kids and the parents when I go there.


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elderwanda
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07 Dec 2008, 10:46 pm

Greentea wrote:
You're sitting in the waiting room at the doctor's. Your 1 year old baby is in its stroller, you're holding a paper with the results of your last physical exam. The baby tries to grab the paper, you distance it from him, he tries to reach it and cries and screams that he wants the paper. He's disturbing the silence in the room.

What do you do?



Assuming that I'm trying to concentrate on what's on the paper, and can't give him my undivided attention, I'd find him something to look at or hold. Maybe give him my keys, or find a pamphlet or something for him.



Ryn
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07 Dec 2008, 10:59 pm

Wow, my Theory of Mind sucks. I assumed the baby wanted the paper, so I would have folded it up, but it in the seat next to me, and not give it to the baby.

Good thing I have no intention of being a parent.


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CTBill
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07 Dec 2008, 11:35 pm

Spokane_Girl wrote:
Greentea wrote:
zghost wrote:
hand him something else and hope it distracts him

Right answer ! !!

Oh, this was a test? I guess I failed.

Me too--sort of.

My first thought was, "Baby wants paper, but he can't have this piece of paper, so give him a magazine from the waiting room, or one of those loose subscription cards they stick in them just to annoy me (are you listening, New Yorker?)."

Then I thought, "No, you fool! Do you know how many germs are on those things? And what if baby gets a paper cut and septicemia sets in?" :eew:

Do I get partial credit? :D

Anyway, I guess it's a good thing I won't be having any kids--I'd be lost, especially if they turned out to be NT...



neshamaruach
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08 Dec 2008, 9:23 am

I hate to be the voice of dissent here, but there is *no* right answer to this question. That is because each child is different, and each child will react differently depending on the day, time, how long it's been since lunch, whether they've had a nap, what kind of personality they have, whether the mother is in a good mood, and a host of other things.

Some children will want only what they've set their mind to, so if they want that piece of paper you're holding, they'll scream bloody murder if you try to pull a fast one and give them a substitute. Some children will do this only when they're tired. Some will do it more consistently. Some will not do it at all.

Some children will scream for what you've got in your hand because they want your attention. Some will do this only when tired. Some will do it more consistently. Some will not do it at all.

And on and on.

This is why I've never read a child-raising book in my life. There is no recipe for how to respond to a child except to get to know the child and to be attentive to the child, his/her patterns, personality, needs, etc. It's not hard for an Aspie to do, trust me. You just have to pay attention. I'm a wonderful mom, and always have been, and it has nothing to do with having a great theory of mind.

When my child would scream, I'd leave the room for with her for awhile and then try to solve the problem, mainly because, being an Aspie, I'm sensitive to noise and figure that someone else in the room might be sensitive to noise as well.



elderwanda
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08 Dec 2008, 1:09 pm

neshamaruach wrote:
I hate to be the voice of dissent here, but there is *no* right answer to this question. That is because each child is different, and each child will react differently depending on the day, time, how long it's been since lunch, whether they've had a nap, what kind of personality they have, whether the mother is in a good mood, and a host of other things.

Some children will want only what they've set their mind to, so if they want that piece of paper you're holding, they'll scream bloody murder if you try to pull a fast one and give them a substitute. Some children will do this only when they're tired. Some will do it more consistently. Some will not do it at all.

Some children will scream for what you've got in your hand because they want your attention. Some will do this only when tired. Some will do it more consistently. Some will not do it at all.

And on and on.

This is why I've never read a child-raising book in my life. There is no recipe for how to respond to a child except to get to know the child and to be attentive to the child, his/her patterns, personality, needs, etc. It's not hard for an Aspie to do, trust me. You just have to pay attention. I'm a wonderful mom, and always have been, and it has nothing to do with having a great theory of mind.

When my child would scream, I'd leave the room for with her for awhile and then try to solve the problem, mainly because, being an Aspie, I'm sensitive to noise and figure that someone else in the room might be sensitive to noise as well.


Absolutely! Each kid is different, and each situation is different. And when it's your own kid, you know what to do. :)