Israel has more of a right to exist than the United States

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ASPowerations
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10 Jan 2009, 11:15 pm

We (the Americans) have the right to be our own nation because WE WON A WAR? What does that have to do with anything?

Israel, on the other hand, was created as the result of a decision of a group of the world's leaders, the UN.

Any thoughts?


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10 Jan 2009, 11:25 pm

we have been attacked because we love freedom and we treat people with equality.(well according to those who are fighting in IRaq and AFghanistan)

I agree, however, Israel has always existed, however, when they were exiled after the sacking during Rome's occupation, it was lost. However, the genocide of the jewish people by Hitler was a wakeup call that was in the making for a long time, that said that Israel should exist. A state where all those of Jewish Faith should be allowed to be free.


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10 Jan 2009, 11:27 pm

..and all this time I thought we were allies....but, it should be remembered by all that Israel has nukes, and Israel has put satellites in orbit, which means they have rockets that can reach the US...with nukes.



t0
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10 Jan 2009, 11:44 pm

ASPowerations wrote:
We (the Americans) have the right to be our own nation because WE WON A WAR? What does that have to do with anything?


Wasn't the UN created after its founders won a war?



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11 Jan 2009, 12:20 am

t0 wrote:
ASPowerations wrote:
We (the Americans) have the right to be our own nation because WE WON A WAR? What does that have to do with anything?


Wasn't the UN created after its founders won a war?


We had the League of Nations before that. Same principle, not as effective. The UN was merely a reworking of that concept. Different sort of war as well.

Its worth thinking about: which is more right? A nation created by treaty and international agreement, or one based on an act of rebellion? A nation debated at length by international leadership. A nation created on the basis of tax-evasion..

Maybe that's why America has less problems with its borders than Israel. America fought several wars to establish its borders and rule within them. Israel got told : here are your borders, then everyone around them promptly ignored them.

On a slightly seperate note, I personally would find it awesome if the UN declared the states sn illegal body, and returned them to those they fought to take them from. Think of how much more than 200 years of back taxes is? We would all live like kings, in our castles.


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11 Jan 2009, 1:01 am

Well, I hold Israel in the utmost respect because it's the country that belongs to the Lord's people, the Israelites.



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11 Jan 2009, 1:12 am

not my lords people
but one has to respect what those people gone threw
even if you don;t share their beliefs



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11 Jan 2009, 2:26 am

well, I actually don't have anything against Israel...if I was rich, I'd even come to visit...;)

I think we both have a right to exist, despite what some hotheads in certain caves in a certain country think.



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11 Jan 2009, 5:36 pm

Most Israelis are not actually related to the ancient Jews. I was raised Jewish and I look pretty far from middle eastern. Why should a country be given to people who follow a certain religion??


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11 Jan 2009, 8:10 pm

britian wanted them out of the way, so after WW2 ended they gave them palastine as a "we're sorry we did nothing" sort of thing



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11 Jan 2009, 8:47 pm

Kilroy wrote:
britian wanted them out of the way, so after WW2 ended they gave them palastine as a "we're sorry we did nothing" sort of thing


Because obviously we weren't the only people fighting the f*****g war at one point. The only place in Europe or in fact the rest of the world actively resisting German dominance. MMMM righto mate.. that's us not doing anything right there that is. As opposed to say.. America, land of the free and all that shite, who IMMEDIATELY sprang into action way back in 39.

I think you will find that its a little more complicated than your fallacious little remark suggests.


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11 Jan 2009, 9:21 pm

i was refearing to the hoocaust, no one did anything about that
and they knew
france gave them jews
as did russia, norway, everywhere, well except denmark...they got 95% of them to sweden



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12 Jan 2009, 3:16 am

IdahoRose wrote:
Well, I hold Israel in the utmost respect because it's the country that belongs to the Lord's people, the Israelites.

history_of_psychiatry is correct, approximately 88% of modern Jews are descended from converts according to this.

This makes me wonder why many Christians are so willing to call the Jews Gods people and disregard John 14:6 I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh to the Father, but by me. I don't see any exemption or qualifier in there for the Jews. But even if they (the Jews) are specifically exempted from what Jesus said, then why should the Christians settle for a back of the bus, separate but equal, spot in heaven relative to the Jews? After all if they were to become Jewish through conversion, like the Ashkenazi branch of Judaism, then wouldn't they be entitled to sit at the big people's table in heaven instead of the kids table?

ASPowerations, was that august body the UN also correct when they voted to declare Zionism is Racism in 1975? Or is it possible the UN could be wrong once in a while? Because if the UN is wrong on occasion, then it seems to me that the idea that UN vote=legitimacy could be flawed.



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12 Jan 2009, 7:58 am

pakled wrote:
..and all this time I thought we were allies....but, it should be remembered by all that Israel has nukes, and Israel has put satellites in orbit, which means they have rockets that can reach the US...with nukes.


So do the Brits, the French and the Chinese. Are you equally worried about them? I don't think the U.S. has to worry about Israel attacking.

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12 Jan 2009, 8:13 am

IdahoRose wrote:
Well, I hold Israel in the utmost respect because it's the country that belongs to the Lord's people, the Israelites.


I hate to break bad news to you. But you are about 2500 years behind the times. Long, long ago Israelites existed. Now there are Jews. The Israelites became the Jews during the Babylonian exile. It was the Diaspora that made the Jews. Israel is constituted as Midenoth Y'sroel, a secular state. In Israel the Knesset makes the laws, not Yaweh. There is no priestly class in Israel. Most Israelis are not all that observant. Visit the beaches on the Sabbath during the summer and see for yourself. Thank G-D we are no longer The Chosen People. Being G-D's Chosen almost finished us off. Jews still live in the Diaspora (for the most part) and that is what has saved us.

There are more Orthodox Jews in Brooklyn New York than there are in the State of Israel. Borough Park is the Promised Land. Further north in the Boston Area, Brookline MA is the Promised Land.

I suspect you take the Gospels as gospel. Don't. The Gospels have nothing to do with reality.

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12 Jan 2009, 11:56 am

The state of Israël was a hastily made decision. The world leaders at that time cared more for setting an example, extracting some feelgood points from the people. They just took land from several nations, called it their own and gave it to the Jewish.

I feel the decision on itself was very good. The way it was implemented wasn't that great however.