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Kangoogle
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20 Mar 2009, 2:13 pm

ephemerella wrote:
Kangoogle wrote:
<snip> I think maybe it is that type of AS person who has a hard time lying.

Basically any aspie who feels morally bound to obey the ethics code laid out by society has a problem lying. I freed myself from such stupidity a long long time ago.


I've thought about that. This is a really important question but I was never able to do it. How did you free yourself from your social behavior codes without becoming socially disoriented? It's not as if I can surf on a wave of real-time empathy. What social code or system gives structure to your behavior, then? Do you have more of a social empathy than some AS?[/quote]
This may sound slightly cliche, but I suppose the main thing is I really do believe in myself and know what I want socially. What I personally did (I offer no guarantees as to whom it will work for) is looked at all my social codes, sat down for a long length of time then looked at a load of books on political obligation, social skills for executives. Then I went out and met loads of people who are probably on the spectrum and looked out how they live their lives. Finally I experimented a lot, the university environment is one of the best places to experiment, if not the best. After all that, I pretty much now know what my cake is and how to eat it. Seems I am not the only one to have done something like this either.



ephemerella
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20 Mar 2009, 2:50 pm

Kangoogle wrote:
ephemerella wrote:
Kangoogle wrote:
Basically any aspie who feels morally bound to obey the ethics code laid out by society has a problem lying. I freed myself from such stupidity a long long time ago.

I've thought about that. This is a really important question but I was never able to do it. How did you free yourself from your social behavior codes without becoming socially disoriented? It's not as if I can surf on a wave of real-time empathy. What social code or system gives structure to your behavior, then? Do you have more of a social empathy than some AS?

This may sound slightly cliche, but I suppose the main thing is I really do believe in myself and know what I want socially. What I personally did (I offer no guarantees as to whom it will work for) is looked at all my social codes, sat down for a long length of time then looked at a load of books on political obligation, social skills for executives. Then I went out and met loads of people who are probably on the spectrum and looked out how they live their lives. Finally I experimented a lot, the university environment is one of the best places to experiment, if not the best. After all that, I pretty much now know what my cake is and how to eat it. Seems I am not the only one to have done something like this either.


Well, I've done some of the last steps, and social psychology study too. I suppose the key is that you have an inner confidence that maybe I lack. I do know that confidence and a low expectations (of my social success) feeds into poor performance socially. It sounds to me that your secret ingredient is the belief in yourself that frees you from being confused and disoriented.

Thanks for reminding me of this! That is really, really beneficial. I think we can focus so much on mind-blindness and other limiting cognitive features of social behavior that we forget the freeing effect of inspired confidence.

Thanks so much for this reply.



Kangoogle
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20 Mar 2009, 3:14 pm

ephemerella wrote:
Kangoogle wrote:
ephemerella wrote:
Kangoogle wrote:
Basically any aspie who feels morally bound to obey the ethics code laid out by society has a problem lying. I freed myself from such stupidity a long long time ago.

I've thought about that. This is a really important question but I was never able to do it. How did you free yourself from your social behavior codes without becoming socially disoriented? It's not as if I can surf on a wave of real-time empathy. What social code or system gives structure to your behavior, then? Do you have more of a social empathy than some AS?

This may sound slightly cliche, but I suppose the main thing is I really do believe in myself and know what I want socially. What I personally did (I offer no guarantees as to whom it will work for) is looked at all my social codes, sat down for a long length of time then looked at a load of books on political obligation, social skills for executives. Then I went out and met loads of people who are probably on the spectrum and looked out how they live their lives. Finally I experimented a lot, the university environment is one of the best places to experiment, if not the best. After all that, I pretty much now know what my cake is and how to eat it. Seems I am not the only one to have done something like this either.


Well, I've done some of the last steps, and social psychology study too. I suppose the key is that you have an inner confidence that maybe I lack. I do know that confidence and a low expectations (of my social success) feeds into poor performance socially. It sounds to me that your secret ingredient is the belief in yourself that frees you from being confused and disoriented.

Thanks for reminding me of this! That is really, really beneficial. I think we can focus so much on mind-blindness and other limiting cognitive features of social behavior that we forget the freeing effect of inspired confidence.

Thanks so much for this reply.

No problem. Two things I missed off though:
(a) Arrogance can work in succeeding socially, the only catch is it might not be a price worth paying. Try to stick within the bounds of confidence, difficult it may be.
(b) Asides the very basics socially, the key thing to (a) and actually doing well in the social game is conversation. If you are good at this, most problems go away. I would really recommend Leil Lowndes tips book on this as a starting point.



saintloop
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20 Mar 2009, 3:24 pm

millie wrote:
i am a big, full, rotund, beautiful, transparent jellyfish.


That's me too. Unlike jellyfish, some people manipulate me though :)

When I notice manipulation I start looking for the emergency button... to stop the world.



Kangoogle
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20 Mar 2009, 3:26 pm

saintloop wrote:
millie wrote:
i am a big, full, rotund, beautiful, transparent jellyfish.


That's me too. Unlike jellyfish, some people manipulate me though :)

When I notice manipulation I start looking for the emergency button... to stop the world.

You are manipulated absolutely everywhere though. What you actually notice just scratches the surface. The key thing is to learn how to manipulate others.



ephemerella
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20 Mar 2009, 4:25 pm

Kangoogle wrote:
ephemerella wrote:
Well, I've done some of the last steps, and social psychology study too. I suppose the key is that you have an inner confidence that maybe I lack. I do know that confidence and a low expectations (of my social success) feeds into poor performance socially. It sounds to me that your secret ingredient is the belief in yourself that frees you from being confused and disoriented.

Thanks for reminding me of this! That is really, really beneficial. I think we can focus so much on mind-blindness and other limiting cognitive features of social behavior that we forget the freeing effect of inspired confidence.

Thanks so much for this reply.

No problem. Two things I missed off though:
(a) Arrogance can work in succeeding socially, the only catch is it might not be a price worth paying. Try to stick within the bounds of confidence, difficult it may be.
(b) Asides the very basics socially, the key thing to (a) and actually doing well in the social game is conversation. If you are good at this, most problems go away. I would really recommend Leil Lowndes tips book on this as a starting point.


Thanks again! I will order this book. I have mingling tips stuff but never actually got a conversation book... this makes sense for me to get one since I've been practicing verbal skills for about a couple of years now and am getting much better, verbally. Maybe good enough to start thinking about conversation.

How do you strategize a conversation when you don't have social impulses or a social agenda? It is at this stage that both learning manipulation and learning social drives tend to fail because of the lack of social drive or interest. Do you intentionally simulate a social interest? Or are you one of those AS who has social strategy and agendas?

Sorry to keep asking you Q...



Kangoogle
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20 Mar 2009, 6:38 pm

ephemerella wrote:
Kangoogle wrote:
ephemerella wrote:
Well, I've done some of the last steps, and social psychology study too. I suppose the key is that you have an inner confidence that maybe I lack. I do know that confidence and a low expectations (of my social success) feeds into poor performance socially. It sounds to me that your secret ingredient is the belief in yourself that frees you from being confused and disoriented.

Thanks for reminding me of this! That is really, really beneficial. I think we can focus so much on mind-blindness and other limiting cognitive features of social behavior that we forget the freeing effect of inspired confidence.

Thanks so much for this reply.

No problem. Two things I missed off though:
(a) Arrogance can work in succeeding socially, the only catch is it might not be a price worth paying. Try to stick within the bounds of confidence, difficult it may be.
(b) Asides the very basics socially, the key thing to (a) and actually doing well in the social game is conversation. If you are good at this, most problems go away. I would really recommend Leil Lowndes tips book on this as a starting point.


Thanks again! I will order this book. I have mingling tips stuff but never actually got a conversation book... this makes sense for me to get one since I've been practicing verbal skills for about a couple of years now and am getting much better, verbally. Maybe good enough to start thinking about conversation.

Bit torrent is your friend, failing that rapidshare. Most of these books are easy to grab as pdf's.
Quote:
How do you strategize a conversation when you don't have social impulses or a social agenda? It is at this stage that both learning manipulation and learning social drives tend to fail because of the lack of social drive or interest. Do you intentionally simulate a social interest? Or are you one of those AS who has social strategy and agendas?

Sorry to keep asking you Q...

Well you have to have a social agenda of some sorts. You can learn something from everyone, if the worst comes to the worst then you have more material for next time. Normally I don't have to simulate a social interest tbh, though I have recently started doing a lot of stuff asides my degree.