1-2-1 vs group conversation

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Does anyone else feel far more comfortable talking to just one other person than in a group? When I meet up with two or more people the conversation becomes very trivial and meaningless and normally the person who is the most outgoing tends to control the discussion while everyone else chips in with odd banter here and there. I always get really bored and switch off as I don't feel I belong or can contribute anything useful. I hate being the centre of attention anyway so I don't very often say much. When I'm talking to one friend I find it far easier as the conversation is usually deeper and more to-the-point and it actually keeps me focussed and attentive. Also, my social anxiety is usually a lot less when it's just one person. I don't know why all this changes once more people are involved.

One on one conversation is much more comfortable for me. In group conversation, I never manage to keep track of who said what, and there's also always more background noise which makes it difficult to understand what's being said. If everybody is talking at once, I just hear... sort of a waterfall noise. I don't understand the words anymore. Does anyone else have this?

From other threads here as well as personal experience, I have to say that this seems to be a very common AS related situation. The group dynamic just appears to elude us. Even when I've thought I was following it, I would usually at some point be brought around the awareness that in fact I had missed something vital. Sometimes it resulted in giving offense to someone, sometimes in my own humiliation, once someone chuckled at the way I sat over at one side talking to myself when I could have sworn I was doing exactly what everyone else was! That one still makes me mad.

Think of it in terms of a disability. I don't view AS as a general disability, but specific traits of it viewed next to societal norms often present as disabilities. So we're the person who doesn't know how to juggle but can throw a ball up and catch it. As long as you have just one ball, you can track it just fine, but if asked to throw even two at the same time, you start to struggle, and without the knowledge of how to juggle more, you are fated to drop most if not all of the balls as more are added. There's probably a better metaphor, but I'll doubtless think of it next week or something. In a nutshell, given the common AS social limitations, it stands to reason that we do better when the challenge of social interaction is kept to a minimum. Whether it's something we could work up to, like gradual weight training, I don't know. The trouble is that the dynamic changes with each unique individual who is presented, so I think we're destined to wilt in a crowd.

Now, does anybody have any survival tips for getting through crowd situations? I find MP3 players with ear buds are outstanding.

Mind you... I don't even like to talk one on one anymore. But it's definitely easier.

I like to think of it in terms of plate spinning, you know the circus act?

Women in particular are expected to do a lot of plate juggling and spinning because...well women are naturally meant to be great at multi-tasking and chatting in crowds right?

Well...not this woman.
I can only really cope well with one task at a time for some reason.

I find that I can just about cope with up to 3 other people in a group if I concentrate really hard. For comparison, that's about the size of my family. Higher numbers than that, I shut down.

This has been especially problematic for me in group-work and team situations. Because I'm a woman perhaps they automatically assume that I'll cope just fine...

But I don't.
I get lots of odd looks.
I've actually failed several group/team based tasks due to my difficulty in joining in and participating.

i also have problems when it comes to groups, one to one conversations are much easier as its just you and one other person so you can concentrate more. group situations are scary as there are so many subtle things you are meant to pick up on, obviously with one to one conversations there is too, but not so much as a group. i feel like im overwhelmed in groups, not sure if it gets any easier the more you do it but spose it could, lets hope so

I think juggling is a very accurate metaphor. The others I use are forcing too much liquid through a funnel - it'll all go through, but not all at once; and now, running too large a program on an obsolete processor chip - the hourglass spins and spins while the data creeps through - eventually the program runs, but by then everybody's given up and left the room.

One-on-one is far and away much easier to cope with generally, but if it's thrust upon me unexpectedly, like someone I know but wasn't expecting stops me in a store and starts babbling at me - that's even worse - I can't think of a damned thing to say to this person and here they are expecting me to light up, chat up and catch up! Balls all over the floor, and my invisible protective bubble popped like so much soap film...

I have noise-cancelling headphones, the ones also used in mines. I actually came across them on a geological field trip. It turned out these headphones are specifically designed to let through voices from people standing close, but filter out background noises. Helps against machine noises (which is what they were designed for) but also against the noises of a crowd. The only downside is that those things are really really REALLY unfashionable unless you're wearing some sort of retro punk style outfit.

I prefer 1 on 1 but only if I am comfortable with the person or else there will be alot of awkward silences. I like groups of 3/4 but any higher and I'm shy and quiet.

You sure said it, and I hate it. It's some of the most meaningless drivel I have ever heard. I just sit there and look at the table or some object in the room. I used to get really anxious about it so not focusing on the conversation once I realise I can't join in is better than sitting there trying to think of something to say.

Fully agree on what you are describing:

Even though I really enjoy one-on-one discussions, I always struggled to understand the value of a lot of business meetings where all seemed like meaningless noise to me. In my mind, it should have been possible to discuss and reach a conclusion on most issues in a few minutes and move on. I however did realise that other people in the room, who are also clearly intelligent people, did seem to derive value from this wishy washy chit chat.

My reaction to these situations was to retract and keep quiet, which was not very effective to improve my contribution or reputation. It also made me question my own intelligence, as I was clearly missing something.

My learning has been that people do enjoy this sort of informal and unstructured discussions. If you cannot fully participate, you can often actually add lots of value by facilitating the discussion, ie:

- help keeping the discussion relevant to what is on the agenda
- keep notes and recap of the main points, write minutes: that also gives you an excuse to interrupt, ask for clarification, or contribute your own points

It's funny, but when I have to talk in a group of more than 3 people, a message comes up in my head:

"Bandwidth limit exceeded"

Perhaps I'm allocating my mental bandwidth more to processing the surrounding physical environment than to the social environment.

I can't help this though: things such as people's watches always draw my attention for some reason.

I thought I was the only one who struggled with group conversations. In general I do better with one on one conversations, though I can do about three or four people okay as well.

My partner does take me to alot of parties, but he has learned that socially I often struggle if there is nobody there I know, and even if there are people I know there, larger settings are not ideal. The funny thing is as long as I focus on him I tend to do okay for the most part, but I am incredibly shy. Sometimes the noise and other stimulas is to much for me and actually does bother me.

To really talk to somebody it really does need to be in a group of one to four, or else I begin to struggle.

Yep. I dread running into people I know. I do recognize that they might find this puzzling. That's the closest I usually come to actual hand flapping, when someone blind-sides me like that. I have many other stims, but I get hand-twitchy when I feel like I'm on the spot, with someone expecting something of me. In a way, crowds are better if you're in a situation where they allow you to just be there, listening. It's when I've tried to interact that I've run into trouble throughout.

Sometimes I do feel like a 5th wheel. But I really try to roll with the punches. Sometimes I'm completely fine being the observer and just giving an occasional bit of wit, which seems like a gem to those in the group since they know I carefully choose my words.

Other times I just make my rounds throughout a crowd, which appeals to my ADD nature. I'll move from one group to another, catching bits and pieces, being polite and saying my hellos and "what the hell have you been up tos" etc... People seem happy to see me and engage accordingly. It works for me too since I can focus on these little micro conversations. Sometimes when the group gets big enough, people naturally tend to break down into sub-groups. I just observe the one most interesting to me and interject periodically. It seems to work.

I can appreciate the fact that not everyone wants to be deep. Its their way of forgetting the problems of the day or whatever. So I play along. Most people just want to laugh in moments like that.

All I can say is observe, observe, observe! Observe until it dawns on you how your groups like to click with each other. Then imitate it. Next thing you know, it starts to become familiar and enjoyable to you as well. And once in a while, your sub group will break down into that one on one deeper conversation that you crave. Kinda makes it worth it at that point. Just think of it as sifting through the crowd. The trick is to not appear needy all throughout. Be aware of your own behavior in other words.

So just don't give up. OK?! !! ! You'll catch on. It may be boring at times, but persistence pays off. Just try to relax and enjoy a personality different than yours. Sometimes I find it quite enjoyable to figure another person out. I find alot of people have repetitive words and phrases that you can call them out on later or simply use to your advantage depending on your motive. For example, I've observed a particular person long enough to know when they're getting ready to say OMG, and then beat them to it while staring at them with the most goofy look on my face that I can think of. It either dawns on them that you're spoofing them and laugh, or get kinda pissed that you're making fun of them, at which point you gently touch them on the shoulder and compassionately say "Hey! don't get upset, I'm just messin with you!" at which point they'll usually cave in and smile. If they don't, perhaps they've had too much to drink.

In other words, observing and analyzing people will work for you and give you an advantage that the average person won't have - most of the time, if you play your cards right. I know it feels awkward, but start looking at people dead in the face. If you don't, you'll never learn how to pick up on their facial cues. Really observe.

I just figure it this way - I'm smart, so I should act that way and use it to my advantage. Its all been trial and error thus far. There is enough information out there to point out what my weaknesses are, so why not take it all in, admit it, and then work on those weaknesses? I know I'll always evaluate what I did wrong the next day, but then I make a goal to overcome it the next go round.

Ok, I'm spent! Later!