17 and won't leave his room.

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Ok, time for round 2.

From what you post, it seems to me that your son is struggling with a combination of social phobia, sensory problems, and a fear of progress which leads to being emotionally overwhelmed leading finally to apathy. Of course it is somewhat difficult to confirm this without actually interacting with him, but from my limited information it is the best I can guess. These problems are probably being compounded by your attempts at a proactive approach. While I cannot fault you for attempting to remedy a situation that you think has gone wrong, you must realize that your attempts to fix things are likely backfiring, and causing additional difficulties. I shall attempt to advise on each issue individually. Since I like lists, I shall convey my advice in a numbered format:

1. Social phobia
This, simply put, is a fear of other people in an uncontrolled and unregulated setting. For example, getting on buses, going to crowded areas, etc. It isnt so bad when dealing with a few people in a controlled predictable situation (I.E. having a friend over to play games). But attempting to go out and interact with a large number of unknown people is a very frightening and difficult position to be in. Rest assured when I tell you that your son is not alone in this problem. It is common amongst many people with autism, myself included (more so when I was in my teens). It is simply put a fear of the unknown. A person is highly unpredictable, involving multiple people increases the unpredictability exponentially. While people may not seem very threatening to you, that is because you know how to interact properly. When you dont know what the appropriate thing to do is you may act incorrectly and get told off, or scorned, or left out, or mocked by other people (especially other children). And of course when you act weirdly people often treat you differently, and not always in a good way. As such, social phobia is more common in children who have gone to a school setting where they have been outcast, mocked, and ridiculed. My guess is that your son didnt enjoy his time in school primarily for this reason. Please be aware that he isnt making this up, and he really is terrified at the prospect of having to go back to a social minefield situation such as school or work. You may not understand this fear because you have never experienced it yourself, but then again you have never been autistic. It is hard to convey exactly how terrifying it can be to somebody who has no ideal what its like to be scared by something as simple as talking to the buss driver.

It may help you to understand the problem if you read this post: http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt97424.html

This may also be combined with a lack of interest in socializing (arguably one of the key criteria for autism). Simply put, neurotypical (average or normal) people are addicted to other humans. Whenever they (NTs) interact with other people, their brain releases chemicals which make them feel good. This is why people get together and waste their time talking about irrelevant matters such as 'man, we sure got a lot of rain last weekend' or 'I see you got a new lawn mower, that working well for you?'. This is also why people prefer to go to stadiums and watch sports instead of sitting in front of their TV and watching the game. Being at home is less expensive, less travel, cheaper (and better) food, and a better, closer view of the action. But yet people are drawn to stadiums and large crowds of other people because simply being around others makes them feel better and enjoy things more. This is also why people will get lonely if they spend too much time by themselves. Loneliness is simply chemical withdrawal symptoms.

Autistic people in general do not have a chemical addiction to other people, or at least a severely diminished affect. When summer vacation came around i would gladly spend all week in my room playing the computer, only to come out for food, bathroom, and mowing my neighbor's lawn once per week. I may have only done things with my friend once a month, but by in large I didnt have much face to face interaction. And I was perfectly happy with this. I wasn't lonely, I really just didnt see a reason to get out and interact with others. That doesnt mean I am misanthropic. I do like playing games with others, and talking to others, but it is because I enjoy playing the game, or I am enjoying the conversation, not because I am trying to get my social fix.

All this to say: Your son may not have any need to interact with others, and combined with his social phobia, its understandable why he would retreat into his room and spend all his time there.

The solution:
Try to avoid getting him into situations where he has to deal with a large amount of people face to face. If you want him to finish school (an realistic goal) then it would probably be best to do this via online courses, instead of the public setting. Likewise, dont try dragging him along to family gatherings, or parties, or shopping malls. He may need to go shopping to buy stuff, but with proper planning, I only go shopping once every 2-3 weeks, and I usually can arrange to go at less crowded times. He is self sufficient enough that you can leave him alone while you go out and do whatever you want to do, you dont need to drag him along.

You may also want to introduce him into some online games which encourage interaction, specifically, MMORPGs. My personal favorite is Final Fantasy 11. I have been playing that game for 4.5 years now, and it has been a great source of friendly interaction with other people. Simply put, most people who come online to play games are just looking to relax and have fun, which makes the environment less tense. Also, the majority of players are nerdy males in late teens or early 20s, which is a more mature, less judgmental group then you commonly experience at school. Simply put, guys are less judgmental then women on average, and the more nerdy guys have probably been picked on, and thus are unlikely to do it themselves. There is also plenty of opportunities to mess up and say the wrong thing without ruining anything. If you offend one person accidentally, you can just black list them (block their messages) and talk with the next person. You cant blacklist your teacher if you accidentally say something offensive. Online games also reduce the pressure of face to face interaction. If you need to take a break you can log off at pretty much any time. Of course you may need to warp out of a dangerous zone, but you can easily be done and offline within 30 seconds. You dont have the opportunity to stop being at school and go back to the safety of your room whenever you want. Simply put, socializing online is a far less tense environment. There is also no tone of voice, or facial expressions, or other problems like that to deal with. Of course Final Fantasy 11 isnt the only MMORPG. Another one which I would suggest would be Eve-Online. World of Warcraft is the most popular game in this area, but the average player age (and thus maturity level) is much lower. If he wants to make a FFXI or Eve-online character, I can join him and show him around for a while.

You may also want to set up a game night. I know that when I was in college, I went out with my brother every Saturday night, and played D+D with him and his friends (who in turn became my friends). D+D is a great game to play, as it is based upon rules, and numbers, but yet still allows you to give your character a bit of flare. If your son is anything like me, he would likely enjoy playing a game of D+D with others. It allows you to express yourself, and play with others in a safe situation, just 4 guys hanging out and playing around a table. Of course the game nights often involved playing Halo, or other such games like that. You may want to talk to one of his friends, and see if he would agree to set up 1 night a week where 3-5 people just get together and play a friendly round of games. That way your son doesnt need to make any new friends himself, he can just go to his friends place, and meet other people there.

If you give your son enough time where he can interact with others in a friendly, non-judgmental environment without forcing him to go out and interact with more people then he can handle then he will slowly overcome his social phobia, or at least manage to deal with it enough that he can do things like go shopping, and ride the buss. He may never enjoy going to large stadiums, but the goal here isnt to make him normal, just help him to deal with crowds enough that he can get through them without having major problems.

2.Sensory problems
These are not made up. When your son says he cant deal with all the noise and lights, he isnt making up excuses. The way an autistic brain is wired is that sights+sounds are naturally amplified, like having a built in loud speaker that you cant turn off. Its like having a migraine all the time. Lights are constantly painfully bright, and sounds are constantly painfully loud. Please dont just brush this off as a minor problem, it is serious.

The solution is fairly simple, get him some sun glasses and ear plugs, and dont think he is crazy for using them. Sun glasses are fairly common, and wont draw any suspicion. And there are plenty of noise reducing earplugs that wont stand out either. Obviously the bright orange ones they use on construction sites might stand out a bit, but there are ear plugs that are skin colored and fit into the bottom of your ear and are thus very hard to see. There are also ear buds built with noise canceling baffles that wouldnt seem out of place.

3.Fear of progress
Simply put, your son is relatively content with the way things are now. He may want to go off and live in japan, but if that requires him to make changes, he is unsure of how those changes will turn out. It is a fear of uncertainty. He knows that previous attempts at change in the past (like going back to school for 6 weeks) have been disastrous, and thus he is afraid that making any more changes will also be disastrous. This is something that he has to change by himself, all the prodding on your behalf wont do anything. What he needs to do is see that change isnt always bad. He needs to experience some change, and be happier/better off as a result. For example, he needs to try playing a new game, and see that he really enjoys playing this new game. He needs to do an activity (like going to game night, or something else), and enjoy it. He needs to see first hand that changing things in his life isnt always bad. Now you may need to start small, for example, a different flavor of drink, or something like that.

I dont mean to sound pessimistic, but you may not be able to convince him to change by yourself. Your previous ideas (like going back to school) have turned out poorly, and as such he may be wary and defensive about changes you suggest. It may be a better idea to route these suggestions through a 3rd party that he trusts, like a friend of his. Have his friend (or somebody he trusts/respects) really talk up and promote the idea. For example, "O man, you really gotta join me for game night, its a lot of fun, and I think your really going to enjoy it. It'll be just me, you, and my brother, and we can play halo, and maybe a game of Risk." And then later on, you can introduce other things this way. Have his friend say "Hey, I saw a website yesterday which teaches all about the basics of programming. I know you really like computers, and it might be something you'd like to try out. You seem like the type of person who could really be good at that, and it might even help you get a job and make some cash."

Here is the website in case your wondering: http://www.programmingbasics.org/ And of course if he is interested you could get him some more books, and then after a while, suggest that he try some classes at the local community college. I'm just guessing that he would be interested in programming, so you may need to try several avenues of interest until you find something he is interested in.

4. Being emotionally overwhelmed
Life isnt easy, especially if your autistic. If you look at things from his perspective, you might realize that he really did try his best, but he just couldnt handle it. When he says things are too 'effortful' he isnt saying that it was mildly difficult and he doesnt feel like it. He is saying that it is exhausting and takes more out of him then he has to give. It would be like you trying to do a marathon every day. You may be able to make it 26 miles on the first day if you spend all day walking and take breaks every few miles, but it wouldnt be something that you can do day after day after day. Your simply not in a good enough shape to do that. Likewise, your son may be able to handle the pressures of school for a while, and then with great determination maybe make it a few weeks, but eventually he is just completely warn out and has nothing left to give. This isnt a lack of will power, this is a lack of what he can handle.

And of course once you have lost all your defenses, it is easy to become overly emotional and start acting based on those emotions. When you start demanding things of him that he cannot do, and threatening him to do those things, it really doesnt help. This only serves to make him too emotional, and thats when you get the breakdowns, and the rages.

The solution:
Make stuff easier. Full time school may not work for him. Part time classes online may be better. Moving off to live in the dorms and go to college full time isnt a great idea. Taking 1 or 2 courses at the community college about a subject that interests him, is a better choice. Also, you may want to give him a safe way to release his emotions. For example, make a rule, nobody except him is allowed to go into his room without his express permission except in case of emergency, like a fire (AND STICK TO THAT RULE!! !! !! !! !! !! !! !!). Let him know that if he is feeling overwhelmed, and cannot handle things that he can go back to his room, and stay there, and YOU WILL NOT BOTHER HIM! He has to feel as though he has a safe spot to retreat to when he is having troubles and feeling overwhelmed. He doesnt need to get your permission, he can just go there whenever he is feeling overwhelmed. And dont be surprised or upset when he does this. If your trying to talk to him, and he just says, 'sorry, I cant do this' and walks back to his room then dont be offended, consider it a good thing. He may wind up doing this a lot, especially when you first start, but thats a good thing because it shows that he is proactively preventing meltdowns. You may also want to give him a safe way to release his anger, such as a punching bag, or if your cheep, just some padded boxing gloves and a sturdy wall. Put those in his room, and let him know that if he is feeling angry, he should take it out on the bag.

You may also want to suggest that he try some cognitive behavior therapy, and that you would be happy to help him if he wants to try it. Keep in mind that its fairly simple and you dont need to see a psychiatrist to do it for you. Just read this link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_ ... al_therapy
A psychiatrist or psychologist, or whatever may have more practice with this but they are not inherently capable of things that you arent. Please dont get sucked into the trap of thinking that you need to pay a professional to do something that you could easily do yourself.

5. Apathy
Basically, he is stuck, I really dont have much to say here that I didnt cover in points 3 and 4. Just be aware that patience is a virtue. All to often parents, and society at large are so concerned with meeting milestones, and developing on time, and going with the group that they forget everybody develops at their own pace. Trying to rush things faster then they can go will only create problems. To be honest, whether he graduates at age 18, 19, or 20 doesnt really matter that much. Despite what society says, 18 is just a number, its not some magical year where your son must graduate from school or else be doomed for the rest of his life. There is no window that you have to get through before it closes. It sounds like he has gone through a bit of a struggle in his life, and could very well have a case of post-traumatic stress disorder. Just try to take things slowly and work with him.

6. Your being too proactive
While this may be admirable in some situations, you seem to be stressing over rather unimportant things. For example:

It is called a delayed sleep schedule. Most people have their bodies on a clock that is 24 hours long. They naturally fall asleep about the same time every night, and wake up about the same time every morning. Most people with autism have their biological clocks set to about 25-26 hours, myself included. I know that if left alone, I would stay up about 18 hours, and sleep for 8 hours every day. I know because when I dont set my alarm, or pay attention to the time on vacations, this is what happens. Its not a result of me being lazy, its just that my body wont stay in sync with the rotation of the earth. I will naturally stay up 2 hours later, and get up 2 hours later every day.

Also, why does it bother you that he doesnt talk to other people? I know you (I assume you are normal) have an urge to talk to others, but why does it bother you that he doesnt have this same urge? If he prefers to do some online courses at night instead of the day time, then let him. I know that when I went to college I signed up for all evening classes, and generally stayed up till 4 am, then woke up at noon the next day. This bothered my mother and I still dont know why. If things get done that need to get done, then stop worrying about unimportant issues, and dont make a big deal out of them.

Tracker has given some great advice as per always. Everything Tracker said is what I was trying to say, I just didn't say it as well.

I have only read the first couple of pages, so I am not certain if I am just repeating others. I am not one to generally give advice to others, as I know no better than anyone else, but I have a sixteen year old aspie son who also spends a great deal of time in his room. I am concerned by the advice given to you to pull the plug on his internet. I have no clue as what to advise you as an alterntive, but cannot see how taking away the thing he most enjoys will have any positive effect. My husband and I go back and forth over this subject from time to time. I always stand firm. All I know is, my mother was very understanding of my behaviors and needs when I lived at home and as an adult I am very grateful to her and we are very close.

First I want to say that I'm a mom of an 11 yo high functioning Aspie, so I have no idea you are going through. What I do see is that he has no impetus to change. I know you said that he hasn't been violent in some time, but is that because you haven't challenged him? I am concerned about your well being, living in a situation where he could become violent if things don't go his way. I am also concerned with the time he is spending on the computer. Do you know what is on his hard drive? Is it anything that could get you in trouble?

Is there any kind of home that helps people learn to function in society near you?

Thank you

Aurea,
stangely it is consoling to hear that there are other boys out there just like my son and yes he is 17 and that is hard enough for him and me but he is also like you said just like a 14yr old and at times a 5yr old. In fact when someone asks me his age I really have to think. His sister who is 15 now sees him as her younger brother and has trouble too remembering his age.
I would love to introduce a counsellor but even if I suggested one come to the house he would go into a rage and complete distress as I have broached on this with him before. He is like you say very very scared.

Toucan -
thank you for your post. My son also cant cope with certain smells, infact all his senses seem to be unusally heightened. He will instant go dislike a person if some aspect of them grates on him - even if they speak badly. He hears it so clearly if someone does not pronounce their words properly.

Claire333 -
I like you dont think it is ever going to work, pulling the plug on the computer, first because I have tried it in every possible way, suddenly and little by little. His older brother thinks I am wrong and thinks that the addiction to his games is part of what has him in this way. I just dont know.

Doodlebug -
thank you for your concerns I do know what is on his harddrive and he it is all still innocent enough. But having said that he is getting older all the time and it is something I need to keep monitored.

Tracker -
What can I say your words are so insightful and you really understand what is going on for him (which I must say I have had very little of over the years).
You have given me lots and lots of advice and I am going to follow through on much of it.

Social phobia -
I do understand this and his fears, but my fears are that if I support these fears I will just compound them for him and they will get bigger and bigger over the years. I am not really a 'normal' socially outgoing person myself and hate busy places and dont understand why people love going to crowded places etc. I much prefer the safety of my own family and could quite easily stay in my own little world everyday. So I think it is a case of the 'apple doesnt fall too far from the tree'. However, I also feel that I must not stop trying to bring him out of himself as I am afraid of when I am not around I suppose a parents normal instinct is to prepare their child for independence. I did read the link you sent me.

Again you solution is one of great understanding and I do try to do these things- like when he wants to go to the shopping mall to get a game I take him when all the other kids are in school and if I ask him to help me at the supermarket we go at the quieter times.

I am not that familiar with all the games etc but I do know that he knows them all and has played all the final fantasy games and online. He was a few years ago addicted to WOW (before anime) and I was so worried about this. Then his brother hid all the online games and it was after this he found anime. I think the WOW game got to a love hate relationship for him where he was bored with it but could not stop. He plays so much that he gets to unbeleveable levels.

I think you may be right about the computer programming thing, again I know nothing about all this but I remember about a year ago he set up his own server (if this makes sense to you) and he manned it 24/7 for his few 'people' then he got sick of their demands, but I do remember how proud he was of himself to have been ablt to work it all out on his own. He often gets people online asking him how to do things and is a bit of a wiz as far as I can see.

There is a college near us that is especially for young people with special needs who have not completed the normal education and they do a computer programming and game design course. I think it would be ideal for him as they understand aspergers etc. I have suggested it to him but he immediately refused and I just dont know how to get him there or how to entice him there I should say. If only he would try I think he may like it and I have told him that I will drive him and pick him up everyday.

I want to be able to reply more to all that you have said unfortunately I need to go now. But again I thank you so much for all you have written it must have taken alot of time and I really appreciate your help.
Talk soon
Julia.

I have to agree there, my parents used to frequenly take away the things I enjoyed(TV, radio, music) and force things I didn't enjoy on me(swimming, going to parties) and all it did was make me miserable, it didn't change my behavior any. Of course, I wasn't doing the same things this 17 year old is doing.

So, are you planning to finish posting, or should I assume that you have written all you plan to write and compose my next response?

I am back again -
Re: Tracker -

Socialising -
my son certainly has a lack of interest in socialising and has not got the drive of normal teenagers to be around other teenagers. That said he does get exicited if one of his few friends call over or he is invited to stay at his friends house (one only) but all this is becoming rarer and rarer as they are regular teens and want to do different things to him and they are losing interest in him.
When my son was about 12 - 13 yrs he did try to fit in with the crowd and went out with them and hung around and tried to dress in the way they wanted him to but this soon ended as he was uncomfortable and found it very difficult but also boring and pointless - he just could not understand the purpose of hanging around doing nothing. Also he hates anywhere where there is alot of people.
Just like you describe. Mostly now they just phone him but it is always to talk about a computer game and usually to ask for his help to solve a problem on the game if they are stuck.

on-line games -

like I said he plays alot of on-line games he use to play on his desktop but these days he has been playing them online on his PS3. I can find out which ones he plays and let you know. I would love for you to get to talk to him (how that is possible I dont know). You are the only person who seems to fully understand what we are going through and the situation. Also I think you are
quite young (dont mean that as an insult but compared to me you are). I looked at your date of birth and it says 1986 is that right?

Dont think there are enough friends around for game nights like I said they are now few and far between and everything I suggest to him is a firm 'No'.
Don't mean to shoot down everything you say, it is more a result of the helpless and frustrating situation I am in with him.

Fear of progress-
I think you are very right here. He has tried so many times and feels he has failed. In fact he often says 'I am a failure' which is really upsetting. But I can understand what he means. I am not giving up though I am going to really try and introduce things on a small level. bit by bit.

Being emotionally overwhelmed -
All you said here is very apt he really has tried and it is too much for him. But now he is back in a rut and I have to try and get him out of it. Just dont know where to find someone who will understand and help me. I am his mum and what he needs is someone else he looks up to which is not easy to find.

Cognitive Behavioral therapy - not sure if I know how to implement this and he will not trust anyone.

Apathy - Again you have hit the nail on the head. I am going to print out all that you have written and when his older brother comes home from Uni in June I will show it to him and maybe we can work out some sort of plan.

His Brother -
His brother who will be 23 in September has been at times a great support and at times a hindrance because he swings from patient understanding and level headed thinking accepting his brothers asperger's to times when he gets completely frustrated and impatient because he feels let down by things not working out. He fully accepts that his brother has Asperger's but he is still in the frame of mind that his brother is lazy and that I let him get away with being lazy.

Sleep schedule -
Yes he always had a different time clock to the rest of us even when he was small - he never seems to need as much slepp as anyone else - he says he likes the night because it is quiet and no one bothers him. My difficulty is that both him and his sister both have Diabetes type 1 (insulin dependant) and he must take his insulin injections at regular times. I cannot let him sleep on and on as his blood sugar levels with get too low, which is dangerous.

I know I seem to be very pessimistic about everything but I have not given up and I always come back and try again. Your advice is invaluable not only to give me ideas but also that you have reassured me so much that I am not a bad parent. I have and have had so many people in my life telling me that I have done it or am doing it wrong and that he is just lazy and I am letting him get away with it. So many times I feel that maybe they are right. I am so grateful to you for your understanding.

How about moving the computer to a comunal living space in the home? eg. the kitchen. Then he is more connected with the rest of the family, while still allowing him to play his games. Then you have an opportunity to look over his shoulder and show an interest in what its all about, and maybe take a turn?

There are some local support groups for people with AS, or family members. You will find them on the Irish AS website, www.aspire-irl.org/

I know your son may not be able to go to these meetings, but certainly you could do with the support from other people locally. Then maybe in time he could join you?

Its so difficult for you cause you are ready for all this to change, but he clearly is not.

A plan is a super idea, but the decision to stick to the plan no matter what, will be the challenging part. All the changing around to try to find anything to reach him, is probably unsetteling in itself for him. You may have an 'extinction burst' type reaction, which you will have to ride through, to come out the other end.

My AS son is only 4yrs, and at the moment we are learning how to break into his world to connect with him, and teach him. I guess the same principle stands with a 17yr old. If you could find your way 'in' that is your first step. Coming to his level, understanding him, and listening to him in a non judgmental way.

Maybe take off your 'parent hat' and just show him that you too are a person with feelings etc. He may respond way better to that person, with no feeling of pressure to conform?

I do feel no matter what you do, it will have to be gently and with lots of encouragement and praise for every effort on his part, no matter how small. It wont be an overnight change, but I do believe you will make a difference. Good Luck xx

Thank you FD.
I have been in contact with Aspire but the groups seem very small and most parents have very young kids but I do intend to try again. The main problem in Ireland is that everything is talk and no action. The services on the ground are non existent. Most families are on their own and if you go to a specialist all they have at their disposal are drugs. Which seems to be their only answer to all problems.
Thanks for your words and understanding. The people who have replied to me on this forum have been the most support I have recieved in all the years.
Julia

You just hang in there, i have sent you a pm, hope thats ok! All the advice posted here has been brilliant. I have certainly learned loads x

You're blaming your son for his behaviours.

You should accept responsibility for your own part in this problem.

For too long you have failed to set out and enforce boundaries, you have allowed him to behave this way. And now you're complaining about his behaviour, which you have allowed to date.

As an Aspie, he's probably a bit confused about your contradictory behaviour. You provide him with an internet connection. You complain that he uses that internet connection. wtf? That's enough to blow an Aspie's logic fuse right there. Aspies tend to take things very literally. But if your son takes all your pronouncements literally you're contradicting yourself and confusing him, he doesn't know where he stands.

And what about meals? You say he doesn't leave his room. Does he leave his room for mealtimes? Or do you worry that he's not eating, so you take his meals to his room? If so, that would again be contradictory behaviour on your part.

You indulge his special interest in all things Japanese, to the extent that you promise him/try to bribe him with trips to Japan. But then you tell him that his special interest in Japanese anime and manga or whatever is too much, and he needs to lay off. Make your mind up! Is his special interest wrong, and he shouldn't be spending so much time on it? Or is his special interest okay, and you'll even pay for him to visit Japan to pursue his interest? Again, you're being contradictory.

Instead of blaming your son, you need to take responsibility for creating this situation, and correct your own behaviours if you want to have any hope of your son correcting his.

First step. Take away his internet connection. Implement a reward based structure for internet use. And stick to it. No exceptions.

Find out about self-help groups for Aspies or special interest groups in your local town or city that would require your son to leave your home to attend. Encourage him to enrol in college and/or to look for a part time work.

You know, you just described a big part of my childhood. My parents frequently contradicted themselves and if I tried to call them on it, they either got upset, refused to talk about it, or said "That's just the way it is." My parents let me have my own TV, yet they'd get mad at me for watching it. Same with radio/stereo/music etc. I came to the conclusion the reason they gave me things was so they could take them away from me again when they wanted control. Made no sense to me at all.

They would also tell me "Everybody's different" and "everybody likes different things," but they also told me "everybody swims and everybody likes swimming, and you will too" which they followed up with forcing me to swim daily every summer for 4 years. I didn't understand how everyone could like different things yet like the same thing at the same time. Totally contradictory.

They let me have an electronics kit one summer and when I wanted to work on it, it often resulted in a fight because they'd want me to on my sister's whim, quit working and go swimming, which I didn't want to do. We often ended up in huge fights over it, which I didn't understand. I wanted to do something educational and challenging to me and they provided me a means to do so, yet often tried to disrupt it. They made alot of excuses for me having to swim everyday, including that I needed exercise. Yet my sister at one time, would sit in her room reading for hours and there'd be times I wanted to play outside and she never wanted to join me, nor was she forced to. In fact, I was often restricted from playing outside as well. I concluded when I wanted to go out, it was wrong, and when I wanted to stay in, it was wrong too. That still doesn't make sense to me almost 3 decades later. Also, there were times when she simply didn't want to go swimming and nobody made an issue of that. I liked these few and far between reprieves, but they didn't make any sense. How come she got a choice and not me?

They also liked to remind me of how my brother didn't learn to swim until he was 17 and only because he needed it for school. I still don't understand why it was never forced on him yet crammed down my throat. They never seem to have any issues with his life, so apparently non-swimming didn't harm him, why was it so bad for me?

Another example was homework. I once went to this school that gave a lot of homework and I always stuggled through it. One day, my parents actually got mad at me for doing homework! I didn't figure this out until years later, that they wanted me to choose to quit that school, so they constantly picked on me about it. They'd constantly be on my case for doing that homework and said if I changed schools, I wouldn't have to do it anymore. They also yelled at me for having to wear uniforms, while the school they wanted me to move to didn't require them. After constant torment, I cracked and agreed to change schools. All of a sudden, I wasn't interested in doing homework anymore, because I thought that is how I was supposed to think to keep them off my back, and when my new school gave homework and I complained, they'd get mad at me. I never understood why homework was wrong at one school and OK at another. They then decided to transfer me and my sister out of that school, and I ended up in a school, less than 2 years later, that wore the same uniforms that were so bad at the other school. Again, why wrong for one and OK for another?

I still don't understand any of it all these years later, and probably never will. I will say one thing though, one of my biggest peeves with NT society is double standards.

I know someone whose 21 year old son will hardly leave the house. He started this behavior in high school and the guy is NT. He has a major internet addiction.

I would say that you have to cut off the internet. When you do, there is a chance your son will get aggressive. This happened to my friend's son. He absolutely flipped out when it was turned off. It's like going through withdrawal.

It is better to deal with this now, than wait a few years down the road. I would also suggest a chore and hygiene chart. Your son must do some basic chores, bathe & brush teeth everyday. My friend's son had stopped doing those things as well.

Well now we have gone full circle!

I think this topic has reached its natural end.
Many thanks to all for the input, advice and understanding really really appreciated.

However would still love to hear back from Tracker though.

Thanks
Julia

I'm going to post, dont give up hope!

Whenever I make long posts about tricky subjects like this, it usually takes me about 3 hours to complete the post, and edit it to my satisfaction. Words arent my forte, so it takes me a while to get them out nicely. As such, I really cant leave a response unless I have 3 hours to sit down and think. I haven't had a break that long the past few days. However, I will probably have some time later today to compose my response.