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Danielismyname
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22 May 2009, 9:06 pm

There's been a very good representation of someone with AS where it's not stated that he has such.

The TV series, Mr. Bean.

The person who defined AS what it is today calls him a perfect example. Whilst you're meant to laugh at him..., he gets along beside society quite well.



kittenmeow
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22 May 2009, 10:56 pm

Zoonic wrote:
kittenmeow wrote:
Zoonic wrote:
kittenmeow wrote:
+1


Wow, that's a constructive comment. Did you have a meltdown or something which made you unable to write the rest?


It's my way of saying I agree. Not with you obviously.

If I were having a meltdown, I wouldn't be typing here. Maybe you should go study meltdown 101.


In terms of AS science you live in a third world country. It's kind of like the same thing as when India discovered David Hasselhoff a few years ago. Instead of wrongly assuming you're right, you should learn from someone who experienced asperger programs in the mid 90's.
The media here, as well as people within the psychiatry, have started to question the need for a diagnosis like AS. Instead they argue "let people be people". But of course you know better than someone with almost two decades of real life experience in how a diagnosis can affect an entire society and nation since you probably discovered AS just a few years ago.




In terms of AS science, I live in a third world country? Probably true.

It's kind of like the same thing as when India discovered David Hasselhoff a few years ago? Don't see the comparisson.

Instead of wrongly assuming I'm right? I have no idea what you are talking about because there was no argument involved.

I know better than (i'm assuming) you as far as being misdiagnosed with ASD for almost two decades? You're right.

What is the point in taking it out on people with ASD? Why don't you go to the real source?

Why don't you go ask your parents? Why don't you go tell the psychiatrists they were wrong?

It's not my problem you are angry nor is it anyone else's problem on this board. It's your problem. Go deal with it yourself unless you have a hair appointment you have to attend to first after your early morning belittling of others who aren't as full of themselves as you are.



AmberEyes
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23 May 2009, 8:42 am

Zoonic wrote:
It's kind of like the same thing as when India discovered David Hasselhoff a few years ago.

:lol:

I'm sorry, but I couldn't help laughing (in a good way).
I was feeling a upset today and that cheered me up, so thanks.

Now I refer to the year 1994 when Germany discovered David Hasselhoff and he sang:
"Du allein kannst mir verstehen."

Which means: you alone can understand me.

But is this really true?
(getting back to the original topic of this thread)

Should we really intrust understanding ourselves to another person looking at us from the outside?

What about a professional or carer who thinks he knows us based on a limited set of criteria, stereotypes and presumptions?

I've always found the idea that other people can supposedly know about our inner lives more than we do slightly frightening.
Do they really know, or just think they know?
Surely we are the true experts on ourselves?

Lots of so called experts thought that they could understand me when I was younger.
I proved them wrong on many counts.

Zoonic wrote:
you should learn from someone who experienced asperger programs in the mid 90's.


Fair point, if a little strongly worded.
And those of us from before then too *points to self*.

Some of us didn't receive positive or understanding treatment.

Which is a shame really.

It didn't have to be that way.

If things had been dealt with and presented in a more balanced and sensible manner, perhaps my family and I would have been willing to cooperate more.

My family were given a lot of leaflets with negative hysteria back then, nothing positive.
My family knew that there were positive things about me that were being over looked so began to question the AS assessment.

Surely there's a way of providing constructive support that doesn't ostracise the kid and promotes more understanding?

By understanding, I mean the kid expressing himself openly about how he perceives the situation, not how adults think he perceives the situation.


Zoonic wrote:
Professionals and parents never learn. I'm filled with burning hatred when I think of other kids being victimized and abused because of their AS diagnosis, having their right to an individual personality taken from them.


I agree to an extent.

This was certainly my experience for many years.
It was dehumanising for me to have my entire being reduced to a negative set of criteria.

Some professionals and parents also don't learn.


Zoonic wrote:
The media here, as well as people within the psychiatry, have started to question the need for a diagnosis like AS. Instead they argue "let people be people".


Fair point.
And parents and families now too.
Mine in particular.


kittenmeow wrote:
I know better than (i'm assuming) you as far as being misdiagnosed with ASD for almost two decades? You're right.



That's what I assumed (for about 20 years) until recently.

Some of us don't know if we were misdiagnosed or not.
When some of us were assessed, we didn't have any choice in the matter.


kittenmeow wrote:
What is the point in taking it out on people with ASD? Why don't you go to the real source?

Why don't you go ask your parents? Why don't you go tell the psychiatrists they were wrong?

It's not my problem you are angry nor is it anyone else's problem on this board. It's your problem.


Some of us have tried to do this already.
My family telling umpteen psychologists that they were "wrong".
But does it make them "wrong"?
I have no idea, given the lack of positive information and proper physical, medical tests back then.

Hence diagnostic no-man's land.

Some of us (such as myself) really do have no-one to listen to us in real life about these issues. They are either in denial, in my case or are frightened or hostile.

Some people make their own problems.
Some "problems" are thrust onto others without their consent.


Again, it's a shame that a label can cause so much social stigma and problems.
Sometimes, it can aggravate the problem and frighten otherwise decent people, away.

A lot of people are ignorant or in denial about AS (including myself and I received therapy when I was younger!). This can't be ignored and other people's negative preconceptions do affect how they view AS individuals.

Perhaps if there had been a more sensible and balanced approach to the subject (I can't really stress this enough), there would be less bitterness and more understanding, especially amoungst young people.

It really doesn't have to be this way.


Honestly, before I came across this board, I thought that AS was a negative thing and a label to be avoided at all costs because that's what some of my old teachers, parents and the media told me to believe.

When ignorance was the only information I had, what was I meant to think?

Given some of the past media portrayals and treatments, I'm not honestly surprised that some people feel very angry on here and want to vent.

That aside, I am pleasantly surprised by the intelligence, critical thinking and positivity displayed on this board.



LolaGranola
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23 May 2009, 8:48 am

What I dislike about many representations of AS in the media is that they always make the characters so outlandish. Now, some people do have some more noticeable characteristics in real life, however, it seems that whenever I see a "person" with AS on a television show or something, they just seem so strange and exaggerated. It goes beyond AS, sometimes.

However, I did like the kid from Degrassi. He had his certain quirks about him, but he was still just a kid.


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AmberEyes
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23 May 2009, 12:46 pm

Danielismyname wrote:
There's been a very good representation of someone with AS where it's not stated that he has such.

The TV series, Mr. Bean.


There have been quite a few comedy style representations where the main character is not explicitly stated to be AS.

Inspector Gadget springs to mind.
You just have to look at the opening sequence of the original cartoon series.

It's probably the best, least hostile representation I've seen to far.

While Mr Bean at times does seem incredibly random, Gadget on the other hand, seems very committed to his job.

At least one gets the feeling that Gadget is trying to do something positive: you laugh with him, not at him.

Even though he is oblivious to social situations, because he's preoccupied with his gadgets and the case, you get the feeling he is trying his best to figure things out. Also, his character and commitment shines through, even though he goofs up a lot.

For this reason I found this series more feel good than Mr Bean.
You get the feeling that you're meant to laugh at Mr Bean's silly antics (because they're so bizarre and non-sensical at times).

Gadget also clearly expresses concern for his niece, showing that he does care about her.

Whereas, I found Mr Bean's "caring" more incidental rather than deliberate.

On the whole, Gadget seems more "with it" than Bean.
Gadget is a caricature based somewhat on real life "The eccentric gadget fascinated uncle" taken to the extreme.

He is very outlandish, but at least he's positively outlandish.



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05 Jun 2009, 5:21 pm

Tahitiii wrote:
I haven't seen the show, "House," but from the descriptions it sounds like your kind of show.

You mean that House has Asperger's? Actually, there's an episode where he gets told he doesn't have Asperger's. LOL
He's just a grouch. :B


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sunshower
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05 Jun 2009, 10:01 pm

AlMightyAl wrote:

Just like me. I have recently been arguing with my parents and teachers a lot about being put in a special program. I completely deny the fact I have it now because of the label.

What I also hate is when they show the most severely autistic person they can get and make it seem like we're all like that.


I don't believe kids with mild AS should be put in special programs. Mainstream school should be fine, as long as they are supported by the teachers and bullying prevention measures take place (but only if the student is being badly bullied). I had to leave one of the schools I went to because the bullying got so out of control - and the teachers and principal did nothing about it even when it happened right in front of them.

Some support is needed for kids with AS, normally pretty basic stuff like somewhere quiet to get away from stimulation during the day (often the library can be good for this, but if it isn't there should be some other space), or maybe assistance with organization (to make sure they don't forget to do assignments and stuff, or get instructions confused).

But I don't think all AS kids need support with learning and academics itself - this is a mistaken assumption by teachers and parents, and the reason why so many mild AS kids get put in special learning programs unnecessarily. I was put in a remedial English program for half a year when it was astoundingly obvious that I was actually advanced in English for my age, but I just had some issue with spelling (because of AS). It was a complete waste of time for me and unbelievably boring.

Often AS kids will struggle with academics and grades at school NOT because they are learning impaired, but because of other factors - like getting overstimulated, focus, being in environments that affect their senses so they are in pain or can't concentrate, or having trouble with organizing things and getting due dates mixed up (because of executive functioning). Rather than providing unnecessary academic assistance, schools should take measures to address the source of the problem as applied to each individual case - which is mostly very easily solved.

If there aren't any problems, then no measures should be put in place just because the kid has been diagnosed AS.


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06 Jun 2009, 8:47 am

sunshower wrote:
AlMightyAl wrote:

Just like me. I have recently been arguing with my parents and teachers a lot about being put in a special program. I completely deny the fact I have it now because of the label.

What I also hate is when they show the most severely autistic person they can get and make it seem like we're all like that.


I don't believe kids with mild AS should be put in special programs. Mainstream school should be fine, as long as they are supported by the teachers and bullying prevention measures take place (but only if the student is being badly bullied). I had to leave one of the schools I went to because the bullying got so out of control - and the teachers and principal did nothing about it even when it happened right in front of them.

Some support is needed for kids with AS, normally pretty basic stuff like somewhere quiet to get away from stimulation during the day (often the library can be good for this, but if it isn't there should be some other space), or maybe assistance with organization (to make sure they don't forget to do assignments and stuff, or get instructions confused).

But I don't think all AS kids need support with learning and academics itself - this is a mistaken assumption by teachers and parents, and the reason why so many mild AS kids get put in special learning programs unnecessarily. I was put in a remedial English program for half a year when it was astoundingly obvious that I was actually advanced in English for my age, but I just had some issue with spelling (because of AS). It was a complete waste of time for me and unbelievably boring.

Often AS kids will struggle with academics and grades at school NOT because they are learning impaired, but because of other factors - like getting overstimulated, focus, being in environments that affect their senses so they are in pain or can't concentrate, or having trouble with organizing things and getting due dates mixed up (because of executive functioning). Rather than providing unnecessary academic assistance, schools should take measures to address the source of the problem as applied to each individual case - which is mostly very easily solved.

If there aren't any problems, then no measures should be put in place just because the kid has been diagnosed AS.


I agree with you sunshower. I am mild AS myself and although I do have an IEP for executive functioning reasons, I decline nearly if not all offers of extra help, I just don't need it. I've had learning support staff in english before for a few weeks when I didn't need or want it, it is also very embarassing when you've been seen as pretty normal by your peers and then some teacher comes in to show otherwise. I don't mind teachers knowing that I have AS because they might have to in some situations but as long as they know that it IS mild, and any application forms I sign I alwyas right mild AS with the mild part underlined to prevent any unwanted patronization.


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sinsboldly
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06 Jun 2009, 11:05 am

how does one determine if they are 'mild' or not?


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MONKEY
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06 Jun 2009, 2:38 pm

sinsboldly wrote:
how does one determine if they are 'mild' or not?


I know I am because my problems aren't noticable that much and don't cause me much trouble with social skills and I have quite a few friends and I can go to parties without getting overloaded most of the time. Also I've been told by teachers and my parents that I'm mild.


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sunshower
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06 Jun 2009, 9:14 pm

sinsboldly wrote:
how does one determine if they are 'mild' or not?


I was told I was "mild" when I was diagnosed. But irrespective, by "mild" I'm talking about the level at which AS affects a persons daily functioning. (eg. some people can live an almost normal life, whereas others are unable to work at all). It applies in the same way at school. Often "mild" aspies don't need the same level of intervention as other aspies, but they get the extra intervention they don't need forced on them anyway (against their wishes; when they clearly state they don't want it or need it); which is almost as bad as no intervention at all.


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