When to give and not to give advice on WP
ASPartOfMe
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Autistics either stay silent too long for their own and others good or we talk too much when a subject interests us. Often we do both. As oft discussed many autistics seem have an abundance of empathy but use it incorrectly.
My advice is that sometimes the best support is no support rather then an attempt at support that backfires. We are often interacting with people who are fragile so the wrong advice could be really bad. For example being a lifelong single person I refrain from giving advice on relationships and marriage.
There has been a problem with men giving unwanted advice and not ceasing and desisting when asked in the women's section. Rightly or wrongly the women's section is open to men commenting and it will probably continue to be that way. Your rule of thumb should be assume the women posting there only want to discuss their issue with other women unless stated otherwise.
There are times when posting on a subject you have not experienced is appropriate. A straight news item relating to women or LGBTQ is one example. Sometimes women post about issues that the apparent solution is gender neutral. Early on in my time on WP before #Metoo to I came across a thread where it was apparent the OP was raped. When the euphemism “rapey” was used it conflated with the advice I was reading. Not having been raped myself and fearing destroying the OP I was reluctant to step in but did. One does not to have be raped to know what rape is. I wrote something along the lines rapey was not what occurred it was rape. The conversation got on point and stayed that way and I did not post again in that thread.
We especially as autistics are going to give unwanted and wrong advice and we are going to stay silent when we should not have sometimes. If as a group we think before posting and not posting using the above general guidelines we will be wrong less often and WP will there will be less exhausting drama.
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Professionally Identified and joined WP August 26, 2013
DSM 5: Autism Spectrum Disorder, DSM IV: Aspergers Moderate Severity
“My autism is not a superpower. It also isn’t some kind of god-forsaken, endless fountain of suffering inflicted on my family. It’s just part of who I am as a person”. - Sara Luterman
Last edited by ASPartOfMe on 03 Oct 2020, 11:22 am, edited 1 time in total.
I won't fall into THAT black hole again.
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Teach51
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Location: Where angels do not fear to tread.
My advice is that sometimes the best support is no support rather then an attempt at support that backfires. We are often interacting with people who are fragile so the wrong advice could be really bad. For example being a lifelong single person I refrain from giving advice on relationships and marriage.
There has been a problem with men giving unwanted advice and not ceasing and desisting when asked in the women's section. Rightly or wrongly the women's section is open to men commenting and it will probably continue to be that way. Your rule of thumb should be assume the women posting there only want to discuss their issue with other women unless stated otherwise.
There are times when posting on a subject you have not experienced is appropriate. A straight news item relating to women or LGBTQ is one example. Sometimes women post about issues that the apparent solution is gender neutral. Early on in my time on WP before #Metoo to I came across a thread where it was apparent the OP was raped. When the euphemism “rapey” was used it conflated with the advice I was reading. Not having been raped myself and fearing destroying the OP I was reluctant to step in but did. One does not to have be raped to know what rape is. I wrote something along the lines rapey was not what occurred it was rape. The conversation got on point and stayed that way and I did not post again in that thread.
We especially as autistics are going to give unwanted and wrong advice and we are going to stay silent when we should not have sometimes. If as a group we think before posting and not posting using the above general guidelines we will be wrong less often and WP will there will be less exhausting drama.
Thank you for this. It helps me understand my lover more. It is so true, silent when he shouldn't be and an abundance of empathy in the wrong places. Today we had a very open and actually quite intimate conversation. Relatively speaking. He is right, he shows me how much he cares when we are together but is lost for words when we are apart. With his ASD and my CPTSD it is a miracle we are still battling on after 4 years.I had the courage to share my feelings today and he did the same. Miraculous for both of us.
I believe men are problem solvers. When women discuss problems they often feel immensely better just by being listened to. Men think a woman discusses a problem only when they need a solution as men often do. So they offer one when it is not wanted Many a couple have this problem.
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My best will just have to be good enough.
If this were true then people would say that I'm not a women (which I am). My tendency to want to offer a solution when someone has a problem is apart of any personality, not my gender. (And it's something I've been trying really really hard to stop doing). I don't think it's helpful to make broad overgeneralizations about groups of people. We don't all fit in a single box.
Yup.
I am sure one of the reasons I am a "troll" and a "bully" here is because I have given out support and would give out advice but maybe that OP felt different about it and assumed I had bad intentions. :shrugs:
But I have learned when I should keep my mouth shut when someone is posting something. I ask myself "Are they seeking out advice or are they just ranting and they want people to agree with them and pat them on the back and also share their story with them to relate?" I still have difficulty knowing but if I look at the responses, I can figure it out but if everyone in it is wrong, well I am guilty then for following the wrong example.
But honestly this forum may not be for everyone and perhaps if they don't want advice, maybe just say so in their OP. Or they can post in The Haven where no advice is allowed. I just disagree this is bullying.
It's been proven that men are problem solvers than women are.
Obviously not everyone is going to fit into a gender role but studies have shown more men are this way than women. Which is why men score higher on SQ tests than women do while women score higher on EQ tests than men.
Plus studies have shown that people on the autism spectrum tend to have a male brain. I think they are referring to logical and finding solutions to problems and having less empathy than NTs and men have less empathy than women in general.
This topic is controversial because I know this will push some peoples buttons and trigger them because they want to fight stereotypes but I refuse to ignore science. Plus people want to pretend gender doesn't exist. TERFs will use this to veil their transphobia. (I am not saying you are one)
But even I have been mistaken as male online but maybe because my thinking is more male? Apparently men and women speak different too so I guess I talk male.
I have stopped correcting my gender online whenever I get misgendered.
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Son: Diagnosed w/anxiety and ADHD. Also academic delayed.
Daughter: NT, no diagnoses.
ASPartOfMe
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Autistic people fit into gender stereotypes less than other people just as we do with a lot of other things.
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Professionally Identified and joined WP August 26, 2013
DSM 5: Autism Spectrum Disorder, DSM IV: Aspergers Moderate Severity
“My autism is not a superpower. It also isn’t some kind of god-forsaken, endless fountain of suffering inflicted on my family. It’s just part of who I am as a person”. - Sara Luterman
Maybe statistically true, but I find this generalization too easy to be taken way too far and become harmful.
ABG already posted the problem female problem solvers have with it.
Men often need a crying shoulder too, and some seem to reject help they need because they find it un-masculine. That may contribute to actual tragedies of boys not crying, just turning to alcohol, violence, or committing suicide
When my friend was dumped by his girlfriend, he spent half a night with my husband drinking beer and just - being listened to by another man who could understand.
Mimicking my therapist, I often offer a third way: an attempt to name what's happening (ready to admit if I'm wrong). It was extremely useful to me, it helps with my husband, it seems usually welcome by WP members. It may seem redundant for people with high emotional intelligence, but I more often than not needed help in making sense of my own emotions, so confusion no longer contributed to panic.
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Teach51
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Maybe statistically true, but I find this generalization too easy to be taken way too far and become harmful.
ABG already posted the problem female problem solvers have with it.
Men often need a crying shoulder too, and some seem to reject help they need because they find it un-masculine. That may contribute to actual tragedies of boys not crying, just turning to alcohol, violence, or committing suicide
When my friend was dumped by his girlfriend, he spent half a night with my husband drinking beer and just - being listened to by another man who could understand.
Mimicking my therapist, I often offer a third way: an attempt to name what's happening (ready to admit if I'm wrong). It was extremely useful to me, it helps with my husband, it seems usually welcome by WP members. It may seem redundant for people with high emotional intelligence, but I more often than not needed help in making sense of my own emotions, so confusion no longer contributed to panic.
Correct communication is key yes. There is a book by John Gray Men from Mars women from Venus who discussed at great length the differences in communication between men and women. In my experience NT women like to be listened to, not all of them of course, but it is a common grievance that certain women have that men don't listen and nod their heads sympathetically with an occassional mmmm or aha. If a woman comes home and talks about how awful it was at work, an NT woman listening knows that her friend is just letting off steam. A man, it has happened to me more often than not, would say leave then, get a new job. A perfectly logical response. I would get upset and say you never listen. He had listened and offered help. It was only much later that I understood this and would state at the beginning of the conversation just listen please, I just need to talk. Is it possible that autistic women are more prone to logical thinking than NT women? For me it is an emotional release to talk about my problems. My NT friends know that they just need to listen. Unless I specifically ask for help.
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My best will just have to be good enough.
I read Men from Mars women from Venus when I was about 10 and came to a conclusion that it's either overgeneralizing or I'm a man... decided on the former.
The most useful message of the book is that people have different communication styles. On an autism forum, I would recommend to generally drop the gender part of it.
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Let's not confuse being normal with being mentally healthy.
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Teach51
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Location: Where angels do not fear to tread.
The most useful message of the book is that people have different communication styles. On an autism forum, I would recommend to generally drop the gender part of it.
Lol it was pretty rubbish I remember he talks about how men are adventurous and like to find different ways to get to a destination. He advised women, instead of being exasperated that they are lost, again he suggested that the women, instead of being angry, should keep it in and say something along the lines of: Oh! What a lovely tree! we would never have seen it if you hadn't got lost. How wonderful! I could never get my head around that one. That said, the book helped a lot of NT's.
A ten year old girl, however smart, would not have a clue about the communication challenges that arise between two long- term partners living together and the dealing with complex life situations. Maybe if you read it now you might find a little more relevance to the book.
_________________
My best will just have to be good enough.
Or maybe not... both me and my husband are pretty neurodiverse and we've developed our own communication style.
Reminds me of a couple - married couple - of my friends, both physicists. They tried couple counselling.
Ended up with the wife explaining to the counsellor, what her huband was trying to communicate, because the counsellor could not understand him at all
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Let's not confuse being normal with being mentally healthy.
<not moderating PPR stuff concerning East Europe>
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