Divided We Fall
16 Jun 2018, 11:31 am
I haven't seen it because I was less interested in Star Wars when it came out, but I have heard a lot of praise about it.
16 Jun 2018, 11:49 am
I’d also even say Rey is impulsive as well since TFA depicts her being captured and held hostage by a man due to her impulsivity, which then leads to her becoming a basically damsel in distress, albeit a more capable one than some before, that needs two men to come and rescue her. While she escapes the room, it’s uncertain if she could’ve escaped the compound due to how big it is.
Plus, Phasma - the first female stormtrooper - was made into basically a joke in the film. Heroes run into her and easily get her to jump into the trash compactor without jedi mind control powers. While the marketing built her up, her depiction is rather as someone weak without more information behind who she is. However, the male “traitor!” stormtrooper was depicted as being stronger and he quickly became the fan favorite.
While the empire was mostly white - the rebellion has many white heroes in it (featuring Han, Leia, Rey, Bones, and more) and the goal of the film was to find a white man who could save everybody. As per why the empire is mostly white - the empire is a nationalistic one, thus similarly to those who follow Trump most are white men. This isn’t new either since the notion of the empire was based on the Nazi regime in the classic films (hence the term, Stormtrooper) - thus much diversity among them wouldn’t fit their ideology which is that of the alt right (partly why many on the alt right loathe the Star Wars films - it is blatantly anti nationalistic).
With The Last Jedi though on that you are right. More of a push that way could have been due to reactions to what I stated above in TFA.
ADDING: many also called TFA “sjw” due to its cast prior to the film’s premiere as well. So while for some people that isn’t the case, for others it was which is notable since at that time the cast was the only thing known about it since it was wrapped in secrecy.
17 Jun 2018, 11:56 am
Plus, Phasma - the first female stormtrooper - was made into basically a joke in the film. Heroes run into her and easily get her to jump into the trash compactor without jedi mind control powers. While the marketing built her up, her depiction is rather as someone weak without more information behind who she is. However, the male “traitor!” stormtrooper was depicted as being stronger and he quickly became the fan favorite.
While the empire was mostly white - the rebellion has many white heroes in it (featuring Han, Leia, Rey, Bones, and more) and the goal of the film was to find a white man who could save everybody. As per why the empire is mostly white - the empire is a nationalistic one, thus similarly to those who follow Trump most are white men. This isn’t new either since the notion of the empire was based on the Nazi regime in the classic films (hence the term, Stormtrooper) - thus much diversity among them wouldn’t fit their ideology which is that of the alt right (partly why many on the alt right loathe the Star Wars films - it is blatantly anti nationalistic).
With The Last Jedi though on that you are right. More of a push that way could have been due to reactions to what I stated above in TFA.
ADDING: many also called TFA “sjw” due to its cast prior to the film’s premiere as well. So while for some people that isn’t the case, for others it was which is notable since at that time the cast was the only thing known about it since it was wrapped in secrecy.
I think the biggest problem with her is that she is a Mary Sue, which ruins her character growth and also ruins the villain. Phasma was weird, they made her so useless. Maybe they wanted to draw a parallel with movie Boba Fett? I don't know. I am not sure ifthe goal was specifically to find a white man, but even if it were the case if probably was for marketing reasons, because the vast majority of the people were white. Also Lucas is white, many will overlook this point but if I were to write a movie I'd probably make the main person white too, unless the story necessarily demanded otherwise.
I don't know about the Galactic Empire but the old Sith Empure was only racist against sentients who were not Humans or Sith (species).
17 Jun 2018, 12:47 pm
Thus, as said no feminist agenda in TFA since it would have portrayed the women as much stronger. Plus no racial agenda in TFA since then it’d need to depict all or most whites in a negative light. Thus, don’t see the “propaganda” in TFA without overlooking several aspects that run contrary. TLJ however was very political and bluntly so.
17 Jun 2018, 1:50 pm
The conversation was pleasant and I had forgotten what you wanted to accomplish. But oh well, let's get back to war I guess? I certainly don't have a problem with that.
You use words like "thus", which would imply a cause-effect relationship between the points you want to make, but you fail to establish that connection. Who says that her strenght is not enough to be there a feminist agenda? How did you come to that conclusion? No explanation. As a matter of fact we see her to a lot of s**t very easily she shouldn't be able to do or should have have much more difficulty doing.
Who said that in order to be present a racial agenda ALL whites should be depicted in a negative light. I also explained to you that these characters have been loved for almost 40 years and it is not so easy for the to put them in a negative light without a backlash. They still did it with Luke anyway.
This being said I never said that TFA is as cringy SWJ as TLJ, but MUCH less. After TFA I went to see TLJ, but after TLJ I won't go see Episode 9.
17 Jun 2018, 5:32 pm
As said to each their own.
I’m not trying to win you over. I’m not someone who cares whether the other person agrees with my opinion or not. Just from everything you put I don’t see a dominating feminist or racist theme, but that’s just me.
With TFA, looking back on it more... and with a more wide awake point of mind (I hardly had any sleep prior to remembering more about Rey and Phasma)... I don’t see it and never will. I do see many people reaching to see that in TFA and I’ll never stop seeing that. That’s just my opinion.
With TLJ, I see feminism as well as capitalism and the military industrial complex. I also see those trying to see a racial “wh***y is evil” theme as reaching given that one of the lead villains is hispanic. That said, I loved the film since I’m a socialist (however, that said, disappointed with Luke dying and wish Rose had more of a purpose than “we win through love” (I’m more of a Saw Guerra type) - I would have preferred her to say “I can’t lose anyone else” since that would make more sense).
As said these are my wide awake views and they’re not going to change. Neither will yours (which I was never aiming to change).
We both have rigid thinking here.
‘Nuff said, basically. To which you will/might reply but this is my last post on the matter so the thread can return back to topic.
18 Jun 2018, 9:40 am
I’m not trying to win you over. I’m not someone who cares whether the other person agrees with my opinion or not. Just from everything you put I don’t see a dominating feminist or racist theme, but that’s just me.
With TFA, looking back on it more... and with a more wide awake point of mind (I hardly had any sleep prior to remembering more about Rey and Phasma)... I don’t see it and never will. I do see many people reaching to see that in TFA and I’ll never stop seeing that. That’s just my opinion.
With TLJ, I see feminism as well as capitalism and the military industrial complex. I also see those trying to see a racial “wh***y is evil” theme as reaching given that one of the lead villains is hispanic. That said, I loved the film since I’m a socialist (however, that said, disappointed with Luke dying and wish Rose had more of a purpose than “we win through love” (I’m more of a Saw Guerra type) - I would have preferred her to say “I can’t lose anyone else” since that would make more sense).
As said these are my wide awake views and they’re not going to change. Neither will yours (which I was never aiming to change).
We both have rigid thinking here.
‘Nuff said, basically. To which you will/might reply but this is my last post on the matter so the thread can return back to topic.
I don't know why you can't see it but fair enough, have fun with Episode 9 and the Rian Johnson trilogy after that I guess.
I am a lefty too but have only seen the casino thing as virtue signalling. Thanks for the polite discussion and see you around!
