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Does anyone else agree with feminism?

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hyperlexian
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03 Apr 2012, 3:49 pm

EXPECIALLY wrote:
hyperlexian wrote:
EXPECIALLY wrote:
hyperlexian wrote:
EXPECIALLY wrote:
hyperlexian wrote:
EXPECIALLY, the problem with your point is that many people no not fit the gender stereotypes, so if any decisions are based on supposed differences in skill level according to gender, it leaves a lot of people out in the cold.


Of course they don't. I don't. And you may not be the kind of feminist who will apply the positive stereotypes to all women(while shunning the negative stereotypes at the same time) but it happens.

No, I don't have prove but I don't believe that most feminists don't know what I'm talking about.

if you don't have proof then your statement is empty.


Yes, I figured as much and have implied that this is the response I would get. I don't like to come to this thread and argue as much as you might not believe it, so I won't. I will say that the fact that so many people can predict what "the feminist" response is going to be before it even happens should indicate a pattern, which should in turn indicate that what people present to you as mere observations without proof aren't total BS. But I get that you probably don't care about that.

but so many people are saying the opposite as well, shouldn't that say something to you?


It says to me this thread is comprised of feminists and people who disagree with feminism,, which it is.

the feminists in the thread are not saying what you think they should be saying, so i don't understand why you are clinging to the same mistaken notions.


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EXPECIALLY
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03 Apr 2012, 4:01 pm

hyperlexian wrote:
EXPECIALLY wrote:
hyperlexian wrote:
EXPECIALLY wrote:
hyperlexian wrote:
EXPECIALLY wrote:
hyperlexian wrote:
EXPECIALLY, the problem with your point is that many people no not fit the gender stereotypes, so if any decisions are based on supposed differences in skill level according to gender, it leaves a lot of people out in the cold.


Of course they don't. I don't. And you may not be the kind of feminist who will apply the positive stereotypes to all women(while shunning the negative stereotypes at the same time) but it happens.

No, I don't have prove but I don't believe that most feminists don't know what I'm talking about.

if you don't have proof then your statement is empty.


Yes, I figured as much and have implied that this is the response I would get. I don't like to come to this thread and argue as much as you might not believe it, so I won't. I will say that the fact that so many people can predict what "the feminist" response is going to be before it even happens should indicate a pattern, which should in turn indicate that what people present to you as mere observations without proof aren't total BS. But I get that you probably don't care about that.

but so many people are saying the opposite as well, shouldn't that say something to you?


It says to me this thread is comprised of feminists and people who disagree with feminism,, which it is.

the feminists in the thread are not saying what you think they should be saying, so i don't understand why you are clinging to the same mistaken notions.


Which part? About brains? That was a random example, of course they're not.

If you mean that the feminists here aren't doing what I predicted, you just did. For proof see my initial comment to Sweetleaf where I make a snide remark that implies feminists will dismiss any claim that you cannot provide immediate proof of.

And then look at the conversation we just had,

I'm not saying I can prove what I said, I'm saying I got the response that I thought I would and that I always do.


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hyperlexian
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03 Apr 2012, 4:03 pm

so basically, you're saying that feminists are good at logical arguments and tend to prefer researched and documented claims over anecdotal and made-up claims? sounds like a good thing, not a bad thing.


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03 Apr 2012, 4:10 pm

hyperlexian wrote:
so basically, you're saying that feminists are good at logical arguments and tend to prefer researched and documented claims over anecdotal and made-up claims? sounds like a good thing, not a bad thing.


If I said that's not what I was saying would you hear me? Because I don't think so.

What I actually am saying is that feminists (many, not all) are in favor of asking for proof when claims that make them look bad are presented ,but will embrace double standards and ignore proof of claims that contradict what makes them look good.

But, as I cannot prove anything that I just said, I fully understand that my argument is being dismissed.


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Last edited by EXPECIALLY on 03 Apr 2012, 4:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

hyperlexian
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03 Apr 2012, 4:11 pm

EXPECIALLY wrote:
hyperlexian wrote:
so basically, you're saying that feminists are good at logical arguments and tend to prefer researched and documented claims over anecdotal and made-up claims? sounds like a good thing, not a bad thing.


If I said that's not what I was saying would you hear me? Because I don't think so.

What I actually am saying is that feminists (many, not all) are in favor of asking for proof when claims that make them look bad are presented ,but will embrace double standards and ignore proof of claims that make them look bad or incorrect in their arguments.

But, as I cannot prove anything that I just said, I fully understand that my argument is being dismissed.

what claims would you like me to prove? i can eliminate any double-standard right now.


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03 Apr 2012, 4:17 pm

hyperlexian wrote:
EXPECIALLY wrote:
hyperlexian wrote:
so basically, you're saying that feminists are good at logical arguments and tend to prefer researched and documented claims over anecdotal and made-up claims? sounds like a good thing, not a bad thing.


If I said that's not what I was saying would you hear me? Because I don't think so.

What I actually am saying is that feminists (many, not all) are in favor of asking for proof when claims that make them look bad are presented ,but will embrace double standards and ignore proof of claims that make them look bad or incorrect in their arguments.

But, as I cannot prove anything that I just said, I fully understand that my argument is being dismissed.

what claims would you like me to prove? i can eliminate any double-standard right now.


I edited, that's not what I meant to say and it didn't make any sense anyway but I'm not asking you personally to do anything.

If you say that the stereotypes about feminists don't apply across the board I believe you, you may not be one of "those feminists", but that type is extremely common.

And what would be the purpose of you trying to tear down the double standards now if you don't speak for all feminists? Isn't that a double standard in itself? To reject the negative aspects and arguments made by some feminists but to try and restore the credibility of the whole through the actions of one person?


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03 Apr 2012, 4:19 pm

if feminists don't all say the same things, then it makes no sense to be opposed to feminism overall. the premise of the thread is sort of flawed.


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03 Apr 2012, 4:27 pm

But feminists are a subgroup of society, and if they're all feminists because they share core beliefs, won't they be saying the same thing more often than saying something completely different? If they were all saying things that were completely different and independent of each other, they wouldn't have enough in common to be feminists.

I accept there can be variances, I don't accept that most feminists are going to share views that are wildly different from each other, This group is simply called "women".


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AspieRogue

03 Apr 2012, 4:38 pm

ValentineWiggin wrote:

You learn about cultural norms from TELEVISION?
You refer to "the stereotypical female". It is YOU doing the stereotyping. And stereotypical isn't TYPICAL.
Let's cut the bullsh!t. The vast majority of American women work. Hard. Sometimes three jobs. Many times to support children which men have abandoned.


Vast majority? How about some stats, plz!

What % of American women are employed?

What % of single moms are employed?

What % of single moms receive child support payments from their baby daddies?



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03 Apr 2012, 4:39 pm

Feminism is stupid. Men and women have specific roles to fill in the home that help make the entire household happy and smoothly running. Feminism just creates confusion and female angst. Why else would feminists be known for their angst?
The existence of two different sexes is a little clue from nature toward roles in society. And everyone knows that when you ignore nature's clues, you're just being stupid and stubborn. Feminism is just women envying the positive traits of men, which is why many of them dress and style their hair like men.

My wife and I are fans of CDD. http://www.christiandomesticdiscipline.com

The truth is, if Eve were with her husband at the time the serpent tempted her, Adam would have said, "You shouldn't listen to that snake, Eve. You KNOW which tree God told us not to eat from." She'd lower her head and reply, "I know, Adam. I just got excited about all the wonderful things the snake was saying, and I lost my head. I'm sorry." They'd hug, bond more over it, and human sin would not exist, or would at least have been delayed an unknown length of time.


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Last edited by Ragtime on 03 Apr 2012, 4:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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03 Apr 2012, 4:40 pm

Ragtime wrote:
Feminism is stupid. Men and women have specific roles to fill in the home that help make the entire household happy and smoothly running. Feminism just creates confusion and female angst. Why else would feminists be known for their angst?
The existence of two different sexes is a little clue from nature toward roles in society. And everyone knows that when you ignore nature's clues, you're just being stupid and stubborn. Feminism is just women envying the positive traits of men, which is why many of them dress and style their hair like men.

My wife and I are fans of CDD. http://www.christiandomesticdiscipline.com

The truth is, if Eve were with her husband at the time the serpant tempted her, Adam would have said, "You shouldn't listen to the snake Eve. You KNOW which tree God told us not to eat from." She'd lower her head and reply, "I know, Adam. I just got excited about all the wonderful things the snake was saying, and I lost my head. I'm sorry." They'd hug, bond more over it, and human sin would not exist, or would at least have been delayed an unknown length of time.


Yeah, those womenfolk, they're just confused is all! Christian Domestic Discipline is part of nature!!


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03 Apr 2012, 4:44 pm

hyperlexian wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
hyperlexian wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
AspieRogue wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
What exactly would gender equality be?........to me it seems that might not allow for the differences males and females have to be acknowledged, and I am not talking about gender roles. I mean of course I think males and females should have equal rights, but males and females are never going to be the exact same thing they do have differences.



FINALLY! A voice of sanity ITT.

I wonder why more aspie women don't think the way you do, Sweetleaf. Seems that many of them are drawn to the more radical wing of feminism and have a chip on their shoulder towards men.

But I think the biggest problem is that they see themselves as women first, and aspies second.


well yeah I just don't get the purpose of feminism.......I mean yes females should have equal rights, but what more do you want? you know. Just seems extreme.

what are feminists asking for that seems extreme to you?


The way they go about things seems extreme.....seems like there is a lot of general dislike towards males as if they are some sort of different species, which is well BS. So its not so much what they want that bothers me as I think all genders should have equal rights...it is the way they go about things.

none of the feminists in this thread have said anything like that. we don't seem to believe that at all, so i am confused by exactly which feminists are saying things like that. where did you hear it?


I did not say anyone did say that, Its just the impression I get in general.....but if I wasn't more or less curious about this topic I would not have posted in this thread. I am open to changing my opinions if I face new evidence that disproves old evidence. I just don't like the idea of 'feminism' as even the term its self excludes non-females.


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AspieRogue

03 Apr 2012, 4:44 pm

hyperlexian wrote:
he is still the father, regardless. yes it can occur without the consent of both parties, but that doesn't mean one party is less responsible. having sex carries a risk of pregnancy. if a person is that concerned about pregnancy, they should not be engaging in sex. it's pretty straightforward.



No, it's not. Also , this line of thought is exactly what anti-birth control abstinence advocates preach to women. Plenty of women wish to enjoy sex without having to worry(that much) about unwanted pregnancy. And the legality of abortion and birth control means they can. Why do men deserve any less? I'm sick and tired of women trying to push the responsibility for their own bodies onto men! :x Since she can abort the darn fetus without the fathers consent, then I say it is SHE who bears the responsibility for pregnancy. Using reproductive coercion to control someone else is completely unacceptable and it's time for the courts to put a stop to it.

BTW, would you tell this to a woman who got pregnant against her wishes because her partner cut a small slit in the condom he was using? Or secretly flushed her BC pills down the toilet and replaced them with a placebo??



Last edited by AspieRogue on 03 Apr 2012, 4:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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03 Apr 2012, 4:47 pm

Ragtime wrote:
Feminism is stupid. Men and women have specific roles to fill in the home that help make the entire household happy and smoothly running. Feminism just creates confusion and female angst. Why else would feminists be known for their angst?
The existence of two different sexes is a little clue from nature toward roles in society. And everyone knows that when you ignore nature's clues, you're just being stupid and stubborn. Feminism is just women envying the positive traits of men, which is why many of them dress and style their hair like men.

My wife and I are fans of CDD. http://www.christiandomesticdiscipline.com

The truth is, if Eve were with her husband at the time the serpent tempted her, Adam would have said, "You shouldn't listen to that snake, Eve. You KNOW which tree God told us not to eat from." She'd lower her head and reply, "I know, Adam. I just got excited about all the wonderful things the snake was saying, and I lost my head. I'm sorry." They'd hug, bond more over it, and human sin would not exist, or would at least have been delayed an unknown length of time.
You could have presented an argument about the real reasons men and women should and do have different roles in society but you've totally gone the other direction with it.

This kind of thing is why feminism exists, I don't blame them in that regard.


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hyperlexian
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03 Apr 2012, 4:47 pm

EXPECIALLY, that is exactly my point. the core beliefs and values that are pretty much universally feminist are NOT the ones you are arguing. you are holding onto beliefs that say otherwise.


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03 Apr 2012, 4:49 pm

EXPECIALLY wrote:
androbot2084 wrote:
If I wanted to be a genius and I had a choice between a highly specialized male brain or a female brain that operated with a massive comprehensive capability which should I choose?


Both brains have the potential for genius but believe it or not it's more often found in the specialized male brain, what I've described is basically an autistic brain as well.

Not all people with "male" brains are male but since they are "male" brains, most are.


My sociology professor told me I have a male brain...lol, because we where discussing the psychological/biological differences between males and females and nothing that was said about females seemed to apply to me. But maybe I just have a gender neutral brain...lol, hey if someone can physically not have a specific gender which happens It is certainly possible to have a brain that is not one gender or the other...oh no and now I've gone off topic.


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